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In a discussion yesterday with Logan Price, a Bradley Manning supporter who was part of a group of activists who sang a song during the President’s San Francisco fundraiser, President Obama flatly stated that Bradley Manning “dumped” documents and that “he broke the law.” A rough transcript follows, provided by UK Friends of Bradley Manning:
OBAMA: So people can have philosophical views [about Bradley Manning] but I can’t conduct diplomacy on an open source [basis]… That’s not how the world works.
And if you’re in the military… And I have to abide by certain rules of classified information. If I were to release material I weren’t allowed to, I’d be breaking the law.
We’re a nation of laws! We don’t let individuals make their own decisions about how the laws operate. He broke the law.
[Q: Didn't he release evidence of war crimes?]
OBAMA: What he did was he dumped…
[Q: Isn't that just the same thing as what Daniel Ellsberg did?]
OBAMA: No it wasn’t the same thing. Ellsberg’s material wasn’t classified in the same way.
This is the President of the United States speaking about a US military soldier detained for almost a year on charges of leaking classified (but not top secret, the level of files released by Ellsberg) documents. Manning’s lawyer is considering considered (corrected: his transfer made the writ moot) filing a writ of habeus corpus for the length of time and totality of abuse suffered by Manning while in military custody.
President Obama has already made up his mind. He thinks Manning “broke the law.” It’s no wonder he considered Manning’s abuse to “meet our basic standards” when he thinks Manning is already guilty.
This is vile.
As a reminder: the Pentagon plans to hold Manning indefinitely. Might as well, since they think he’s guilty already.
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Obama looked frustrated at the end of the video clip.
My take is that he is frustrated that this isn’t going away like he’d like it to.
Good work everybody.
Let’s keep up the pressure, he’s going to have to fold soon, for the sake of his campaign.
Just like George W. Bush tried taint the jury pool in the favor of Scooter Libby, Barry wants to taint it against an American hero.
So did the last adminstration.
So did the banks and bond rating agencies.
So did the telecoms.
So did the torturers.
So did the current adiministration.
Vile isn’t a strong enough word.
So now the government provides for indefinite detention as well as torture against Americans, here, in the United States?
If I were to release material in to the Gulf I weren’t allowed to, I’d be breaking the law
Well, that’s change, of a sort…
“L’État, c’est moi” – Obama
Logan Price has really been an extraordinary advocate; remember this post of his here at FDL? Kudos to him!
As for BHO’s responses: ^&%^%##@!!!
Nice turn of phrase. My bold.
Yes, he has! He’s been kick ass. Thanks for the reminder and link, Kelly.
maybe, but you’d also get a tax credit!
Where is this kind of strength of conviction from Obama on other issuse we elected him to uphold. Manning threw light on the dark and lawless behavior of the people that rule our lives. He should be knighted and not treated in the manner of the countries we so hypicritically denounce.
The UCMJ calls for quick trials. Since that hasn’t happened, I suspect they don’t have all the “evidence” they say they do.
They probably don’t want this to go to trial, because the supervisory chain is even more guilty of negligence.
yes! quite convenient.
And doesn’t the president also assert the right to assassinate Americans (or anyone else) he deems an ‘enemy of the state’ or otherwise a ‘terrorist’?
Hooooooo…..boy, way to taint any potential trial or judgment against Manning.
I expected more from a sort of godlike figure hovering above the fray as Obama supposedly does. Wait…can I choose which god he might be, that would make a difference.
What are “they” teaching “Constitutional scholars”, at the school on the hill, these days?
Do you suppose the “quaint piece of paper” is ever, really, examined and pondered upon?
Or do they use comic-book-style “Cliff Notes” of some obnoxious kind, which suggest that “pragmatic expediency” is the actual “law” of the land?
One do wonder, Barack.
Talk about deliberately and intentionally “gaming” the system, of cynically “shaping” public sentiments and “opinion”.
Truly pathetic and dreadfully WRONG.
DW
OBAMA: We’re a nation of laws!
Wow just wow!
Think of all the money we’ll save not having to pay judges salaries – Obama gets to decide and no time is wasted. What a great country.
This guy is unbelievable. There is no way that I can support this guy. He would have to turn in the opposite direction on everything that he has done in order to do it right and not be such a corportatist. his knowledge of the Constitution is very useful because he can make decisions on his own to destroy the country, he doesn’t need advisors. I didn’t think that he would sink so low, but he is worse than bush because bush needed people to tell him what to do.
If we are a nation of law, why is Cheney free?
The government of the United States seems seriously out of order, and I don’t think elections can cure it.
Decider Guy 2.0
Obama should be locked up for breaking the law.
The law is a very selective thing, isn’t it? The blindfold has been shed off Lady Justice just like Obama shed his campaign promises of transparency, rejection of torture and assurances of due process,
Just because you teach something doesn’t mean you believe in it. I was taught about Marxism by professors who were not communists.
I fear the same. And I don’t know where to begin.
That was the part that was mind boggling, unless by “individuals” he meant non-wealthy, non-politically connected.
Rat in the corner gets scared, then bares teeth.
America is broken, completely and deliberately, sfmikey.
It cannot be repaired, merely “fixed” into something worse.
Time for a Constitutional Convention, called by “the people” … yet?
At least, let us BEGIN to think post collapse, and consider what is needful to civil society … beginning with the rule of law.
DW
Thanks for the post. As was said on another post about the anniversary of the BP Macondo Oil disaster which continues to poison the Gulf of Mex. & for which it’s unlikely that BP will truly be held accountable – and about which O could care less as long as he’s paid off by BP – here is Pontius Pilate Obama sending the Pfc Bradely Manning, the lamb, to slaughter. Nice application of the “rule of law,” O, you lying scheming smarmy traitor.
My loathing and despair know no bounds.
This is no surprise, considering that Obama is a war criminal.
When will his trial be held? Maybe he will get a fair hearing, unlike Manning, who Obama has already convicted.
only the “small people” have to follow the laws set for us by the upper 1%. The upper 1% doesn’t have to bother their “beutiful minds” about such trivia as “laws,” doncha know?
Pfc Manning is presently the smallest of “small people” and his torture is deliberate for many reasons, one of which is to be a warning to the rest of the serfs that this, too, can happen to YOU.
Because “laws” are simply another form of force used by the powerful to control the weak.
The powerful make the laws, and the weak have to follow them.
Of course, that truth agitates the slaves, hence the “nation of laws” marketing spin.
The president’s prejudging the outcome of a high-profile criminal trial would pretty much make it impossible for Manning to get a fair trial in a public court of law, where the courts belong to a branch of government constitutionally separate from the executive branch.
What is the likely effect on Manning’s ability to get a fair trial from an ad hoc military tribunal, which constitutionally looks to Mr. Obama as its commander-in-chief? The caricatures of Mr. Obama need to focus on more than his ears.
