a highly political and frankly technically bullshit letter

You outdid yourself this time, Jon, with all those modifiers. Edit out all the extraneous bs and you’re left with the only word that matters: ‘bullshit’.

Phil Schrillo, Dana Singlser and I made decision, based on how constructive you guys have been, to oppose importation on this bill.”

Should have read’Phil Schrillo, Dana Singlser and I made decision, based on how destructive to the sick and infirm you guys have been, to oppose importation on this bill.”

Nice going Jon.

The ‘bots will blow this off and I am interested to see how they excuse this if they acknowledge this at all.

Thanks Jon for put this togeghter.

Yes bot will say he had to do to get the best deal

Obama betraying his campaign promise

I’m pretty sure he has betrayed all of them but the bots will still vote for him

I’ve been saying for quite some time, obama is worse for us then a republican elected as a republican, these same issues the dems would fight, when the zero does it they make believe it didn’t happen

So to get a bill that made us captive consumers of overpriced health insurance, Obama made a deal to give us overpriced drugs. It’s a twofer!

this is even better then you think!

he made the deal so they would support the health care bill, then they supported his opponents instead!

Not true. Obama kept his campaign promise to escalate in Afghanistan, but otherwise you are correct.

That’s not a twofer, it’s anal rape.

Obama brought… CHICAGO CORRUPTION …

Directly into the white house.

The country is being ruled by criminals.

another day another story on the lies they tell us. meanwhile some of those that really run the show are meeting behind close doors in virginia. But nothing to see here folks move along, msm not covering it as not important and lady gaga not there. word is drones above our skies will be armed, which is great because we now know O personally gives the kill order for the drones and seems to like it. So don’t be surprised if they start using US citizens as target practice, I mean there are terrorist hiding everywhere

So let see how this works: drugs are export from U.S. to Canada, then they come back here, still at a lower cost, after Canadians have made a profit. This is absolutely brilliant.
How about forcing drug companies to charge lower prices to begin with, just as every other civilized country is doing. Why twist yourself into a pretzel if you can get better results. Just imagine, the government is kissing asses of PHARMA just to bring the drugs back from Canada. You might as well do it right from the beginning, and dictate prices to them. These greedy predators will never agree to anything that will cut their take.
They have made Washington addicted to drug money.

obots and dembots:

Just a reminder that this was defeated again in the Senate a few days ago.26 Dems voted against.

Roll call

what’s happening in va?

They will acknowledge it with

1) George W. Bush was worse
2) Mitt Romney would be worse
3) What are you gonna do, vote for a third party?
4) Barack Obama has cute kids and a glamorous wife and an adorable dog, so leave him alone

Which ones did I forget?

And I will answer…
1) Wrong… they are exactly the same.
2) Wrong… they are exactly the same.
3) Yes… thats exactly what I’m going to do.
4) Obama.. is a crook.

I stand corrected thanks for pointing this out to me. I feel so ashame for my mistake;)

And I will answer…
1) Wrong… they are exactly the same.
2) Wrong… they are exactly the same

I would respectfully submit that, if you believe that, you’re a fucking idiot.

Yes, the standard robotic responses. :)

Are you an obamabot?

you can’t be serious.

TBogg luvs President Pinocchio. It’s that simple.

5) The Blue Dogs made him do it

6) The President doesn’t write legislation, he has limited powers

7) He had poor advisers

8) ACA would never have passed congress without significant compromise.
Did I leave anything out?

BTW, Sen. Levin was a sponsor of the Drug Importation Bill when Bush was President. It’s instructive to re-read his off-gassing during that time about how vital it was for Americans to have affordable medications. When Obama became President…he voted against his own bill. I will NOT be voting for him if he seeks re-election.

You are a slimy OBAMABOT…

You sold your soul to a bunch of corrupt politicians… and you spout your robotic, never ending fake, BS excuses… and you serve to shill for, promote, and defend a bunch of crooked politicians. You have sold out your fellow Americans.

My loyalty is to the truth and the American people… NOT a bunch of crooked politicians.

