The headline is somewhat misleading because nobody really knows the state of the debt ceiling debate as far as I can tell. It’s unwinding in the midst of more chaos than anything I can recall on Capitol Hill. The complete leadership vacuum is stunning.
There are four potential deals currently being discussed:
1) Cut, Cap & Balance — the GOP stunt bill to appease the base that passed the House on Tuesday goes to the Senate for a vote today. It calls for a balanced budget amendment to the Constitution and has about as much chance of passing as a bill crowning me Queen of Muldavia.
However, Boehner was forced to go on Rush Limbaugh last night and grovel because the base was angry he was “undermining” Cut, Cap & Balance by cutting a deal with Obama on the side.
2) Boehner-Obama – In a closed door meeting with Jack Lew yesterday, members of the Senate flayed about 3 or 4 inches off of his hyde. Lew was there to give them details of the Boehner-Obama deal. According to accounts by those who were in attendance, the encounter was scorching. The caucus was furiously pissed about 3 things:
- Harry Reid had not been involved in the negotiations, and had only learned about them in the press
- It blows up the Gang of 6 deal, which was the Senate’s big hope for a power grab from the House
- In cutting this extreme austerity deal with Boehner, the President was joining with the House GOP to put the squeeze on the Democrats in the Senate, rather than the other way around.
If the President and Boehner announce this deal, and Boehner can whip the votes, it puts the Senate Democrats in the position of being the spoiler and sending the country into default if they don’t pass it. ”The President is essentially taking the side of the Tea Party over his own party to get a bill passed,” as one person put it.
On the House side, however, it’s unclear that the entrenched Tea Party reps will vote for anything. Bachmann, as the head of the Tea Party Caucus, has said she won’t vote for any raise in the debt ceiling limit, which is why Boehner is trying to sweeten it with triggers that blow up the health care bill if tax reform is not enacted in the future.
The question is — can they whip 13 Democratic votes in the Senate for Boehner-Obama? With guys like Mark Warner saying they would vote for “any deal” to raise the debt ceiling, the answer is probably “yes.”
3) Gang of 6 — as far as I can tell, Mr. Gang of 6 deal, he dead.
4) Reid-McConnell — Reid has said he will file cloture on Monday on the Reid-McConnell fallback deal, “Plan Z,” if there is no other deal forthcoming. That means the President has roughly 48 hours to announce a deal with Boehner. According to Brian Beutler, Reid-McConnell is already written and ready to go:
If Senate conservatives do all they can to delay Plan Z, it could take the Senate until Friday to pass it. And if the House adheres to its own rules, which requires legislation to be publicly available for 72 hours before a final vote — the debt limit bill won’t be ready for the President to sign until a week from Monday, one day before Treasury’s drop-dead date August 2.
House members are hearing that it is Reid-McConnell, rather than Boehner-Obama, that they will be voting on. Which would be a huge defeat for Obama, but whether it’s because they think he can’t close the Boehner deal, or because leadership will side with their caucuses over the White House, I don’t know.




123 Comments

Support this site!
Subscribe to the newsletter
Advertise on Firedoglake
Send
us your tips
Make us your homepage
About FDL Action
So Jane, any plans to write another book?
Yeah, with all my massive amount of free time /s
What a bunch of incompetent children people inside the beltway are. We must take action against them.
Yumpin yiminee!! Obama and the GOP…and the debt crisis. See , when you’ve been “held hostage” for so long , you begin to identify with your captors.
Stockholm Syndrome I beieve………..
This is an outcome I would have never thought would happen 12 years ago.
OT:
Jane, I left this comment at the end of the Cenk post:
I would like to see Cenk start a gathering in the Mall to protect SS and Medicaid and call it:
“You Just Don Not Cut It, Leadership!”
The title would serve the dual purpose of letting our leaders know that they are failing and serve to rally protection of SS and Medicaid & Medicare.
All this shit is going to give me an aneurysm.
PS I think you’d make an excellent Queen of Muldavia, or maybe even the Prussian Empire.
SCARY scary stuff, obama is proving even worse then I have been posting, he now has no shame, he is going to do what the corporatists swant him to and he is not bound to anyone or anything
this is far worse then if mccain were in office, far far worse
we have to do whatever it takes to get him un-elected, he cannot serve another term
Oh Dayen and Walker could knock it out, your job will be to plug it. :o)
Hmm, did Eric Cantor stumble upon the golden ticket?
Republicans would agree to the tax trigger if Obama and Dems would agree to nix the health care law’s individual mandate — an unpopular, but crucial component of the reforms Obama signed last year. This is precisely the sort of swap House Majority Leader Eric Cantor (R-VA) has argued for recently.
Referring to negotiations with Democrats, Cantor last week told reporters, “Every time the discussion started about, well, Republicans need to raise taxes, I would proffer back, then you put ObamaCare repeal on the table.”