Obama actually is a worse president than Bush. He is better than Bush only where it doesn’t matter. He’s not hostile towards abortion rights, but Bush did not end those rights. He’s not hostile to global warming science, but he hasn’t done a damned thing to address the problem.
In everything where there is a difference in practice, the difference is that Obama goes FURTHER than Bush with the same policies.
Nation of laws. Ha! Why aren’t the bankster criminals in jail then, OilyBomber? And–aren’t you innocent until proven guilty?
Tell me the difference between Barry Cocaine and the Smirking Chimp?
What’s really scary about his “he broke the law” statement is that it wasn’t a prepared statement, it was off the cuff, indicating how he really feels.
Pfc Manning’s torture, if it wasn’t been already, now truly belongs to Obama.
Then Harvard turns out little but “unbelievers” who are simply out for themselves, and in Adam Smith’s warning words, ” … all for the masters … devil take the hindmost …”
And democracy equals capitalism as “freedom” simply means “free enterprise” … and “corporations are people too …”
Yes, npl, one often does not retain or remember what one is “taught” but rather what one has … “learned”.
Especially sociopaths, and those who happily do their bidding, the corporation men and women who think not of human cost but merely of the aggrandizement and “success” of their superiors and and the benefits to themselves from their clever alignments, evasions, and deceits, that is where true “loyalty” lies (pun intended).
DW
Mr. President,
You broke the law! Let me count the ways…
Well, first of all let’s have a real trial for Manning and for those in Gitmo. Second of all, let’s allow you and Congress decide what is best for America instead of the Military and the Banks. Third, well I could go to a million but you get the jest. Just so you know, Mr. President, you have broken our laws!
That may be true, but it hasn’t been proven in court yet.
yeah, that’s the worst part. it is what he believes.
Padilla was shuttled around facilities as a result of legal decisions – Manning is being moved to avoid them
Will there be a Democratic candidate for president in 2012 or will it be another contest between two Republicans?
Stupid question. Please forgive me.
Oilbummer is a garden variety authoritarian right winger who seems to not care about torture.
:-)
I think you meant gist, jest changes the meaning fairly substantially.
earlofhuntingdon,
I always enjoy reading your posts. And you make a good point @34. I fear we may be getting past the ‘fair trial’ concept in this country, however. GITMO might be a dress rehearsal for what awaits us. (Hope I’m wrong.)
Obama needs to take a lesson from, of all people, Scotty McClellan: “this is an ongoing investigation and therefore I can’t comment.” Remember the uproar when Nixon called Charlie Manson guilty?
I think this statement was intentional, waynec, it was the next (logical) step in disappearing Bradley Manning from public consciousness and conscience.
“Reality” is being created right before our eyes.
Obama did not blurt out his conviction owing to frustration, pressure, or stress … it is the intended message, else there will be some attempt to “walk it back”.
It would not be wise to hold one’s breath in anticipation.
DW
Irony writ large. Much like the topic.
or Ashcroft’s remarks about Lindh ?
“We may never know why he turned his back on our country and its values, but we cannot ignore that he did. Youth is not absolution for treachery, and personal self-discovery is not an excuse to take up arms against one’s country.”
So the secret, ever changing rules of classified information trump the Constitution and the Bill of Rights? Obama thinks he is sacrificing Manning to save his own @ss.
I’ve noticed Obama has a fatal character flaw of believing people he perceives as “experts”. It wouldn’t surprise me if Obama believes Manning “broke the law” (which ones?) because he was told exactly that by some high-ranking military authority figure. Obama doesn’t really seem to have the intellectual makeup to doubt things so-called authoritative sources tell him.
et apres le roi, le deluge!
So Barack Obama has joined the ranks of infallible? Capable of knowing the truth without the need to learn anything.
Perhaps it’s time to remind the Democratic leadership of 1968.
It explains a great deal when the “Commander-in-Chief” convicts a military prisoner without a trial. As more people start asking the “tough” questions, the “real” President Obama will emerge.
Like I said in a previous post–you have no rights. Rights are man-made things created by gov’ts to control the masses. We are born free. We don’t need some Bill of Rights to grant us those “rights.” There is no rule of law. It’s a nonentity, an abstraction. And when certain “laws” become inconvenient for the power elite they are abrogated or outright scrapped.
Either intellectual makeup or he does it deliberately.
Either way, I think it’s what the PTB saw in him right from the beginning, that he would do what he was told, without questioning.
That’s also my hypothesis for a core part of what Poison Ivy Schools train people to do.
Excuse me while I chase my jaw, which just dropped to the floor, out the door.
Barry!! Are you out of your mind!!?
Baby killer Obama strikes again with the cowardly armed drones.
Admiral Mullen admits that “Al Qaeda” is controlled by Pakistan ISI spies. Time is on our side as the Rolling Stones and Mullen would say. But it is all good, all war 24/7.
This statement is unbelievable. Fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you fuck you
That is all also too.
The King has spoken. If we’re a nation of laws then how can Obama pronounce him guilty before he’s gone to trial?
Yes– Stazi officer training. The rest get the vanilla serf brainwashing in the caste society.
My guess is Obama played mediator between his grandparents for so long that his main goal in life is get people to, “stop calling each other names and sit down and eat dinner.”
Hey this infallible stuff is fun!
I’m getting the sense that Oilbummer ain’t too smart–or he’s just a vile human being. Maybe a combination of both.
Er, yeah. Can’t effectively conduct diplomacy when the world has videos of the US committing war crimes. Instead of locking up the whistleblower, how ’bout locking up the war criminals? Christ on his throne, how can that man utter such tripe.
Seems his hubris is way past that…what an egotistical Cheney extension.
Interesting comparison.
Can anybody explain to me why Howard Dean said that Obama should not be challenged in a Primary?
Fer Gawrd’s sake! Is there anybody that can save us from this leadership?
IMO this is the worst action O has undertaken yet. There is such a clear line here between right and wrong, and there is no excuse that can be made for approving torture of a whistleblower. O’s gotta go.
Obama is NOT the victim of a too-easy credulity, ph, his instincts and his sensibilities are self-centered and glib in their manifestations, the essential Obama is daily revealled as calculating, vain, and superficial.
Obama is simply, a pusillanimous fabulist, and, looking forward, HIS future is assured so long as he finds neither courage nor truth.
Obama’s failure to lead IS the premise of his success.
Obama is a little person, small in his humanity, but large in his hubris, he is the ideal champion of empire as it flails in its angry, destructive demise.
DW
O’s gotta go.
O’s nothing more than just the latest Snake Oil Salesman in Chief. How long must the people endure these charlatans.
Fine wordsmithing, DW.
Interesting that Obama thinks a President has to abide by certain rules of classified information. That’s certainly not what George Bush thought. Marcy would no better, but I’m not sure that’s held for this Administration entirely, either.