Bingo!… 100%.

you’re way off base, that’s exactly what the obamabots do, I think you are the pot calling the kettle…well, you know the rest, or, judging from your post, maybe you don’t

Just because he places Obama somewhere in the top-50 of all-time POTUSes doesn’t mean he’s Number One.

I know but I prefer when they can at least admit they are ‘bots.

clever. :)

That’s pretty evident and he’s one of those at FDL whose smarmy Obama-loving posts are sometimes featured. He also has a group of dedicated disciples who infest his partisan posts and will attack you unmercifully if you should make any comments disparaging his idol.

Obut there needs to be space for The Loyal Opposition. As long as they use deodorant. But not Canoe, please.

TBogg, you used to have some sense, but you lost it somewhere along the way after leaving Table Talk.

Of Tbogg:

“Are you an Obamabot?”

Does a wild bear shit in the woods?

Every time Obama craps on us, Tbogg gets off another hard-hitting column about how many pairs of shoes Ann Romney owns, or how such-and-such a republican is talking out of their butts again. It’s his fave technique for covering Obama’s ass:

Constant shreiking about how bad the republicans are…and pay no attention to the weekly crap-on/sellout, on progressives, by the guy in the White House.

It’s nothing but asking for more of the same, that we’ve gotten for three-and-a-half years.

Praise Yahweh that Jon Walker and a few others on here are not into pimping the “OBAMA SUCKS LESS!”
snakeoil. That “strategy” got our asses handed to us in the mid-terms, and I don’t believe it’ll work any better in November.

TBogg hurts my head.

Actually, Obama’s worse.

On many, and maybe even on most policies, there is a sliver’s worth of difference between them. On some policies, Romney is undeniably worse. Romney might be more objectively evil, but Obama is more effectively evil:

He has dragged the party to the right, pushed certain-to-fail conservative policies (which failure will thus be blamed on left wing policy), marginalized anyone truly left wing in the party, given cover to the banksters, catered to the rich, expanded the drone wars, etc.

Under Romney, Democrats might actually oppose the exact things they support Obama on.

The Democratic Party today is a farce.

Good on Jon Walker.

There is simply NO way that Obama, or any of the people trying to cover his ass, can bullshit their way out of this.

I’d like to see Jon take a good look at that effort a couple of years ago, by some decent House dems, when they were trying to bring up a bill that would have stripped the health insurance robber barons of their exemption from our anti-trust laws.

Pelosi killed it in it’s crib. Anyone who thinks she did that on her own hook, needs to be exiled to Digby’s Hullaballoo, where they can read threads about Sarah Palin’s shitty choice of lip gloss.

Worse: it would have been a guaranteed win for him. The percentage of americans who would have understood what the debate was about would have been in the 80′s, and it would have mightily embarrassed the republicans to have a recorded vote on it. Also, it came in the middle of the HC “reform” (how not to use quotes on that…) at a time when practically everyone was wondering “WTF????”, as Obama and the democrats were caving on one issue after another, and he BADLY needed a win, just to show people that he was a cut above a jellyfish…but I guess it was more important for him to keep his promise to the land-pirates at Humana, United Healthcare, Blue-Cross/Blue-Shield, etc…

It was the last straw for me. He’s the poster boy for a failed president, and as such, I think his greatest value to progressives is to show that if you run as a reform democrat and then govern as a country-club republican, the same voters who gave you an historic win in 2008 will fire your ass, in no uncertain terms.

Next!

Dear mr Walker,this is news? or new?,amazed? surprise? Look at AHCA!!!
look at the mandate in AHCA!!

Pelosi is a rascal with snake personality.Indeed.

“…but the bots will still vote for him…”

Not this bot. I sent him money; a little…and defended him from the Hillary supporters who had no problem with her trying to win the White House by licking conservative butt. When he won big, I knew he wasn’t going to turn amerika into a workers paradise in 6 months, but I damn sure expected him to use those big congressional margins, and that Everest-sized mandate that he came in with, to confront the republicans and begin the salvage operation that would bring us back from the brink, after 8 years of the savage idiocy of Bush and the GOP.