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/07/democrats-set-drop-dead-date-for-debt-ceiling-backup-plan.php
Dear Jane
your little visit to Big Ed.really opened his eyes and changed his tune
thank you
Jane will be at this one…maybe Cenk will show too.
http://october2011.org/welcome
It’s like watching a circus clown car demolition derby…
This debt ceiling shit is a bunch of nonsense. It is all just stupid theater, a make believe drama, that is being done for public consumption – the US public that is. The end goal is to enforce disaster capitalism on all of us, and destroy SS and Medicare and Medicaid.
The banksters are not lobbying because they know that this is what is going on.
And, you know, I just don’t give a shit. If the stupid American people what their elected officials to destroy their country for wars and unregulated capitalism, THEN I WANT IT THAT WAY TOO.
Whoever said
isn’t terribly bright. S/he stills thinks Barry is a Dem.
Well, that will be a very important one, but an impromptu one needs to happen ASAP.
Oh NOOOOO. Harry Reid is “outraged” again!
Remember when Harry Reid said “Nobody is more outraged than me” about Joe Lieberman’s endorsement of John McCain, and Lieberman giving a speech at the Republican National Convention? And then Harry did nothing about it? Yeah. Harry Reid is the patron saint of impotent rage, and he has a lot of company among Congressional Democrats.
Maybe the combination of corruption and incompetence has arrived at the point of paralysis? Or is this skit just poorly written and directed? Fortunately we know the ending. Entitlements and assistance to the poor and public services will be cut so that the rich will not have to pay taxes. And war spending will not be cut because – well we don’t talk about that.
Oh yeah. And the stupid fucking debt ceiling will be raised.
Is anyone watching Obama’s townhall?
So if I were betting on a Horse, I’d bet it’s the Obama-Boner deal.
This is so absurd. I must have walked through the looking glass.
Obama, fooled us with the simplest and most oft used campaign slogan. “Change”
Well, change us back to the beginning of the 20th century. I suppose we must be sure to specify the definition of owhat is is from now on.
Here, I hope is the link. This needs to go viral. As always, we thank you Jane! http://www.bigeddieradio.com/blog/blog-details2.asp?BID=640
Anyone who believes Obama has any American’s best interests at heart (banksters aren’t Americans; they’re Citizens of the Universe) is either uninformed, misinformed, or morally and intellectually moribund.
Nice Conrad reference, though.
Galbraith comes up with…THE WHY…the White House and BHO…are acting this way
and only 2000 hits a shame needs to go viral
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-LaWg1KmEA&feature=player_embedded
A phony crisis cooked up to gut Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid…. and still President Obama runs unopposed in the primaries.
If I wanted to watch a horror flick I’d rent Firday the 13th or Holloween.
I love the Real News Network. Watched that clip last night. If only the corporate media…… sigh.
impossible,but it could give ya a stroke,take good care,we are all in this together,and there are more of US so be calm and resolute like Ms.Jane
I would add, that the statement of Democratic Rage is becoming a formality in the way we pass laws in this country. The Democratic President conferences with Republican leaders, concedes to their demands, signals that a deal has been reached, and the Democrats show their displeasure without doing much else. Seems like they could come up with a fill-in-the-blanks government form for a strongly worded letter.
The producers at the major news networks. Nobody else gives a shit what ShamWow has to say.
Rahm was as bad as we feared,and BHO is just pathetic…..i bought 2 of his Tshirts 25 a piece,money that could have gone to birdfood,or some better purpose
Well, there is that.
thank you…i think he read my comment here,the other day ,when i called him an empty 4,000 $ suit
Ed i take it back…i love ya again
Snort!
Everything that comes out of his mouth these days is a blivit. (10 pounds of shit in a 5 pound bag)
They may make decent dishrags. Just a thought.
I’m amazed that callers in to the Bill Press show, mostly black callers, are still selling this “playing chess” garbage they claim Obama’s playing, when it’s clear to anyone with a funcioning brain, this president is prepared to completely destroy the Democratic party. People can still live in fantasyland with the GOP and Obama and think this president’s really “one of us”, but the facts are totally different, this president cares only about his supposed re-election chances. Although I don’t know what successful political strategy says that wholesale betrayal of your base leads to electoral victories. I warned in 2010 that Obama would, once again, fail to hold on the Bush tax cuts, and he didn’t make it to 2012 to completely bail on that promise.
I’ve commented on this blog and others, there’s only one question left; Are the Democrats going to sacrifice the Democratic party for this Republican (feaux Democrat) President named Barack Obama? At this point, this is the only question left. If they side with Obama in the compelte sellout of the Democratic plank, they will render the Democratic party useless. If they can’t stand up for the most important social achievements in this nation’s history, as well as oppose the other deep cuts Obama’s proposing that’ll devastate the already devastated, against more largess for the nation’s already extremely wealthy, what would be the rationale for voting for this party. What, party identity only. Sorry, not enough for me. If you’re going to govern like the GOP, why not let the GOP take the blame for competing the destruction of this nation.