I wanna see how the Obots and faux liberals spin this big turd.
David Dayen has a fresh cross-post available: Bravely Bold John McCain Rides Forth to Libya
they wont – the unofficial official line these days is that Manning is “a distraction” serious people™ don’t comment on “distractions”
The bots will just claim he misspoke in the heat of the moment…
I suspect that by “I” Obama meant “a commoner”.
‘anyway’……
‘alright’
This remark defines him and his presidency. He’s so much like Bush it’s uncanny. The hubris is astounding. Someone above said Cheney. Maybe more Cheney. It’s obvious he doesn’t care about what people think. He’s detached from the public. Maybe that’s why he won’t deal with the unemployment problem.
It’s like the reign of those shitty emperors after Augustus.
“President Obama has already made up his mind.”
Obama’s response was entirely appropriate. In a Fascist kleptocracy like that in the US, the executive is the Law. Trial is irrelevant.
Because Howard Dean is no longer to be trusted on any level. Not sure if Dean EVER was to be trusted, but it’s clear that Dean is as bought off as O is. Dean is just playing his role in the Kabuki show, which as this point appears to be: encouraging the dfh’s to continue to “support” O because Dean is giving Obama a big fat old “liberal” endorsement. fwiw.
No, this IS the “mind” that Barry lives “IN.” Got it??
Didn’t someone find that Obama and Cheney are related? Works for me.
“We’re a nation of laws! We don’t let individuals make their own decisions about how the laws operate. He broke the law.”
Pretty funny stuff, from a guy who RACED to reassure Executive Branch torturer/killers that they would not be prosecuted or investigated for their lawbreaking – and hmmmmm, wasn’t that Obama’s “own decision” about how the law should operate? By preventing his DOJ from prosecuting, he refused to abide by the rule of law.
By intervening to override his AG’s decisions to prosecute in Federal Courts and going with madeup commissions (not military courts) he refused to abide by the rule of law. And ever-so-laughable, he says that he, as President, couldn’t decide to discuss classified info?? Then why isn’t his DOJ investigating all the Bushies who did just that very thing, planting cherrypicked classified info via Judy Millers. After all, Dick Cheney admitted that Bush authorized Cheney to “get it all out there” and cherry pick classified info and leak it, without going through any declassification procedures other than Presidential harrumphing.
Obama will mystically metamophize “good faith” into torturers who blatantly tortured for fun and human experimentation and to knowingly generate lies to be used to launder the torture through Powell’s UN presentation for war and to form a basis to “justify” the torture of others, sending out ever widening ripples – but somehow he is flummoxed over being asked to find good faith in actions of a man who exposed the US direct interventions to derail Spanish prosecutions of its Exec Branch torturers?
Yeah – right. What a piece of trash.
Wait a minute…are you all Liberals that voted this man into office only to now turn your backs on him so rabidly because he has taken a firm stance on the Manning issue id defense of National Security? Or are you a bunch of bleeding heart Conservatives? Did all of you support Hillary? I just can’t tell…All of you are spewing some serious hatred towards the greatest President ever!!!
So Obama is no better than that vile republicreature Monica Crowley, who has tried and convicted Manning in her own tiny little mind. BHO, I quote the immortal Bette Davis to you – “You are vile, sorry little bitch!”
I’m so tired of despising him for his obscene policies and beliefs. WHAT CAN WE DO? I know that we’re not supposed to do caps, but I really am looking for something that we can do effectively to change the scene.
HELP?
Blessings
Obama’s attitude is entirely consistent with his entire administration; advisors,agency appointments, cabinet appointments as well as the former Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi, who all have a “minority report – department of future crimes” attitude about anyone who challenges their policies or exhibits any kind of dissent.
Quite honestly, I don’t think this attitude originates from Obama himself, but he seems to have assimilated it.
More here
The office has totally turned this guy’s head. His natural arrogance has been augmented by the raw
power he holds, a bit smoother than W, but the result is the same. He openly mocks progressives now
in a way he cannot ever have done with any other group. He thinks we have to vote for him, I don’t
have to vote for anyone. Kabuki is too much of an elision of the point here that Obama is Trump with
a smoother delivery.
I wonder what that jerk Obama thinks about the criminals on Wall Street. Didn’t the executives and employees of the big Wall Street firms also break the law? If so, maybe they should also be subjected to unlawful, indefinite detention without trial.
Laws are illegitimate if they are not being uniformly enforced.
Maybe someone should give Manning a million dollars so Manning can make a contribution (bribe) to Obama’s campaign. Perhaps that will get Manning freed.
The question is, what law? If the law is the executive, then that explains Cheney, what’s happening with Manning, and most of the big stuff that has gone down over the last decade.
See EV’s comment at 7.
How come we’re looking back NOW fella ?
Separation of powers . . . the military is prosecuting Manning not the DOJ. For those who argue Pres Obama, as commander-in-chief, should have taken a more active role, there is a legal concept called unlawful command influence that is meant to prevent those without a direct role in the charging process from trying to influence the jury, judge, or convening authority. The system works, if Manning was “tortured” he will have his day on Court. Indeed, Manning not only has access to the military court but also the federal circuits.
A rough week for the obama brand and its lead marketer:
1. A bunch of constitutional scholars called him out in regards to the treatment of Manning and questioned whether his conduct as president even met standards of common decency
2. An interviewer from the Texas media called him out on a blatant inaccuracy about his results in Texas in 2008 and embarrassed him/pissed him off
3. Protesters in San Francisco paid their way into a fund raising event and sang a song to him about his treatment of Manning and called him out on his faux change
4. He comes out and declares Manning to be guilty
5. In response to questions about Manning, he left himself way open for mockery when he declared that we are a nation of laws!!!!
6. He initiates drone drops on Libya, bringing one of his most despicable, cowardly and inhumane policies to the forefront
7. Protest signs outside of another fundraiser in Los Angeles declared “obusha: we’ve been had” which has to hurt the most to him becoz that is what he is most concerned about deep down: being exposed for who he is and what he has actually stood for which is being the left’s biggest barrier to change, cementing some of the most hideous policies of war criminal bush, and protecting the rich and powerful from any accountability while going aggressively after his plutocratic handlers’ biggest enemies.
Go get ‘em obama … let’s see how long your charisma holds up while you fuck over 99% of the population for your own vanity and wealth.
Z
I was realizing yesterday that weve become a country where the criminal elite blame and “pass the buck” to the serfs. We see this in this situaiton as well as the blame for the deficit on social security and unions. And yet we have the elite such as electd officials and bankers and others who openly commit crimes and yet NOTHING whatsoever happens to them except they laugh at the little serfs complaining.
Why people in america continue to believe this is a democracy is beyond me.