That he checked himself into the Republican Political Spay-and-Neuter-Clinic was THE political shock of my life.
(And if someone checks in with “I knew it all along.” They they have to tell us who THEY supported…)

And that he KEPT doing it, long after it became apparent that every time he “reached out to them”, they were going to cut off his hand and scratch his ass with it, was, I’m afraid, not a matter of political stupidity or fear: at that point it became a determined sellout of an historic opportunity, and for doing that, I do not want him to be rewarded with a second term. Let him go to some corporate think-tank, or wherever, but another 4 years of this lamest of lame ducks, will, I firmly believe, be worse for the country than if Romney wins. Then, at least when the republican policies that Obama has largely sustained and protected, result in a collapse, the GOP won’t be able to point to Obama and his “liberal” agenda as the reason.

Thank you, Jon.

Very much appreciated.

Keep on digging … “things” may yet become ” very interesting …” if not downright exciting during this election unicycle.

DW

I really like this cartoon by Ted Rall. It’s worth posting again:

http://news.yahoo.com/comics/ted-rall-slideshow/

People naturally hate the traitor more than their enemy.

Thats as it should be… because the traitor is twice your enemy.

Thanks to ‘nippersdad” for bringing this up the other day.

If I could catch time in a bottle, I’d have Obama the 1972 candidate and McGovern the 2008 candidate.

Outrageous. This is a scandal. The Obama administration in a nutshell.
I couldn’t imagine that we’d see a POTA worse than Bush II in my lifetime.

I’m sure I’ve read her/his posts but sometimes I wont a mental note on who the ‘bots are.

So Tbogg has a legion of other ‘bots who do cheerleading for bo whenever Tbogg post huh. I’ll be sure to check for his/her post.

Obama: King of the Robber Barons
(Oh god, poke my eyes out, he has no clothes)

the difference between bush and obama, obama ran as a democrat so you get one time “progressives” actually defending this benedict wolf in sheep trojans

one of those defenders is on this very thread

obama got corporate law passed no politician running as republican could have hoped, and here we are expected to pull for him because “mitt will be worse”

mitt cannot be worse then obama simply because we can run more effective d against the corporate theft of our assets

I would bet my first born son that a similar deal was cut with the insurance industry to include the mandate and other giveaways for their support. Why else would we have seen them running advertisements in support of HCR very early on in the process. The entire reform effort epitomized how Washington works and how it is owned by big money.

Might I just say that people like yourself, by which I mean nonsensical false-equivalency spouting x = y dumb-asses who live in fairy unicorn land, are one of the reasons that readership and participation at FDL is in decline, because of your petulant whinging about how Obama has let you down and how he is the worst president ever.

Give it a fucking rest.

If you think you can explain why Mitt Romney is going to be a better President for everyone than Obama, then spit it out. Otherwise you’re just another pathetic loser who wants everyone to join in your, apparently, well deserved misery.

Take a look at the other comments here… besides mine.

You are as out of touch with the American people as any Obamabot or Bushbot could possibly be.

You live in a world where you think you should hire [elect] corrupt politicians to run the country. I dont want any part of that world.

NEITHER Obama or Romney should be president… both would be an equal disaster for the country.

Tbogg, ace Obama-pimp, is perfectly willing to reward Barack Obama for taking a giant shit on the people who first put him on track for the White House. (And whom he has publicly scorned, at that $30,000-a-plate-fatcat dem fundraiser, for which Jane, much to her credit, tore him a new asshole.)

But squandering the clearest democratic mandate for real change in a long time, and the support that came with it, in favor of the weekly cave-in to the assholes about whom Tbogg spends so much time shrieking and yowling, evidently is no reason to abandon this feckless corporatist. It makes you wonder if there is ANYTHING that would make our house-Obamablogger write some direct criticism of him.