Obama and his team apparently have the idea in mind the left has no where to go in the next election, therefore they have the leeway to move as far rights as they choose. They would be sorely mistaken. We do have somewhere to go the next election, and that is NOWHERE. Before I’d support this President with my vote for fear of the GOP, I’d rather see this Benedict Arnold fall flat on his face and pay for his betrayals. For any Democrats who stand up against this sellout president, they’d have my full support. If we can at least save the congressional Democrats, we can have a Democratic Congress to stop the next Republican in the White House. Because, at this point, it doesn’t matter if this passes or fails, Obama has laid his cards fully on the table, and his chances of re-election are on life-support at best. His kool-aid drinkers can no longer make the argument this president is playing chess with the GOP, this president is now a full fledged member of the Friedmanite, supply-side economic school of economics.
SO, DEMOCRATS, ARE YOU A DEMOCRAT OR AN OBAMA SUPPORTER. I KNOW ITS PARTY DUTY TO SUPPORT THEIR SITTING PRESIDENT, BUT THIS IS NO DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENT. AND YOU HAVE A CHOICE TO MAKE, WILL YOU STAND WITH YOUR PARTY, OR THE PRESIDENT WHO’S SHOWN YOU HE HAS NO ALLEGIANCE TO THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY, CONGRESSIONAL DEMOCRATS, OR DEMOCRATIC PRINCIPLES!
I think it’s becoming clearer and clearer that everything out of his mouth over the last 5 years has been a blivit.
coffee spew……>>>>>>,ya think i could send em back with note saying
CHANGE I NEVER EXPECTED
ive never heard of that….hahahahahaha
I still think the end game is Reid-McConnell, which I have thought even since before Reid and McConnell actually put it together. I think it has always been the end game. Remember what it is: 1.5 Trillion in cuts, no revenue increases and raising the debt ceiling.
There’s a slim chance that a grand bargain that cuts lots more but sets up some easily blown down future tax increase might be it, but I doubt it.
Completely OT.. but..Regan.. when he was a Democrat..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJDhS4oUm0M&feature=player_embedded
My not so sainted Father :)
That’s a tshirt.
You are so right, Naomi Klein warned us all this would happened, unfortunately, too many Americans wrote her off as some aluminum hat wearing marxist. I was not one of the moronic Americans who can’t see two feet in front of them on a sunny day.
It’s possible. But every bad thing Obama’s thrown his weight behind he’s gotten, so the track record for something like your scenario isn’t great.
My uncle used to call Mary Lou Retton “the blivet.”
His electioon strategy is getting Bachmann on the GOP ticket. No matter how bad Obama is Bachmann would have us in Nuclear Armegeddon inside a year.
AMEN!
he mentioned Saint Ronnie again yesterday
didja see this?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v433/diannaruggles/reaganobamaRSsmall.jpg
All Hail Queen Jane!
BREAKING: The perpetually clogged sewer system at the Capitol building was finally fixed Thursday morning by Joe the plumber. “See, this building has four inch sewer lines, but it’s full of five inch assholes,” Joe said.
Oh gosh, and there is an awful pinata commercial where she (or some look-alike) splats just like one!
OMG! We need these laughs. Thanks, all (and Oil) :)
There is a quite a LOT of “that”, Jane.
However, at least we shall be able, eventually, to compile a very short list of those Congressional actors who may, when it really matters, be depended upon to act with honor, integrity, and humanity, rather than blatant self-interest … although there may be some spill-over, this time.
It all depends on the meaning of “stupid” (however craftily calculating and “astute” Congressiional actors imagine themselves to be).
DW
See, Obama is to the RIGHT of Reagan!
I think the Democrats in Congress are finally waking up to the Trojan Horse who is their “leader” and realizing that he’s going to destroy their party ( and their jobs) if they don’t rein him in, somehow.
That picture is wonderful and terrifying and disgusting all at the same time. I like it.
Is it true that the Cut, Cap, and Balance Act passed by a Republican House exempts spending cuts for Social Security and Medicare? That’s my read of the Act linked below (you have to scroll down to read the text). Is it true that it does not apply the same broad exemption to cuts in military spending?
I like the idea of a Balanced People’s Budget. If nothing else, it might enable progressives to reclaim the high ground with respect to indebtedness. It now seems like many of our placards read “Deficit Spending or Die!”
Reid-McConnell is not the intended end game, this president has it in his mind he can make his legacy with a “Grand Bargain”, and pull in the independent voters he needs to get re-elected. Problem is he’s mistaken in assuming he’ll have enough progressive and liberal votes to put him over the mark. Proclaiming Reid-McConnell as the end game shows me you still think this president is “playing chess”, when it’s clear, he’s playing chameleon, as in he’s pretending to be a Democrat, when he’s really a Republican.
You people can continue to try and cover for this guy, or make excuses as to what he’s doing, but the facts are now in. No amount of wordsmith can hide the fact this guy cares only about his political future, and has more sympathy for the wall street barons, multi-national corporatioins, and for the wealthy in our society, of which he is now a member.
“The president is essentially taking the side of the teaparty…”
Great to have someone call him on it, up-front.
Jane, you’re carrying the ball for truth and honesty.
Don’t stop now, I’m gettin’ to where I like it. :o)
Need to start using the term: The Grand Sellout
Kassandra, I think you’re right. I know the popular retelling is that ALL Democrats are in cahoots with Obama to shred the safety net, but I’m not exactly that cynical. I think even a few in the Senate and many in the House are very much rocked back on their heels right now. Now, I’m not saying they’ll fight for what they believe in (that remains to be seen), but I think the surprise is genuine. As many have said, shrinking the safety net this drastically becomes not a single election issue, but an existential issue for Democrats.