Oh and what a complete asshole Obama is. Its simply astonishing that this guy is a bigger a’hole then dubya. That takes some serious effort.
Why would the people in power , who ignore this constitution respect a new one ?
I would like to fully try to apply the one we have now amend and bend but don’t toss it out quite yet.
To be fair, Nixon knew a criminal sociopath when he saw one. Birds of a feather. :) And like Bush and Obama, he understood that within a corporatist government, the executive was the law. Shit, we still look to him for his blunt summation of the issue: “When the president does it, that means that it’s not illegal.” Indeed.
Isn’t Obama related to Cheney?
Reporters in this country are fucking terrible.
The instant that Obama says, “We’re a nation of laws! We don’t let individuals make their own decisions about how the laws operate. He broke the law.” a half way competent reporter should have said, “Mr. President, you’ve repeatedly told the American people that it’s important to ignore when people violate the law; to ‘look forward not backward.’ Also, if he’s broken the law, then you should be able to court martial him properly, and put this controversy to rest.”
And people think Obama’s better than some right wing assclown? Sure, he puts on the lube wile he fucks you and shears any thing of worth from you. The republican ass clown would not do that. So you can say Obama is smoother, not as rough. I am not sure that is a good thing, however, or a proper measure of “better”. As seen in Wisconsin, they are overreaching and they have woken up many people from their slumber.
this is why I currently believe it’s time to turn up the boil before violence is the only option left to the people. I cannot vote for Obama in 2012, and I am planning on voting for the RW assclown (unless they are too smooth, if that is possible). O’s got a year left to do more than pretty speeches. I am not holding my breath.
Good thread, Mike.
I think he’s losing it…he’s just getting overwhelmed with the results of laying down like a cur dog for the republicans, and by the fact that the american right (which HAD to be initially astounded when they found out that he was willing to do rehab on them after we helped him kick the shit out of them…) is eagerly filling the leadership vacuum that he’s created for them…and filling it with their twisted, status-quo-sucking, agenda.
The Commander In Chief just pronounced the untried defendant in whatever proceeding guilty before
any such proceeding commenced. He just voided the convening authority with his mouth.
If Cheney or Obama *is* the law, the law lacks legitimacy. Just sayin’
Oh, do go away you silly person.
Obama could have stopped this at any time. Don’t hide behind command structure and other such nonsense.
Our president asserted guilt before trial. Get real.
Yea. The system really has worked hasn’t it? Nonsense.
Bastille Day?
I abhor this development: this is the worst thing Obama has said/done yet and yes, it does show his own personal view, which would be corrupt for a law-abiding citizen but as a sitting president, it’s beyond shocking.
Here’s the meaning though: this was an error produced by the brilliant protest at his fundraiser. Without the protest, the quote might not have been made.
SO: We must keep up the pressure. For Manning’s sake and for our own. And we now *know* that further pressure will continue to produce the reactions we have been getting and the reactions are becoming more and more revealing and indefensible!
Hey mods, we need a cleanup on isle 107. Suggestions of violence are not allowed here, malk.
As president of the United States and as commander-in-chief of its military forces, Mr. Obama has an overriding obligation to ensure that the law is faithfully executed. That pertains to the enforcement of the UCMJ, and to the constitutional, treaty and statutory rules that apply to the conduct of our armed forces and their treatment of its prisoners.
Mr. Manning is innocent until proven guilty. He is indeed owed his constitutional rights to a speedy and public trial in a regularly constituted court, to the unimpeded assistance of competent counsel, to confront all the witnesses and admissible evidence against him, and to appeal any conviction. He’s been waiting nearly a year for those rights. He’s still waiting.
Yes. He’s the King and he *chooses* which laws to follow and who is guilty. Just a tad un-American.
That’s July 14th, and it’s not on the American calendar.
Any punishment for a traitor should be applied to Dick Cheney first.
Coincidentally, with all of the shit that keeps going on, gold is breaking all records for it’s value.
I do believe the inauguration -er, coronation- involved an oath to that effect, which the man *performed* twice.
So, now the inauguration is kabuki, too.
Vote for whatever RW ass clown the Repugs run for Prez and Dem at the local level if they are Ok, otherwise, fuck em. If the ass clown gets in, they will overreach with no effective check/resistance from the demoslugs and turn the boil full on. It will likely wake up a sufficient mass of people to start effecting real change, like in Wisconsin.
It will not be easy, but I do not see any other way of waking enough people up in short enough time frame to claim this country back for We the People. Back to its liberal ideas as a Constitutionally limited Democratic Republic of the United States founded on the unalienable rights of man and all men are created equal. With effective tariffs and taxes to minimize the extremes of wealth and poverty while providing freedom of expression for all citizens; to provide not just a means to live, but something to live for.
All other paths are the slow boil and, IMO, lead to horrendous suppression under a corporate/feudal/fascist rule, violence and some type of breakup. Global disaster or World War may also bring us together, but, really, do we need that?!
Indeed, and the difference in our respective nations is obvious because of it. The French Revolution was fought by the masses against an oppressive aristocracy. The American Revolution was fought by New World aristocrats against Old World aristocrats who wanted to horn in on their bounty.
Price. Not the same thing. It’s an artificial price spike. If you were a speculator it’d have been good to get in on it three years ago, but it’d be extremely foolish to jump in right now.
Is you one of them trained killers ?
Come on it can only go up /s
Add to #6 on your list – 9 civilians (women and children) in Pakistan killed this morning in drone attacks.
If we’re a nation of laws, Obama’s following sentence is wrong, and it shows how he thinks and what he believes.
On the contrary, we are not a military dictatorship. In fact and in practice we do let individuals make their own decisions. That’s what a free society means.
It seems to be a fatal character flaw of US culture as well (and perhaps more generally, of modernity, where expertise is prized as each individual or compartment has control over one, small component of production). Thinking, figuring out cause and effect relationships and consequences systemically or holistically suffers as a result. It is partly rooted in an educational system predicated on scholasticism.
There is no need to assert “unlawful” authority over a chain of command. What general has to tell a private what he wants? Large bureaucracies like the military and BP take pride in reading the boss and in delivering what he wants before he wants it. MASH’s Radar was just a comical example of a syndrome that operates up and down the chain of command. High profile military trials that directly concern the president are not business as usual, whether they are about Pfc. Manning, Captain Queeg or General Billy Mitchell.
I really don’t see any positive change occurring in this country.
Or the dollar is breaking all records for its lack of value.
Me? I received better combat training than the U.S. Armed Forces could ever dream of providing. I was raised Catholic.
Not only can I endure grueling adversity and extreme conditions, I revel in them and believe I deserve no better!
:-)
Agreed, but I couldn’t get past “we are a nation of laws”
This is obviously and demonstrably not true. There’s an extreme spike in the price of gold and a comparatively stable value of the Dollar relative to other currencies.