As for the personal stuff to which he is increasingly becoming addicted, as more and more of the readers here start calling him out for shamelessly whoring himself out to Obama, it’s only fair that those of us who are fed up with the repetition of “Obama sucks less!!!” get a chance to reply in kind.

My man, you a hooker. A blogwhore of the worst sort, and you are suborning and asking for more of the same kind of shit from Obama that he’s dished out to us for the past three and a half years. If you think that you can keep on with it, and not get racked for it, I believe you are wrong.

As I have said: You are not the Pope and this is not the Vatican. lf you can’t take the stick that you so richly deserve for all of your ass-covering for Obama, then may I suggest that you change your ways. I think that, as Obama keeps oozing to the right, you’re going to have to do that, or else just stop blogging here. There are too many of us who are fed up with your talking-goody-two-shoes bullshit and your willful ignoring of just how much damage Barack Obama has done to the progressive cause, and just to assuage your concerns about dwindling readers, I think that most of us plan on continuing as loyal and outspoken members of the FDL community.

Of course, you’re welcome to stick around, yourself, but if you want to keep waving those little pom-pons, in a blog sense, you better find some kevlar underoos, because, for an increasing number of good progressives, “We suck less!” won’t cut it.

Psssst…as you may have noted from the mid-terms, a lot of american voters seem to feel that way, too.

BTW, Tbogg:

Tucker Carlson is a republican assclown. I don’t even think that many people in the GOP pay attention to what he says.

He is irrelevant.

However, as Jon Walker so perceptively pointed out in this good thread, Barack Obama, and what he’s done and NOT done with that excellent victory that we helped him get in 2008, is VERY relevant to the situation that we’re in.

Maybe you should cobble up a thread about Obama’s…accomplishments…so we can all review and discuss them.

:o)

Well, now, THERE is a brilliant fucking answer. “Neither should be president.”

And yet … there is going to be an election in November.

Jesus. That is so stupid it doesn’t even deserve scorn, only pity.

Since I’m the blogger here and you’re, quite frankly, just a commenter, might I suggest you start your own blog and enlighten the masses as to why Obama is the suckiest president ever. If, as independentvoternews, laughably points out

“Take a look at the other comments here… besides mine.”

there is such a groundswell of “progressives” who can’t take Obama anymore because he is no better than Romney, then I’m sure you’ll have to consider a bigger server to handle the groundswell of like-minded traffic you no doubt expect.

C’mon, step up there buddy. Put your time into something that will really make a difference instead of inviting yourself into other peoples homes and shitting out the same repetitive “corporatist fat cat oligarchy” bullshit that sounds so impressive in the freshman dorms, and ridiculously naive outside of them. So do it. Let’s see what a “real progressive” blog can do. I’ll even throw you a link or two.

But you won’t do it because, just like the PETA or Mumia people who show up at an anti-war rally, on your own you’d be ignored because you’re a joke and nobody really takes you seriously.

But hey, prove me wrong. Start up that blog. America needs you.

Now THAT is some great writing.

WOW

Might I just say that people like yourself, by which I mean nonsensical false-equivalency spouting x = y dumb-asses who live in fairy unicorn land, are one of the reasons that readership and participation at FDL is in decline, because of your petulant whinging about how Obama has let you down and how he is the worst president ever.

you might say that, if you wanted to write something as asinine as your post on 18

you’re a pretty shallow man, and if you think corporatism isn’t a problem there’s not allot to talk about

If you think you can explain why Mitt Romney is going to be a better President for everyone than Obama, then spit it out. Otherwise you’re just another pathetic loser who wants everyone to join in your, apparently, well deserved misery.

the pathetic loser is the person who makes posts asking questions already answered, as if the question somehow justifies his own vile rank, and thinks sprouting insults makes it seem he knows what he’s talking about…pot, meet kettle…again

been answered before but since you’re trying to demonstrate you lack the capacity to retain, here it is again

a republican elected as a democrat does FAR more damage then a republican elected as a republican

if you can’t figure out why, and from your own posts I actually believe you can’t, then here it is

why don’t you go out and hire a quarterback to throw balls on your team when he is working for your opponent

there is no way the corporate swill obama passed could have been passed if a republican elected as a republican tried to pass it

there, simple enough for even a pedestrian understanding, try to keep that for the next time you think of asking ridiculous questions answered tons of times