Wish the Gang of 70 budget was more often mentioned in FDL about this topic; maybe it would help increase awareness of it. It’s the only approach to the debt that is remotely progressive. I’ve been lobbying my reps for a straight up debt ceiling vote (which would pass) or McConnell/Reid, followed by this progressive budget.
Interesting, since he has no control over that whatsoever. It looks like the GOP hierarchy smells victory in 2012, and will make sure Willard Mitt Romney, the Mormon, will win that nomination. Trust me, the powers that be understand full well this president is digging his own grave, and they have their partners in Congress to make sure he does. You’d be wrong to assume these people don’t know what they’re doing. Republicans are great at winning elections, but are disastrous at governing. It will be Romney who faces Obama in 2012, which means we need to push Congress to stand against Obama in this deal to save the Congress, because we’ll need them to stop Romney when he enters the White House in 2013.
Dang, I forgot the link. Here ’tis (you have to scroll down).
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-112hr2560eh/pdf/BILLS-112hr2560eh.pdf
What a bunch of incompetent (grownups, not children. Children are not such assholes) people inside the beltway are. We must take action against them.
Fixed it for ya.
*spew*
wow i listed Standard Oil (Exxon) actually paid taxes then
Why does everyone have to have a Gang? Don’t we spend gobs of Homeland Security money on task forces to stop Gangs?
Oh tanbark, we’ve been through so much over the years. Where would we be without each other?
;)
hahahahahahahahahahaa
I said ‘on the ticket’. She could be VP. And if Cheney is any guide, who knows. I think that guy was actually running the Bush Administration. And why wouldn’t he have control over it? He has quite obviously joined the Republican Party, I am sure he gets some sway now.
I keep expecting to see a presidential news conference where Bullwinkle says “Look Rocky, watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat” and then the lion eats us all.
Next time the party asks for a donation, tell them “no” and say that all your hard earned pennies have to go into a fund for what little future you have left.
short and sweet,well sour…but short anywhoo!
At about 10:45 a.m. this morning, by simple-majority vote, the Senate tabled (killed) the Cut, Cap, Balance Bill that Harry Reid had announced Wednesday and Thursday that the Senate would be taking its first vote on (via a Democratic cloture motion) Saturday morning.
Reid had delayed until Thursday making his motion to proceed to Cut, Cap, Balance, in order to arrange for that Saturday vote, in lieu of the Friday vote that would otherwise have occurred. But now, Reid announced this morning, Friday, there will be no more votes in the Senate until Monday, at around 5:00 p.m. (subject unknown).
According to a couple of Republicans speaking on the floor yesterday and today, the vote this morning was partly due to some Democrats privately insisting on not missing appointments elsewhere this weekend. True or not, the headlines about the Senate “working this weekend” need to be revoked, because the Senate will in fact not be working this weekend.
At 11:00 a.m. today, according to Reid on the floor just before 11, he and Mitch McConnell will be meeting behind closed doors with the Gang of Six. Reid also said that he personally did not know what was going on between Obama and Boehner (he is not a part of their discussions), but indicated that whatever it is, he will be doing his best to shove it through the Senate, unquestioned. That unknown deal is what Reid has idled the Senate for, and is now waiting to be handed.
So Harry Reid and every member of his Democratic/Independent Caucus voted in lockstep this morning to prevent productive debate on Reid’s motion to proceed to Cut, Cap, Balance, by removing it from the Senate’s agenda (“tabling” it, 51-46). The Senate will therefore be idling for the rest of the day, before adjourning for the weekend. Reid’s claimed motivation for tabling the bill today was to prove to the House of Representatives that Cut, Cap, Balance had no chance in the Senate, and that they must therefore knuckle under to whatever Obama/Boehner force upon them at the last minute, as Harry Reid, without resistance from Senators, is planning to force on the Senate in turn.
I find this total abdication of duty and responsibility by Democratic Senators – deferring completely and utterly to the Executive Branch, and to its hired-hand “Majority Leader” in the Senate – despicable. Thankfully, a couple of Senators put some of my sentiments into words last evening – though they’re Republicans, and probably won’t actually act on their rhetoric:
I think they act like children. They throw tantrums, some of them even cry, and the Congress is like one big toy store to them and everything in it is free for the asking
Mad’: I’m mad too, but the notion that Obama is protecting his “legacy” by sustaining and even increasing, in some cases, the republican policies which, unspinnably, have dumped us in the shitter, just won’t wash.
Did he protect his legacy by dragging the party into a total ass-kicking just two years after he won an historic victory over McCain and the republicans?
Do you think his “big win” with the “healthcare reform” bill that was essentially written by the robber-barons at United Healthcare, Wellpoint, Humana, etc., is going to work to drive down healthcare costs and protect most americans from these predatory bastards?
Is his fine legacy going to be about how he ended the two clusterfucks in Iraq and Afghanistan, and didn’t create any more? If so, I submit that he’s going about it the wrong way.