Frankly, Pres Obama’s comments concerning Manning’s guilt (and I question whether the quoted language is correct given it was provided third-party) will probably be grounds for a UCI motion by Manning’s defense. But why should those “silly” folks follow the rules of court, the UCMJ statute, or the consitution when they could just defer to your expert analysis and declare him innocent. . .
I see waking up from our life of denial and self-delusion as incredibly positive.
We have to release the old before we can open to the new.
Happy Easter, everybody. ;-)
.
“Poppin’ Fresh Jesus: He Is Risen!”
I quite agree. But that agreement reflects my prejudice that law is an organic product of democratic forces, a creation from the bottom up for the collective good. Not everyone endorses this basis for the legitimacy of law, like many religious fundamentalists or Neo-Conservatives, for example. If people acquiesce that the executive, as the embodiment of the state, is the law and at the same time above the law—as both Bush and Obama have gotten away with—then whatever law comes out of their mouths becomes legitimate.
Actually, Pres Bush’s comments during the abu ghraib fiasco were grounds for at least one unlawful command influence motion. Again, the president does not have authority to direct a chain of command on how to proceed on charges. Leave the politics to the politicians and the law to the lawyers, and “justice” has a funny way of figuring itself out.
This guy has the same reasoning ability as W.
“We’re a nation of laws! We don’t let individuals make their own decisions about how the laws operate. He broke the law.”
Obama/Microsoft Illegal Campaign Contributions 2008:
http://my.firedoglake.com/expotera/2011/04/11/justice-or-just-us/
Then things cost more in every currency.
Gold’s price hasn’t spiked extremely. It’s risen steadily with small dips and small spikes for the last five years.
It’s silver prices that have very recently spiked very high, much higher relative to the other metals.
Beware of Bubbles.
I thought the Awakening was happening after the second time Bush became president. Boy, was I mistaken
I *still* can’t understand why W wasn’t impeached and Cheney wasn’t imprisoned for war crimes.
I know, she’ll need a bigger thong to hold the many more cheaper Franklins.
Currently people with silver they bought cheap not long ago, who are in dire straits, are being given an offer they can’t refuse — to sell. That is, turn in their precious metal for cheap dollars. Silver prices have doubled, tripled, and quadrupled for those people.
Try listening to the video at the top of this post.
Have you ever read the US Constitution? It says a person is innocent until proven guilty in a trial by his peers.
IMO Manning is not guilty of a crime, even *if* he released classified documents. Manning is a whistlelower who exposed war crimes and other government malfeasance. Ellsberg isn’t guilty of leaking the PP either, IMO.
Fuck Obama–excuse my French.
It’s truly shocking. How can he possibly get a fair trial in the military now?
PS I know, he wasn’t going to get one anyway. I mean a trial, period. But even the pretense of fairness is gone.
They’re not even pretending any more.
Well, something happened there. It joined liberals, progressives and Democrats together. It pushed in Obama, which was almost too easy with the level of Bush fatigue. Then people either gave him a big break watching imaginary multi-dimensional chess, or misinterpreting the game. If you look at Obama and cast his actions in light of what is good for the MOTU’s, then he makes much more sense.
This country is a multi-trillion dollar enterprise and the linchpin of the current major ruling oligarchy. It has a military without peer, and capabilities that most do not even comprehend. It will not be taken back in an election or in a few street protests. It will need much more, as well as worldwide protests against the ruling elites whom conspire together against us all when it suits their interests. Obama’s shown himself to be a real opiate to the people and is therefore a bigger danger than even Bush and his neo-cons.
They don’t pretend any more because it is beneath them. They rule; we’re to obey. End of story.
Hi, Jane. Nice to see you around.
Hollywood and high school civics class versions of justice and the American way are not much help in the real world. Things do not come out all right in the end as a result of hope, religious fervor or passive reliance on the system. That’s true in marriages and in parenting, it’s true in big bureaucracies like the military, government and the criminal justice system.
Ours is inherently an adversarial system. Politicians do not stay out of it. Judges and lawyers have egos, faults and ambitions as great as any doctor’s, politician’s or general’s. Justice occasionally comes out of the criminal justice and political systems, but only when people fight like hell for it. Otherwise, prosecutors always win, regardless of the quality of their case, and corporations always get tax breaks on the backs of ordinary working Americans.
Mr. Bush’s comments about Abu Ghraib or other past crimes are of no concern to Mr. Manning. Mr. Obama’s comments about his pending criminal case do count. A chief executive’s actions ordinarily count more than his words, but it is also true that prejudicial comments alone by someone high in authority are actions.
Ding! Amen.
Maybe we should be asking why Manning isn’t being featured on every news program on every station to talk about the crimes he exposed in the interests of transparance and to prevent further war crimes. He doesn’t *need* a trial because no crime was committed. Why was he ever taken into custody for exposing the crimes of the government?
You’ll also put up with anything and never abandon it, no matter how bad it gets, or was that something Matt Damon’s character said in The Departed?
I suspect either of those things don’t mean much if the primary requirement in becoming president is looking good on TV. Obama fulfills that requirement well.
One of those questions that answers itself…
First of all, let’s get our facts straight. Obama was not a Constitutional Professor. Nor was he a Constitutional Scholar. Obama was a Constitutional lecturer. There is a HUGE difference between the latter and the former (2). Anyone can lecture, provided they have a degree in the field. Obama is a dabler. He has never spent anytime at anything whereby he could now be defined as an “expert”. To be a professor, one must be on the path to tenure. To be a “scholar” one must have studied beyond convention and gained an expertise thru deeper study. Obama is a bit of surface fluff!
That quote tells us a lot about what Obama and his ilk think about democracy: “Don’t let them see us. Don’t tell them what we are doing.” If I didn’t know any better, I’d think the Neo-Cons were still running the show.
Yeah, the question was rhetorical obviously. I’m good at stating the obvious. Heh.
“Otherwise, prosecutors always win, regardless of the quality of their case, and corporations always get tax breaks on the backs of ordinary working Americans.” It saddens me that individuals on both sides of the political spectrum have such a pessimistic and negative view of the judicial system. I look forward to following Manning’s trial and think the “left” will be surprised how much the military judge will hold government counsel to the fire for creating collateral legal issues . . .
They are.
What a smug guy! He knows all about Ellsberg, does he? “He broke the law.”
Bad thing to have a captain for the ship of state who has no moral compass.
“Obama’s failure to lead IS the premise of his success. Obama is a little person, small in his humanity, but large in his hubris, he is the ideal champion of empire as it flails in its angry, destructive demise.”
Out-fucking-standing, DW. Best summation of the situation yet.