Here’s your chance, happy progressives. Make your case. And by ‘make your case’ I mean actually make a case rather than keep repeating ‘corporatist’ until it has no meaning.

first, the case is already made, you just haven’t retained it

and second, I (and many) people stopped posting on your threads a long time ago, I stopped right about the second post you made at the lake when I read your vile contempt for anyone who came on because you were featured.

I will not be visiting your threads, happy days for you

Is that your personal opinion, or official FDL perspective, TBogg?

And, you might wish to be a wee bit careful just how you choose to answer that question, if you dare.

Frankly, you have yet to “make” your case, for supporting a President who claims the power to kill anyone, anytime, and anywhere it suits his fancy, all without due process … for supporting a legacy party that intends to gut the social contract, tear up the Constitution, and continue savaging the rule of law.

And try see if you can do so without engaging in ad hominen broadsides.

DW

Is that your personal opinion, or official FDL perspective, TBogg?

And, you might wish to be a wee bit careful just how you choose to answer that question, if you dare.

ooooo. Scary. What? I’m going to get banned?

For the record: the “official” FDL perspective belongs to Jane. I always only speak for myself.

Just as I suspected..

It is simply and merely your opinion

Banned?

No, merely remembering that you agreed that you are subject to the same rules, the ones Scarecrow made plain, as everyone else.

Unless that has changed?

It is up to Jane to decide whether you really are an asset to FDL or not.

However, you will note that it is NOT merely the lowly commenters whom you unleash your cheap invective upon … who are disenchanted with Barack Obama, but David Dayen, Jon Walker, Kevin Gosztola, and Scarecrow among others.

So, if you assert that it is owing to the claims that Obama has not only failed to carry out his clear promises (but also “lied” as Jon has pointed out, selectively decided who may “leak” and who may not, as David has pointed out, and upped the war ante with cyber attacks on Iran, as Scarecrow has pointed out, then it is not merely those who comment, but the majority of front-pagers, on a daily, consistent, and thoughtful manner with whom you are chagrined) and decided he may kill whomever he chooses, without due process, generally trashed the Rule of Law AND international law, and cuddled up to monied and corporate interests, that has depressed readership and participation, then it is a VERY large and significant part of the community who are “to blame”.

Frankly, you should, of your own wee volition, have a qualm or two, or even three, in your obvious belief that you may, with impunity, verbally savage whomever, you wish, whenever and wherever (on anyone’s threads) you wish … primarily because that suggests that you are very much like Obama in your evident and consistent disdain for others.

You might well wish that we all would leave, however, you’ll have far better luck, wish-wise, with all those unicorns and ponies you toss around with such reckless abandon.

If you are “banned” (or find the need to seek other “outlets”), then it will not be because I or anyone else thinks that appropriate, but rather, because your own behavior cannot be tolerated, however “cute” and “funny” you may imagine it to be.

Neither you nor Obama are the “adults in the room”, not because I say so, but because your actions and words (even if Rahm speaks them for Obama) make very clear that childish temper tantrums and whining, that ad hominen assault and name-calling, quite Republican-like, and evidence of an authoritarian mind-set, are not, as it is said a “bug”, but a “feature”, all too often, for both of you.

Now, that, TBogg is my opinion.

I imagine that opinion is shared by by at least several other people at the Lake.

And, as I said, NONE of us intend to leave … nor do we have any need to pretend that you can do anything about it.

Either you play nice, or continue to reveal you own immaturity and thereby lose the respect of everyone.

And despite what you may imagine, without the respect of the rest of us, YOUR “audience” will continue to dwindle … and that will be YOUR fault, not that of ANYONE else.

Now, if you wish to drag my comment back to your lair, a cowardly act, btw, and giggle among your boon companions, so be it … your actions and your words diminish no one but yourself … even if they might make FDL appear less than best example … which concerns me, even if you don’t give a damn.

