Obama seems to be talking out of both sides of his mouth. In his News Conference today, he said again that he wasn’t going to play debt ceiling games. So which is it?

If I were him, I would use this as a negotiating tool and then fold like “tissue in the rain” too. But I would make sure I got something for it.

Then, when the debt ceiling “crisis” came, I would use the minted coin or some other measure to nullify the debt limit once and for all.

Of coure, I have no idea if that’s what Obama is thinking, but if he is, then it makes sense how he’s talking. He really will fold on the issue now and really would not deal with debt limit games in the future. Could this be his reason for talking out of both sides of his mouth?

Then, when the debt ceiling “crisis” came, I would use the minted coin or some other measure to nullify the debt limit once and for all.

The man has an ace up his sleeve and he knows it. This is a problem because he’s the worst negotiator in the world so it gets in the way of him negotiating against himself. :o)

I’m not an Obama fan, but I think this may be a non-issue. I read somewhere that the Administration’s idea is that pushing off the debt ceiling hostage situation for a year or two just means when it does comes they tell the GOP to go Cheney themselves. In the meantime, the GOP thinks they’ve won something. Now, I have no faith Obama will do the right thing when the time comes, but that’s the reasoning I’ve heard and it makes sense if it’s executed properly. Big IF with Blue Dog Obama.

The whole process is theater. Debt ceiling? What are they talking about?
These are bills that get paid because the Congress authorizes their payment by passing a budget. The entire argument is nonsensical.
I’d like to make the point that Obama is the worst possible first black President.
He has poisoned the well for all those that follow. If people wanted a Republican
they would have elected one. Instead, we have a black Republican who ran as a Democrat. I think he will be the last black president for 50 years, he has performed so poorly.

I really can’t get into the sturm and drang these days. I didn’t vote for the guy this time round, which seems to give a little detachment as far as I’m concerned. I’m no longer angry at him, as I expect nothing useful from him, or of him, whether it be taxes, jobs, SS, gun control, drones, the MIC, wars, secrecy, torture, Wall St., etc., etc.

Four more years of nothing much in particular.

But what Obama is prepared to do now is even more dangerous, that is to “normalize” this behavior.

Now where have we seen this before?

Illegal electronic surveillance; Illegal indefinite detention; Immunity for torture and extra-judicial killing; Immunity for economic crimes (holy crap HSBC!); Revolving-doors & lobbyists (Liz Fowler, Peter Orszag)…the list is long, distinguished, and growing daily.

It’s not that Obama created all the evils he once railed against, it’s just that for short-term political advantage, he has made them permanent, legitimate and bi-partisan.

Well said. Only thing you missed is that FDL believed the election reelecting Obama was not worth discussing. Interesting perspective for a “Progressive” site, huh?

Of course he’s speaking out of both sides of his mouth. That’s his entire political career, in a nutshell, as that’s all he’s ever done.

Obama likes these fake crises. That’s what gives him the cover he needs to kick old people in the groin and still manage to get away with it. So his “caving” is not only predictable, but from his standpoint, it’s bloody well necessary.

Per the framing of Obama (or Democrats more generally) “caving,” “capitulating” or “lacking spine,” I humbly request those terms be jettisoned from the Progressive lexicon. Please see Jane Hamsher’s excellent post on that this very day.

They’re not caving or capitulating. They are serving their own interests and incentives. When Nancy Pelosi (net worth $180 MILLION) says she can live with fucking over the elderly, she means it.

This is a recipe for a brutal fight when the issue comes up again.

Oh, I doubt it. It takes two sides to have a brutal fight.

Even if Obama does grow a backbone

As a former English major, I believe the subjunctive mood is called for here. Thus: “Even if Obama were to grow a backbone…” or “Even if pigs were to fly, shrimp to whistle, and Obama were to grow a backbone…”

the only explanation for what’s going on is that Pete Peterson is calling on the bat phone during Obama vs. Boehner negotiating sessions. the whole room goes quiet and the plutocrat speaks, and everybody follows orders.

Pete says “the debt ceiling must be used over and over if we are to ever destroy the New Deal….only the threat of tanking our credit rating will move people to kill their favorite gov program”. Everyone nods in agreement and Pete signs off.