Essentially liberal democracy is a more open form of tyranny because no matter who’s in charge the rich elite are always catered to. I’m not surprised by Obama, really. I mean, it is kinda shocking he was so honest about his contempt for “democracy.” But, in reality, our masters despise us and do anything possible to keep us down. America has never and never will be free. The state is an instrument of oppression; it uses capitalism as cudgel to beat us into submission. These twin devils are our enemy, in the end.
The US president is a de facto king. In the modern world, he doesn’t represent nobles and such, but the big jowled white men capitalists who play with the working classes’ money while blaming every social malady on us.
Obama is a little person, small in his humanity, but large in his hubris, he is the ideal champion of empire as it flails in its angry, destructive demise.
Yes, this is most fabulous, Bartoo.
Who is paying you to write this stuff? If Manning were going to get a trial, it could have been done by now. This is torturing him to hold him up as an example to other, potential whistleblowers. obama wants the status quo to continue and us to be quiet. Again I ask, who is paying you?
One word:
Sell. :o)
The President has deemed himself judge, jury, and executioner on one lone private who help spark revolutions around the world and try to lift the yoke of oppression. He now suffers in an American gulag. While the persons who embroiled the nation and much of the industrialized world into two wars based on lies sit in their mansions writing about their wonderful lives and collecting dividends. The persons who made the world’s economy collapse and caused the suffering of countless others throughout the world are still sitting in their mansions and collecting even more dividends because their political tools are telling US serfs we are the one who need to sacrifice.
NO! Mr. President we are not a nation of laws but a nation of circumvented laws by the rich and powerful which you have Enabled by your duplicitous nature to lie to the people who still believe in democracy and kowtow to the forces you say you fight. You have become nothing more than a self absorbed plutocrat.
United States v. Simpson, 58 MJ 368 (the appearance of unlawful command influence is as devastating to the military justice system as the actual manipulation of any given trial; even if there is no actual unlawful command influence, there may be a question whether the influence of command placed an intolerable strain on public perception of the military justice system…
(when those with the mantle of command authority deliberately orchestrate pretrial publicity with the intent to influence the results in a particular case or series of cases, the pretrial publicity itself may constitute unlawful command influence; even the perception that pretrial publicity has been engineered to achieve a prohibited end, regardless of the intent of those generating the media attention, may lead to the appearance of unlawful command influence).
http://www.armfor.uscourts.gov/digest/VA1.htm
Yes, conlficting views from you must mean I am some secret government plant or corporate spy . . . Solid argument, sir, solid argument.
Rule of law! Obama is a fake, a liar and treats us like total half wits.
I join all Americans in a giant vomit upon the irony and lies conducted by this administration in equal measure to the one before it.
Got it and, as I initially stated, the president should not be commenting about the guilt or innocence (if that it what in fact occurred) of ongoing cases. Now, hate to be the bearer of bad news but that UCI is extremely difficult to win from a defense standpoint, which is why it became a non-factor in the abu ghraib cases.
And as mentioned above, Ellsberg leaked top secret information, all of Manning’s alleged leaks were documents of lower (less sensitive) classification. Oh yeah, and whoever told the President that he was bound by federal secrecy laws was pulling his leg.
The security classifications are established at the discretion of the President, he can’t be guilty of violating his own security rules. Even if he could be, I suppose he could just give himself a retroactive waiver or, worst case scenario, grant himself for a pardon. :o)
“This is torturing him to hold him up as an example to other potential whistle-blowers.”
Yep. That’s exactly what it is, and forget all the bullshit about the UCMJ: If Mr. Centrist didn’t want it to happen, it wouldn’t be happening.
Pronouncing him guilty may have been “the wish, the father of the thought”, but it was as real as a…prison.
Zing! LOL. Good one.
Exactly. If you want to know who Obama REALLY is listen to what was posted here on Manning that he actually said. There is one set of “laws” for the elites that run everything and one set for the rest of us. Which is why no one could pay me to vote for Cheney light. At least if..insert Republican name here.. is in office he.she won’t be representing me as a supposed liberal democrat and law scholar. Right now we have met the enemy and he is one of us.
So, does this mean that, if a court martial convicts Manning, any appellate court will have to vacate the conviction?
What did he mean by saying the stuff Ellsberg revealed was less highly classified? Wasn’t most of the Pentagon Papers Top Secret, whereas the stuff leaked to WikiLeaks was classified Secret and below?
Me, too!
Dayem, Nathan, you on one helluva hot streak today!
Sentence first, verdict after!
“A nation of laws” that do not include due process and the right to a fair trial.
“A nation of laws” that do not apply to the ruling elites.
I hate Obama even more than I ever hated Bush.
Speaking of Matt Damon characters, consider for a moment the three Bourne films: all based on the premise of exposing a secret CIA program to assassinate…wait for it…American citizens without due process.
Life imitates art? Truth stranger (and more terrifying) than fiction?
When I think about this, all that comes to mind is, “Wow”.
I concur.
Oilbummer, if you look at the vid, has this bemused look on his face as the protestor is talking to him. And then he departs, like that’s it–all wrapped up, case closed. On to the next thing. As evil and murderous as LBJ was the man at least fretted and agonized over the lives lost in Vietnam (maybe not the Vietnamese lives, perhaps). (Remember the famous pic of LBJ with his head in his hands???) Does anyone think for a moment this empty suit gives a shit about the little kids he’s blowing up or any of soldiers who are dying for these meaningless wars? That bemused look tells everything you need to know.
Obama’s trial for war crimes will held shortly after the ones for Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Rice/Powell/et al.
Around the 12th of Never.
If the Dems didn’t learn anything from the 2010 election, what should they bother to remember 1968?
Because he just doesn’t care. My thinking on Barry O’Failure is pretty much:
Get elected.
Get re-elected.
Cash in!
Nothing else makes sense.
Obama has turned into a Republican Dickwad.
So let me get this straight….Manning is going to be court martialed after his Commander-in-Chief has already pronounced him guilty. And all those in the chain of command between Obama and Manning are going to do what exactly? Has Obama ever heard of “Unlawful Command Influence”?
http://usmilitary.about.com/library/weekly/aa103000d.htm
Wow! You sure nailed it, DW.
It occurs to me that O is foisting learned helplessness on progressives by this statement. Kick the base, again, and say it in a way that makes the leader of the D party look like a law-abiding patriot. Makes ya want to pull yer hair out, eh?
It feels like running in sand.
Why does he need to get re-elected before he can cash in?
Thanks for your response. Please tell me where to direct my pressure? To the White House? Can’t imagine that would make a difference.
I was recently contacted by mail and phone asking for my financial support for the re-election campaign. I wrote to the campaign apparatus and said to the nice young caller (who said they had valued my generous ($25?) support last election, that I would not be there for them or him this go round. I explained that I now knew that I would indeed work against him as he had become the most despicable person I had ever known (I used to literally scream obscenities against Bush!)and I had come to despise him. The young man was flustered, but promised to remove me from their solicitation list. Who knows how the campaign responded?