DW

Give me a break. “Traitor” implies that he was actually on our side at one time. He was never on our side. Obama is no traitor. He is merely a servant of the aristocracy, covered in a creamy faux-populism that desperate liberals can’t get enough of.

My point is that by allowing him to position himself as a “moderate” has enabled him to do far more damage than a Republican, because people who would fight horrible policies when proposed by the “other side”, eagerly support the same damn policies when “our side” proposes them.

It’s a charade. Don’t fall for it.

Oh please….

The people I am attacking are the ones who are destroying FDL from within. I can’t begin to tell you how many people have emailed me or commented on other blogs that they won’t read FDL because of the incessant whining and hyperbole of the anti-Obama contingent who drag out the same “corporate criminal” or “worse than Bush” bullshit no matter what the topic.

The minute they take a post criticizing the administration and turn it into “…worst president ever, I’m staying home to protect my precious soul” is the minute when people just roll their eyes because they realize that they have just walked onto a playground full of not particularly bright children. It’s one thing to criticize, it’s another to sign onto a suicide pact.

I see the numbers and whether these people are actually unrealistic to the point of thinking that Romney would be better or they are just paid (or unpaid trolls) they’re a cancer that is killing the site.

And that is my concern.

So please take your “I’m not mad, I’m just disappointed” disapproval and shove it sideways.

Bullshit.

Pure, unadulterated bullshit.

Conspiracy theory much?

You are the one whose behavior is maligning this site, and ALL that you care about, obviously, is yourself.

I hope your outbursts are not being missed or excused.

If Jane, if John, cannot see just how lame and pathetic your behavior is, how destructive and how offensive to this community and the minimal standards which FDL should stand for and represent, then it is most sadly unfortunate, for all of us.

Disappointed?

No, merely disgusted and amazed at your obvious lack of substance, your lack of ANY concept of social amenity, and your clear inability to hear yourself and how foolish, vacuous, and thoroughly useless your views about virtually anything, in fact, are.

Enjoy yourself, no one else much does.

No one is claiming that Romney is better, just that Obama can likely do much more harm … Romney would not likely succeed, for example, in destroying Social Security, but Barack Obama and his complicit and bought-off legacy party certainly can AND will.

It little matters who wins, except to those like yourself who care about nothing but a childish vision of “winning”, when everything that matters to a civil society is up for sale to the highest bidder, and the people will lose.

THAT, is my primary concern.

I also am convinced that a civil Firedoglake should be the concern of everyone who meets here, including you.

DW

Thank you for your concern, Official FDL Hall Monitor. Duly noted and eye-rolled at.

Thank you, thank you very much …

;~DW

And, you might wish to be a wee bit careful just how you choose to answer that question, if you dare.

Bwahahahahahaha!

Really?

out damn firebaggerz.. OUT!! y’all are like pet racoons what you don’t tear up you shit all over … vote your convictions . vote your consciences .. vote ..vote vote.. .. so shall we all all .. just stop draping a purely civic activity in melodramatic folds of political alchemy ..and dramatic historic trappings .. only y’all give a shit about the nuances of whatever crackpipe your heads are stuck into at the moment ..

you self-styled for-the-moment progressives are the modern day version of the saviors of old Hue City .. in the former RSVN ..sure ..y’all remember .. “they had to destroy it to save it ” yeah .. that bunch of extremists .. two peas in a pods only separated by time and purpose ..

i come here .. to this venue to avoid your whining non-sensical asses .. and now . here ye be also … GFY .

Sure.

Don’t you think it is a good idea to engage your brain before running your mouth?

Let’s see …

A number of people on this post-thread, including Jon Walker, in the post itself have presented facts, as they have over time, presented and documented hundreds, even thousands of times, actual evidence of Barack Obama’s specific behaviors, as well as the behavior of the Democratic Party itself, as well as the behaviors of ALL of the political class, of both, what are termed, “legacy” political parties, Democrat AND Republican, even front-pagers at FDL do that.