I think he’s in two minds:
He just didn’t have the smarts to understand that either he went to the mat with the republicans and made confronting them the base of his new (and politically powerful) administration, or he’s going down as that posterboy for a failed preznint.
And, more and more, he just seems willing to whore himself out to any idea, any policy, that will protect the status quo of corporate ownership of the country.
With apologies to Neill Sheehan, I don’t think that’s going to lead to a “bright, shining” legacy.
That 2400 is just on YouTube. RealNews Network is very popular worldwide.
Only a coincidence that at his presser he said he doesn’t watch cable news or read The Hill?
Everyone loves the Lake!
my DEAR friends i will be writing a diary this afternoon,on SANDCRANES…which will be targeted for DEATH in Kentucky if not stopped…
PLEASE look for the diary and sign the petition
as these gorgeous birds DO NOT deserve that plight..
THEY MATE FOR LIFE
if one is killed the other will die of sadness
thanks to all nature lovers
critter lovers
The Democrats are the worst enemies of working people. The GOP says what it stands for. The Democrats use Trojan Horse politics to attack the American people and implement GOP programs, i.e., shove the financiers shock doctrine and militarist dreams of world empire down Americans throats.
Obama is a perfect Trojan Horse. Neutralize black voters by making them think one of theirs (i.e., pro-black people and progressive) is in the White House. Neutralize Democratic “liberals” or “progressives” whose knee-jerk political instincts are based on bankrupt lesser-evil partisan politics.
We have no party in this game. They neutralized the labor movement long ago by driving out reds by using the mob. Now the labor movement has been reduced to near irrelevancy, with the attacks in Wisconsin and Ohio diverted into mere show demonstrations and useless electoralism.
I don’t know how we get there, but we need a new political party that will fight for the needs of working people and not bankers and the Pentagon. The coming political period puts this clearly on the agenda, as the immiseration of the country continues apace. Failure to somehow achieve this will ultimately also lead to another world war, as the militarist agenda amps up, secure in their knowledge that domestic dissent and competing domestic agendas do not threaten their program. That program is to defeat their international rivals and subdue the planet to the control of U.S. corporations and their allies.
Diane Feinstein DIFI saying this is not a good time to do a debt deal, = just raise the debt ceiling and get out of here ASAP.
DiFi has seen the future, and OBAMA is not in it.
DiFi statements are a better barometer of the hate of OBAMA in the Senate.
Last night Barney Frank, my a sly remark about he was disgusted about how
Obama pick someone beside Elizabeth Warren to run the CPB.
The Obama WH is starting to leak like the Titantic, also says people see the end of OBAMA coming and are seeking life boats.
“some WH official told the entire encounter with Harry Reid not good for the WH”
Dems are running for the hills, and they should, Obama has all but loss the Dem Base.
Ed and KO attack OBAMA like he was Bush Jr. last night.
KO went beyond debt ceiling to secret CIA prisons OBAMA is running in Somalia, me thinks the OBAMA WH did not like this.
Ed almost had too attack OBAMA , because MSNBC can’t afford for Cenk to be right about their so call liberal network. For LOL out loud Cenk got ED a new Tone. MSNBC don’t want to look like the WH mouth piece, can’t have everyone talking like LODO, Chucky todd, Chris,
Plus MSNBC may see the future and the future may have Cenk joining KO over at current.
Yet again FDL was way out on front, on calling OBAMA a Trojan Horse.
I expect we will soon see Dems on the hill questioning Obama loyalty to the Democratic Party. Obama better get some knee pads, he is about to see the bottom of the bus.
You all should check out rt.com
They cover a decidely liberal slant. I never would have thought Russians to be liberal?!
Good programming and news though.
oh good,because i just could NOT fathom,what the heck was going on with BHO,but that Galbraith explanation,satisfies my curiosity….
didja get any we Hbirds to show up
i did by putting baskets of red flowers near the nectar
cute little choppers are’nt they?
So powwow, do you think that our “volcanic Dem Senators” are just putting on another show? So that when O and The Tan Man hand them their Grand Bargain, the Dem Senators will turn to their constituents and claim, “we were so angry, but what could we do, we had to vote for it”?
This whole situation is too depressing to contemplate. Congressional Dems have the power to stop Billion Dollar Obama, but they refuse to use it.
If we’re not going to have a democracy anyway, how ’bout we get rid of Congress altogether. That would provide the most useful budget cut of all ; )
I know, Hon.
A hell of a ride, aint it. :o)
An, it’s looking like it’s just starting to get really, really, interesting, in some bad and chaotic ways.
You and your blog are fighting the good fight, better than anyone else…it’s just that Mr. Centrist monkeywrenching the entire progressive agenda, over and over again, and blowing a great opportunity, is disheartening, to say the least.
But you’re a peach. A smart, tough, peach. :o)
Pray, continue. :o)
Let me propose a fifth plan:
5) Let’s call the whole thing off. It’s all been 100% bluff, on all sides, all along, because the effective debt ceiling rises to whatever is needed to cover all the legal obligations of the US that tax revenues can’t cover.