Yesterday I sat in on a phone conference session for seniors with Doris Matsui, whose district includes Sacramento city and county (?). I made the stupid mistake of saying that I lived in West Sacramento (Yolo Co.) but that I’d been an active advocate for seniors for many years; Don’t know if I was excluded at that appoint, or just sent to the back of the line, but I never got a chance to comment or ask a question.
The questioners/commenters were all moaning about Ryan’s vision, etc. and her comments were pretty much in very sympathetic agreement, but filled out with all kinds of well defined talking points. I concluded in the dialogue that she was rather shallow and unimaginative (she was submitting a bill for another $250 to seniors as an alternative to COLA), but a good example of quasi-traditional liberal reps who probably do deliver in constituent services, but probably not much more beyond voting the party line.
One of the callers asked what we could be doing to help her and to change the tone and direction of the debate. She said to keep the pressure on, keep contacting her and others of our area and national representatives, including Republicans, to express our concerns.
I was very much moved by Scarecrow’s report the other day about the youth environmentalist advocates and the very strong call for aggressive civil disobedience because the simple letter writing and petitions, etc. no matter now many, really wasn’t going to cut it any more. My current political advocacy hero is ____ can’t remember his name, but writes for The Nation, etc.; He is a relatively REAL Radical calling us to take to the streets.
We have the example of our Arab brothers and sisters across northern Africa in the mid-east, all risking their bodies, some even to death. There have been some commenters here at the Lake who have said that we must take to the streets. I have been in emotional agreement and have begun to respond to local demonstration opportunities (the most recent of which supposedly organized by USUncut, never happened, much to my chagrin). Aside from being 71, relatively poor and somewhat diaabled, I’ve also stopped myself because I, like our African and middle eastern muslims also seek freedom and integrity. But I don’t have much of a rational and coherent personal agenda to place before gatekeepers and decision makers beyond a few, maybe a lot, words of basically symbolic value and I’m not all that enthralled by the agenda either party has to offer. Furthermore, I’ve seen lots of reports sitting on shelves and lots of idealistic visionary programmatic efforts turn to pathetic actualities, etc.
In short, I know of no one in current history who made much of real difference – short of the likes of Cheney and Bush and currently the tea partiers and the Republican governors and legislatures who are redefining the world in real terms that frankly scare the shit out of me – even more than Obama does.
So, dear lakers, what are we to do, beyond moan and groan and say nasty things?
Blessings,
None?
Interesting. How many have had a moral compass in my lifetime.
In the NO FUCKING WAY category:
Obama, Bush I and II, Reagan, Clinton, Nixon, Ford.
In the MAYBE category:
LBJ, Carter
In the PROBABLY category:
Kennedy, Eisenhower.
In the YES category:
Truman.
Pretty damn sad.
Agreed. Because I expected a shit sandwich from Chimpy, and got it.
I expected more from Obama. And what did I get?
A shit sandwich with arugula and spicy mustard.
I hear you. It is hard to know what to do ~ and there are many conflicting calls to action that may or may not succeed. The protesters that challenged Obama at the fundraiser did not know if their actions would be effective or even noticed.
The politicians are no longer listening. I tried to come to terms with being a minority in my views … only to be reminded here at the lake that on several progressive issues 70% of the population is in agreement with me. The politicians do not listen. So there seems little point in calling, writing, etc. Withholding donations is important, but we see they have more important sources of funding now.
Votes are important. But for whom? I wrote in a Green for Senator in November. It was very satisfying. It could bring change in years. If that’s where we are going, it’s good to get started.
Being aware and conscious of what is REALLY happening is very important. It’s the first step and not to be derided.
I never ever imagined any Democratic president could be so unAmerican. And so criminal.
The system is broken beyond any individual candidate’s ability to fix it. I believe that.
But there is hope in Wisconsin. Things are much different now than before these protests happened.
I don’t know what else to say ~ or what to tell you. Hang with us. And take care of yourself. We’ll see what happens.
I do see Obama’s statements about Manning to be a very significant turning point. We may not know how significant for years.
Methinks Obama didn’t turn into a Dickwad, just that he always was and kept it pretty well hidden. Until right after the 2008 election.
He doesn’t, but the checks will be bigger if re-elected.
I didn’t either reader and Obama is one major reason I’m no longer a Dem. The incompetents and cowards in the Senate, circa 2009-2011 is the other.
It’s clear that “Unlawful Command Influence” is of no concern to O in Manning’s case, as O is not fettered by such piffling trivialities, esp in terms of serfs who are whistleblowers like Manning.
Yes, that was the most interesting thing about those films, although I thought all three were well-made for that type of thriller. The underlying message quite likely was not really absorbed by a lot of citizens, but I pondered that each time I watched those films. Of course, Matt Damon, himself, is leftwing in his viewpoints, and it wouldn’t surprise me if he was also drawn to the role he played partly for that reason.
Yeah, gave up on the Senate, too. Bunch of freaking assholes, every last one of ‘em and I did have my favorites and my heroes. But it was all games, lies, and kabuki. Makes me so angry. If Obama came out of the Senate this year to run … I would say forgetaboutit, he’s just as bad as the rest of them. We would know ~ there would be no doubt, in spite of great pr and rhetoric.
You are correct about the Top Secret status of what Ellsberg leaked. The POTUS lied about that, amongst other things, in order to push forward the guilty before being proven innocent pronouncement about Manning.
Obama knows the status of the Pentagon Papers v. the status of the Wikileaks. Obama is a liar of epic proportions, which is no longer surprising.
But no: what Manning did was NOT “worse” than what Ellsberg did when Ellsberg leaked the Pentagon Papers. Ellsberg, himself, has spoken very clearly about this, and Ellsberg is a big advocate for obtaining some kind of “fair” treatment and “justice” for Manning for that reason.
Don’t be fooled by the sh*t that pours forth from O’s lips. Sociopath’s can lie and lie and never blink an eye.
I KNOW! This is another part of today’s shock. That Obama would lie about the status of the materials released in the respective cases, IN ORDER TO push his *message.*
They all lie like the scorpion kills: it’s in their nature.
Horrible.
The President has certainly been an abject failure on these sorts of issues. First, the assumption of guilt is a dangerous thing – and not how our system works, as he well knows. Manning may or may not have broken the law, we don’t know that yet. However, if he did, the President should still be in-tune with the notion that we, as a people, have a duty to break unjust laws. If Manning broke the law, it’s nothing short of an act of civil disobedience, as whistle blower laws should *absolutely* be protected speech. At the very least, given the fact that what Manning is alleged to have done was *absolutely* in the public’s best interest, whatever (harsh) time he’s already served should be more than enough to satisfy any notion of justice — indeed, the torture that he’s gone through is what *really* should be investigated and punished.