Certain other people on this thread have responded.

As is their right, even obligation, in a country which claims to appreciate spirited debate … which is true for all of us until even that civil right becomes too onerous for the controlling elite to bear, too threatening to the “positions” of the elite, to their power and perceived ability to influence.

Have those who “respond” presented evidence to support contrary or different evidence?

Have they addressed the specific issues which others have raised?

Have they sought to engage in honest, rational debate about these issues?

Do we find, instead, attacks on the person, on their intelligence, on their capacity of understanding?

Do we find, instead, vague accusation or even explicit accusation that the people who are raising specific issues are a threat or a menace to everyone?

Do we find, instead, false equivalencies, the suggestion that those who question, who seek responsible behavior from public servants, are acting in thoughtless, destructive, even mindlessly warlike fashion?

Do we find appeals, not to actual reason, but to emotion?

Just as a brief aside, it should be remembered @69, that the Battle of Hue happened in 1968, when Lyndon Baines Johnson, a Democrat, was President. But the phrase you quote, “We had to destroy a village to destroy it” … was originally made by a US Army major who said it, not about Hue, but about the provincial capital, Ben Tre, in early February of 1968, and he said, “It became necessary to destroy the town to save it.” However, both the Battles the one against Hue, and the one against Ben Tre, as well as the atrocity in My Lai, all resulted from the “prosecution” of a war begun on the basis of a lie, a lie that Johnson, McNamara, and Rusk knew, full well, was a lie … the Gulf of Tonkin “Incident” did not happen, it was a lie … and because of that lie many were to die.

“They” died and we died.

And part of what those who raise issues and seek the truth, seek accountability, seek a genuine Rule of Law and seek the respect of our fellow human beings all over the world, are concerned about is that there has been enough of that, more than enough of that … that killing … and the hatred which attends it.

Civility matters, for it reflects how individuals choose to treat each other … it is a measure of ourselves.

Civil Society matters … for without it savage barbarians is what we are forced, unless we stand united against its allure, is what we, are forced to collectively, become.

DW

It is up to Jane to decide whether you really are an asset to FDL or not.

I think Jane should decide whether you’re an asset to FDL or not.

What’s needed is a contest!

Something along the lines of American Idol, but featuring firebaggers instead. Contestants get jiggy with it and post their best stuff. Maybe each round should have a theme like “my most favorist sparkle pony candidate is “X” and this is why she/he is so dreamy”. We, the readers (along with Jane, Supreme Commander of The Mothership) get to vote a contestant off Firebag Island during each round. Those voted off can no longer comment on FDL. The winner gets to frontpage for awhile.

You got the balls for that DW?

You know, and I know, you’ll lose.

At the very least you should start your own blog. Currently you don’t appear to be much of an asset to FDL, just a concern troll/whiny fuck.

hahaha!

TeaBogger Pleeze!

Lets get back to the subject of this diary:

That September, top PhRMA lobbyist Bryant Hall reported to his coworkers in an email that he “had a good call w Messina,” and wrote: “Confidential: WH is working on some very explicit language on importation to kill it in health care reform. This has to stay quiet.”

The president is a vessel, His presidency was not the goal, it was what he could accomplish for 310 million ordinary Americans while protecting the Constitution.

Tbogg, FDL’s traffic is not down, in fact it spiked the last month.
These stats should be compared to similar sites like digbys, dailykos, salon.com, redstate, anti-war, politico etc.
see sitemeter, alexa or cubestat

Making judgements about FDL on the basis of comments and opinions of your balloon-juice crossover fans is not a proper substitute for actual data. They house the Angry Black Lady and her legion of doom, who has spread lies about our gracious host, Jane Hamsher and she has declared it her personal mission is to destroy her.

We can discuss things using facts and share our opinions with each other without resorting to school yard taunts and name calling.

Argue the validity of the ideas, the information presented on it’s own, like grown ups used to – on both sides.

I appreciate your comments and the civility with which you present them!