If that’s not what’s actually happening, then I’ll send my seven year old over to DC to give Obama negotiating tips.

Obama claimed he learned his lesson and won’t allow Congress to play games with the debt ceiling again, but then quickly folded.

I think it’s clear, once Obama realized he wouldn’t get the cuts to SS (I think he has his heart is set on raising the retirement age)he wanted. He folded so he would get another shot at having the republicans “force” him to make cuts.

A note to incumbents: vote for the chained CPI and well……..

Obama invited all the plutocrats over to get their “ideas” after the election on cutting entitlements.

Pete Peterson the Prick didn’t come over.

I think you’re right he has his own Pete Peterson the Prick phone into the Oval Office so didn’t need to make an appearance.

Oh, sheesh, now even debt ceiling hostage-taking fights are Obama’s fault, too?

Good grief, FDL is too much.

You just can’t stand that Obama won POTUS 2x, can you? Too bad … get used to it & suck it up!

Oh, sheesh, now even debt ceiling hostage-taking fights are Obama’s fault, too?

If his timidity and lack of gumption in standing up to the Republicans makes them more likely, yes.

That’s not so difficult to understand, is it?

> Oh, sheesh, now even debt ceiling hostage-taking fights
> are Obama’s fault, too?

There should have been no “fight” at all, just a quick, effortless victory for Obama, but Obama himself allowed it to occur and progress.

> Good grief, FDL is too much.

Good grief, marcel, you are too little.

> You just can’t stand that Obama won POTUS 2x, can you?

Unlike you, I do not cheer for morally depraved sociopathic war criminals who are elected to public office.

> Too bad … get used to it & suck it up!

No. Now make like Marcel Marceau, deauxdeaux.

Hey marcel ,you must be new to the game ,because you are being played for a sucker and a square .Obama used the debt ceiling as an excuse to impose savage cuts on the poor and the middle class ,either directly or via the sequestration scam that the corporate duopoly cooked up for the ,ah ,sheep .Obama was not only able to avoid the debt ceiling the 14th demands the president pay creditors on time .The debt ceiling ,sequestration ,fiscal cliffs are frauds ,false-flag equivalents to advance Wall St.interests .

If yu are a big fan of Obama ,the Clintons and other DLC republicans who promote dixiecrat drug and crime policies along with welfare .SS ,and medicare destruction.then why would you come to a progressive site instead of one devoted to warmongering,Big Brother liberticide and OWS hatred . Sheesh ,give me a break dude .

Any so-called fight is political theatre as others have pointed out. This sort of thing is done not to have a fight or political debate but to propagandize the masses into thinking there is some sort of difference between the two big business parties. In the end the football will get pushed further to the right as always while “concessions” will be given to make it appear as if some type of bargain was occurring when in fact the actual discussion in the political straight jacket of the two-party system is how can the representatives of big business- politicians- manage the people- giving the appearance that they care about us- while sending all our labor and capital to the elites.

To suggest that there is some fight in DC between the two parties that is worthwhile is at this point beyond naive and continues to mislead and ill serve the people.

Maybe people are more concerned with the fact that they are losing rather than the fact that some party elite has “won.”

You make it sound like some grade school ball game and one side wins so that is good, as if it has anything other than a negative outcome for the majority of people.

You seem to be in a sand box throwing a tantrum.

Obama is a war criminal and an errand boy for big business, that’s not difficult to discern.

Hmmmm…almost makes you think there was another agenda at work that was served by staying silent about what electing Obama would mean while reminding us daily (via preferred creatures of the FDL PTB like TBogg and PS) how HORRIBLE Romney is.

I think we’ve reached the point where we need a wiki reference for “Obama folding” metaphors, a bank for bloggers to draw on.
…crumbled like a sandcastle at high tide
tissue in the rain
cheap folding chair in the wind…

or at least a Tumblr page

Nobody said debt ceiling hostage taking was Obama’s fault. But cutting social security benefits IS. And those that voted for him own that shit too.

Wear it proud and suck it up you social security benefit cutter!