The administration isn’t going to like having to ignore even a merely formal legal requirement — as it will have to do to meet the real legal requirement to honor all of the nation’s legal obligations — but it really won’t have any viable alternative if the national debt is allowed to bump into the ceiling. Ignoring the real obligations to spend what legislation says must be spent would subject administration officials to the threat of lawsuits from injured parties (and you would have to search far and wide to find someone in the US not substantially injured if the US were to default on the 45% of its obligations that aren’t met by tax revenue), while ignoring the ceiling would leave only the Congress with any cause to sue (and it probably wouldn’t be granted cert). If the administration ignores the ceiling, it can claim a plausible alternative authorization to keep borrowing in every spending bill passed by Congress, but there is no law on the books giving the administration the auhtority to broker spending obligations, to decide who gets paid and who doesn’t if the US can only meet 45% of its obligations.
This is basic Civics. Public spending can happen only by authorization of a public law, which, in this country, requires a majority of both chambers of the legislature (supermajorities if the president vetoes, of course). Public spending can only be lowered by getting those bicameral majorities to pass public laws lowering spending. It can’t be lowered by the unilateral action of one chamber, as it would be if we were to falsely imagine that the debt ceiling law was either intended to allow such unicameral law-making power, or unintentionally created such a power.
So let’s call the whole thing off. The debt ceiing law’s only actual effect is to act as sort of an alarm clock for Congress, to formally remind it of the size of the national debt, in case that size would prompt a bicameral majority to take action to lower spending and/or increase tax revenues. If Congress chooses to do nothing about that alarm clock’s signal — if there isn’t the needed consensus that exceeding the totally arbitrary ceiling the alarm clock was set to actually requires action, or if there is no agreement about what action to take even if most think the level of debt does require action — then the effect is that nothing happens to interrupt the course of business as usual. Previously obligated spending is covered by new borrowing up to the limit of whatever is required by laws that obligated spending.
We go on to the next chapter in the continuing saga of the House R’s attempt to assert unicameral legislative power by inventing veto points where none actually exist. We go on to the end of the fiscal year, and the next great fake crisis, this time over the annual appropriations bills. Rinse, recycle and repeat, right up until the country decides to either call off this particular House majority, or call off letting a systematically passive-aggressive legislature have any real power. It’s not clear which will happen, maybe both.
Scahill is awesome. KO, was just kind enough to have him on his show. I sure hope that guy doesn’t get killed. He goes into some extremely fucking dangerous places and finds out stuff ‘civilized’ interests back home do not want him anyone to know about. I can’t think of a better way tom commit suicide though.
need a war with Iran, which may be coming in the fall according to Mr. Baer.
The Democrats are the worst enemies of working people. The GOP says what it stands for. The Democrats use Trojan Horse politics to attack the American people and implement GOP programs, i.e., shove the financiers shock doctrine and militarist dreams of world empire down Americans throats.
———————-
so true,so vile
the media does the rinse,lather repeat
TRUE EVIL..has come to America,and murder and suicide..are at record levels
we have so much work to do
The teabaggers are getting what they want: no government.
Jane, you sound tired. This one is getting to you, isn’t it?
I like it… been calling Big Zero O’Sellout for years.
We will watch for it. Breaks my heart, what we continue to do to this planet and its fragile ecosystems, and to ourselves.
Anyone feeling like taking a positive progressive step should be sending a bit of cash to FDL to support Action plans. If you happen to be in WI, One WI Now is producing social media ads to take back the Republican controlled State Senate, one recall candidate at a time.
Between the two I put up a week’s grocery money, but I’m fortunate enough that my garden is producing a bit of food at the moment.
$$$ seems to be the only thing being listened to these days.
Sadly, it’s looking like his political agenda is to leave NO republican ass unkissed.
In the “you can’t top this!” category (there’s a new one, every week), a few days ago, he said he couldn’t be too critical of big bidness, because it might give Wall Street heart-palpitations. It was another “last straw” for me.
Would you like a few? I have a box full off them.
“Need a war with Iran…
I don’t thinnnnk so.
Evening video footage of one oil tanker on fire in the Straits of Hormuz, and the price of a barrel of dead dinosaurs will go to a place that will make Wall Street look like a petrie dish for chaos theory.
It’s all about money and the support of Wall Street, Bankers, and Big Business. Any opposition to Obad would have to be financed through individual donations, so it’s your $20 times the progressive donor base against people who count incomes in seven digits.
A good post, Jed.
I think that we may see the earliest defections from a sitting president, in memory.
At this point, a CYOA political situation, as sad as it is, after the opportunity that Obama has squandered, is the first step in dis-rewarding him from getting nominated for a second term.
They’ve been hunting Sandhill Cranes in Kansas since 1993, and Montana is about to authorize permits for this coming fall. So Kentucky isn’t the only place they’re under assault.
Sick.
Don’t know about you, but I’m not holed up with a troupe of survivalist militia, so I’m also essentially beholden and dependent on that Trinity.
Something has occurred to me.
Obama has, almost single-handedly, put the republicans in the delicious position of savaging him while he has:
A: Done miraculous rehab on them.