Yeah, a Constitutional Lecturer. Nice packaging there, to convince us that Obama was going to right all the Bush/Cheney wrongs!
Larry Tribe, and the entire Harvard Law School Faculty, should be weeping with shame.
Obama is a fraud.
A trial would be nice. You may be looking forward to it, but I hope you’re not holding your breath.
The computer system that Bradley is alleged to to hacked and then distributed some of the data has access to 2 million plus people. If the accusations are correct then someone of very low rank had access to a very wide range of documents.
Before going into teaching I worked on a couple of very large computer database systems and I’m absolutely appalled by the lack of security of what should have been a very secure system. The basics were just not followed.
It is obvious that if a lowly private based in Afghanistan could access all of this material then the Russians, the Chinese and probably even the the North Koreans have access – and they would have kept quiet about the material that’s been downloaded.
The people who should be on trial are people high up in the Pentagon who seem more influenced by TV programmes, such as NCIS, Criminal Minds or some of the block buster films where the good guy’s clever buddy can access everything in the computer world – with good design this should not happen.
In the 1980s we had safeguards and you needed security clearance to move from one section of a system to another. Unusual use was quickly highlighted and checked. This is very basic and our computer systems were primitive compared to today’s technology.
There should be generals, technical directors, civil servants and probably politicians who should be in the brig standing naked to attention, sleeping with just blankets, not being allowed to communicate with people, being allowed only one hour’s recreation a day and kept from reading books, newspapers or watch TV.
But of course they won’t – while they can maltreat Bradley Manning they can the attention away from their incompetence and the misuse of probably tens of millions of American tax payers money.
Lawrence Tribe did sign that letter condeming Obama for his treatment and torture of Manning:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/apr/10/bradley-manning-legal-scholars-letter
Tribe also quietly quit O’s Admin in Jan. Guess Tribe felt it was a buggerall joke to be designated as Obama’s “Rule of Law” guy. Can’t blame Tribe for wishing to distance himself from Tribe’s erstwhile student.
You’ve made some excellent points, which many citizens don’t get (and they’re not meant to get it). How could a lowly private in Afganistan gain access to this info so easily? Spare me. It doesn’t even seem as if Manning is some computer whiz (not meaning to diss Manning but never heard anything touting him as some kind of hacker).
Yes, those further up the chain of command who didn’t do their jobs in securing this info – if it’s all so gosh-darned top-secret-y & sentive-y should be on the hook, if, indeed, some kind of “crime” was committed.
It’s just like how Lynndie England and other low ranking soldiers copped the biggest sh*t for Abu Ghraib, while those further up the chain of command walked off scott free:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynndie_England
Load of crap, per usual, but per usual, the rubes out there are absolutely slavering to see Manning “get his,” and not at all thinking about or questioning anything about how this all came down, how Manning is being treated, etc.
Disgusting doesn’t begin to cover it.
Sure they all LIE, and then sleep like babies every night. They are sociopaths and psychopaths; that’s who they are.
Obama let that giant LIE roll right outta his lying mouth with a big fat old straight face. WHY? Because O knew he could get away with it, that’s why.
And what’s even more effed up is that O calls out Ellsberg, and the rightwing serfs get their panties in a big bunch about what Ellsberg did in the first place (I can remember my parents ranting & tirading about Ellsberg & what a traitor he is). We live in a totally sick and dysfunctional society, a significant portion of which wishes nothing more than to live in a fascist system, I’m sad to say.
Sad to agree that Manning’s trial is going to be a very very long time coming, and I bet anything it’ll be short & done before we know it. And Manning’ll be locked away in America’s equivalent of a Gulag (Gitmo is one example of a US Gulag; Manning will be placed in a differnt one).
Tribe did help sell O’s credentials, or at least let his name be used. But to Tribe’s credit, he woke up and distanced himself.
Harvard, et al., continues a pace, selling this fraud..
He still has
damagethings to do or undo in the case of Social Security and other progressive programs that help theserfslittle people.I have correctly described the competitive and adversarial judicial, political and economic systems that operate daily in Washington and in every county town and courthouse across the country.
Right decisions often result. Sometimes they’re even fair, but fair deals for divorcees, prisoners, contract disputants and Social Security retirees do not arise out of passive reliance that the system will work out all right in the end any more than ignorance of business behavior would lead to a buyer or seller being given a fair shake by Adam Smith’s invisible hand. Ask Paul Allen about how fair Bill Gates would have been had Allen not been informed and zealous, and they were best friends. And we needn’t explore the fair shake given altar boys and choristers who sometimes placed too much reliance on their system being as fair and open as its leaders advertised.
The personification of justice, who holds the scales, is blind for a reason, the same reasons that led the Founding Fathers to devise an elaborate system of checks and balances for our government. Will Rogers and Mark Twain made humor with it. Mencken wrote reams about it. Even Norman Rockwell immortalized it in his Post cover of the butcher and customer, one pressing down the other up on the same scale.
I am merely reciting old truths that opportunists would prefer we forget. What’s remarkable is how hard we have to work to keep them in the public memory.
Bravo DWB! I’m wondering when enough will feel the same way…
Superb comment, EOH.
The best of the thread, absolutely.
DW
So what are we going to do? We have a great community here at FDL and we should work to produce the major fundamental changes necessary in this country!
Yes, they both have the same black hearts.
Yes, feels like the end of the Soviet Union, rotting from the inside out.
What will the post-collapse country be like? Think of Poland.
So many apparatchiks hunkering down for a while and showing up changed.
Until the Lustroviania Tydzien (Transparency Week) when Adan Michnik published the list of all the collaborators.
So he broke the law of the land. hmm.. . so I think syria is also justified in killing the innocent protesters because they are protesting against the law of the land and may be in countries like china and russia people are jailed because they protest against the law of the land. Laws can be just or unjust.Just because something is law it doesn’t mean it is right.Who makes these laws? It’s us, the people, especially those who hold the power to their dear life and most of the laws of the so called land just serve to protect their power and nothing else. This coming from a constitutional scholar or whatever …. I don’t know what to say.Laws,just like nation,religion,race and so many other things, an easy way to avoid moral responsibility for your actions.
Only 12,000 hits on “He broke the law”, 8,000 on the song. Take it viral folks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=IfmtUpd4id0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuMwwzQKatY&NR=1
Haven’t scrolled through all 222 posts, so don’t know if anyone else has pointed out that Barry’s pre-judging Bradley Manning recalls Tricky Dick’s calling Charles Manson a murderer before he had been convicted.
Now almost 17K and 10K respectively :)
He always was a Republican dickwad. Where were you?
Yes! See Teddy’s diary here: http://my.firedoglake.com/teddysanfran/2011/04/22/on-bradley-manning-who-will-be-barack-obamas-john-mitchell/
indeed. we insult vile people when we term obama vile.