B: Sustained, or ratcheted up, their most-loved policies, culminating now in moving them within striking distance of their long-running wet dream of getting their grubby little hands on the Social Security lockbox.
(I don’t think they really want to destroy SS; they want to use it to underwrite the great floating crap game on Wall Street. Bush couldn’t quite manage it; Obama’s chances look a lot better.)
As usual, I totally agree with you. I caught the Barney Frank jab on Rachel last night. She may be the next to go. She is but a memory of the firebrand she was on AM….no outing of corporate scumbags any more with her show.
Today with the last question of the town meeting potus bent the time space continuum in calling the 1937 capitulation of Roosevelt (who he called a fiscal conservative)to a conservative approach to the depression, without mentioning it was pressure from the fucking republicans that made him adopt policies that would continue the depression until WWII.
And:
Gold! Boldly going where no mine-canary for future prospects for amurka, has ever gone before.
i know….but a wee cry in the woods….please stop them
If only . . .
Isn’t it strange?
Our few media spokespersons, being de-fanged, or de-fanging themselves, almost as we post.
It’s getting a bit like a political convention, where the winner is stampeding his opponents into jumping on his bandwagon.
I guess we shouldn’t be surprised at network people running for cover, when a sitting president who came in with the political equivalent of an Abrams tank, happily trades it in for a clown-car full of “bipartisan” democrats.
Yes. Obama is less a sellout than an insidious snake willing to be maligned by the very Republicans whose asses he kisses. Is there a bloggy icon for ass kissing?
Ja See where Bernancke yesterday announced that he wasn’t going to allow the information about which banks were doing crooked shit, to be published?
I thought FOA would guarantee access, but I guess not, with this president.
OT, just when I thought the grand betrayal was getting too depressing, explosions stage right. the tragic and unnecessary loss of innocent lives in olso was less than it could have been because of timing (summer early closing hours; had no idea terrorists were so considerate). Heard Scahill on Pete Dominic’s show yesterday say the only humanitarian aid in Somalia being somewhat effective was a norwegian group. but hey, there’s always a big birthday bash to look forward to.
“…bent the space/time continuum…”
I like that! :o)
This preznint, following so closely in the steps of one George bush, isn’t just bending it; he’s using it like an inflatable rubber doll…life-like in “every detail”. :o)
(I don’t think he read the fine print on the instructions:
“elasticity not guaranteed for extended use.)
The most powerful people in the world (the banksters) want the debt ceiling raised. They will make certain that a sufficient number of Repubs vote to raise it.
The Dems do not have to accept any linkage to benefit cuts.
I’ve seen absolutely no sign of any “volcanic Democratic Senator” on this issue, in public (and certainly not on the floor), where it counts. [Aside from repeated pathetic "volcanic" pleadings to the President by "Independent" Bernie Sanders (an idled member of the Budget Committee), who continues to carefully avoid any hint of condemnation of the Democratic Party-rigged non-process in the Senate, even as he loudly points fingers at the "right-wing" Republicans.]
But yes, as you point out, no doubt Democratic Senators will try to pretend that they were “angry” (behind closed doors, to some lackey of the President), as the headlines have it, pat themselves on the back for their “bravery,” and then obediently vote as the Party Bosses order, just as every last one of them did this morning, Sanders included (aside from two Democrats who missed the vote).
This issue for Senate Democrats appears to continue to be about Party (“we’re winning” the Party vs. Party battle, say the Democrats in current reporting), not about their duty as Senators, their oaths of office, or what’s best for the American people.
Kent Conrad, the powerful chairman of the Senate Budget Committee, who claims to want to contribute to a “bipartisan” solution, and was a member of the Catfood Commission and its successor the Gang of Six (which both did their business behind closed doors), has refused to do his duty to bring a budget to his standing Senate committee, or to let that committee publicly work up its own “bipartisan” budget for the federal government, as the law requires.
Why is that? And has a single reporter on Capitol Hill bothered to directly ask Harry Reid or Kent Conrad why they refused, and refuse, to allow the Senate to debate, amend, and adopt a federal budget to send to conference with the House?
[Note that the federal budgets crafted by Congress, under the Budget Act, won't be subject to being fake-filibustered, the way Democrats have arranged (with their abuse of supermajority cloture motions) for most other Senate legislation/nominations to be, and are not signed by the President.]
Even with obviously-divided loyalties, at least occasionally the Constitution ought to trump Party. If Democratic/”Independent” Senators won’t stand up to publicly condemn this corrupt, top-down, separation-of-powers-spurning Party process on an issue of this magnitude – about which they claim to be so concerned – when would they ever?
After listening to a report on NPR this AM about elections in Venezuela, Obama and the Dem Party should donate all their 2012 campaign war chests to save SS, Medicaid and Medicare and then invite the GOP to join in and match the donations. O should do this after saying, “No!” to the cutting of the big three.
(klynn holding her breath but still likes the idea.)
Actually it was pressure from Democrats too. Then, as now, the larger half of the party was made of conservative southern democrats and business friendly conservative northerners. Roosevelt himself had serious inclinations in that direction. He ran on a platform that included a balanced budget. He vetoed a bill to pay the Veteran’s Bonus. He ordered Hopkins to cut back the WPA in 1935 because the thought the depression was over and he could get back to a more conservative position, responding to a very focused opposition from his own party. Read the following “bipartisan” Conservative Manifesto. It could have been written yesterday, or maybe tomorrow.
http://www.northcarolinahistory.org/encyclopedia/12/entry
I remember listening to Bill Moyer’s interview this guy, Shelby Steele about BHO and thought he was a conservative crack pot. Looking back I think Shelby Steele hit the nail on the head.
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/01112008/transcript2.html
Thank you for fleshing out the facts. I blamed a bit generously republicans and omitted the southern Dems who were basically antebellum teabaggers, both of whom = conservatives.
However ‘inclined’ Roosevelt was, he did ‘welcome the hatred’ of the people who the present occupant of his office shields from the consequences of shredding the economy of the world and the suffocation of the middle class.
He was not invisible.
He said a lot of good things, most notably, for me, when he gave that speech in 2002 condeming the invasion of Iraq. (just as Hillary and the rest of the country were drinking the warbot koolaid.)
That he has turned out to be, basically, George Bush’s 3rd term, doesn’t change the fact that the other options we had were Clinton, so assiduously smooching rightwing ass as her perceived path to the White House, and then, John McCain, who made no bones about his being a bush clone.
Obama seemed much the best of the three, which is why he won in a landslide, over McCain.
The tragedy of his sellout, I insist, was not apparent, and anyone who says that to them, it was, needs to post, immediately, whom THEY supported.
thanks, powwow, for the insightful commentary, with interesting detail.
on both small and large matters, things all too often happen in the congress when the “solons” get stampeded.
this sounds like a stampede unfolding – with all its fury and folly.
all i sense from my vantage point is legislative and presidential incompetence of a most extraordinary sort leading the herd over a right-wing hunting cliff.
Disenfranchising and insulting lefties along with the Rep victories in 2010 produce the results favorable to Obama’s financial backers. What did the scorpion say to the frog?
He certainly did. Maybe GE have changed their tune. One can hope.
Yes, Roosevelt was at least on our side. When the depression came roaring back from his too optimistic move to dial back the New Deal programs, he had the sense to turn them back up. He was a conservative and as much an opportunist as any politician, but he had a heart for people. He was also a rich aristocrat by birth, so he did no have any inferiority complex about the wealthy people or any need to seek their favor or any illusions of their wealth being an indicator of a superior character. He also had people around him who believed in the radical value of democracy and who saw people as valued assets in society, not commodities to be exploited.
After idling since the 10:00-10:45 a.m. vote to table the Cut, Cap, Balance bill, at 2:45 p.m. Friday, 7/22, the Senate adjourned for the weekend, not to return until 2:00 p.m. on Monday, with nothing on Monday’s agenda except votes on two nominees (both to be district judges, I believe) at 5:30 p.m.
Harry Reid, speaking on the Senate floor just after 2:00 p.m. on Monday, July 18th:
Harry Reid, speaking on the Senate floor in the early evening of Wednesday, July 20th:
powwow –WOW!
Reid actually said he would be pushing the Gang of Six’s plan, whatever it turns out to be?
Oh, FSM, help us!
On the assumption that you meant:
Yes, absolutely. I don’t yet have an exact quote, but it was painfully clear from Reid’s scripted and unscripted comments on the floor between 9:00 and 10:15 a.m. today (and from his subsequent moves to idle the Senate), that it is unquestionably the intention of Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid to do Obama’s bidding (perhaps with an assist by Senate Republicans), with regard to any backroom deal that’s agreed to by the President and the Speaker of the House, if Senate Democrats don’t stop him.
Thanks powwow : ) The “volcanic” quote was in reference to one of DDay’s posts, I think Sen. Mikulski used that term, but as you say, it is one thing in private and another entirely in public.
It’s really baffling that no one in the MSM has bothered to ask anyone why Congress gives a rip about O’s opinion anyway. THEY HAVE THE POWER TO SOLVE THIS IN CONGRESS. No matter what the Billion Dollar Pinhead in Chief thinks about anything.
Nothing about our “debates” on federal policy is honest in any way. And no one seems to notice that Congress has all the utility of a human appendix — mostly useless, but it can kill you.
Madprogressive,
I do NOT think Obama is playing chess. I do NOT cover for him. I despise the man. He is conning us.
The end game is NO REVENUE increases. When Obama talks about wanting revenue increases that is the con. The end game is meant to appear as caving in to the Republicans with a massive spending cut and no revenue increases, but it’s what Obama has wanted all along.
I don’t for a moment believe he really wants to increase revenue, anymore than he really wanted to end the Bush tax cuts or he really wanted a public option or that he wants to withdraw from Afghanistan or that he wanted to pull all combat troops out of Iraq.
He is a liar.
I still contend this is all a con to trick supposedly liberal Democrats to support him after he signs the biggest spending cuts in recent history and then sell it to the people as some kind of victory for Democrats and being reasonable.
It’s all shit.