Rep. Paul Ryan has released his 2012 budget proposal (PDF), and in it, he has endorsed the truly terrible idea of eliminating Medicare and replacing it with a voucher to buy more costly private insurance on an exchange.
Future Medicare recipients will be able to choose from a list of guaranteed coverage options, and they will be given the ability to choose a plan that works best for them. This is not a voucher program, but rather a premium-support model. A Medicare premium-support payment would be paid, by Medicare, to the plan chosen by the beneficiary, subsidizing its cost.
The premium-support model would operate similar to the way the Medicare prescription-drug benefit program works today. The Medicare premium-support payment would be adjusted so that wealthier beneficiaries would receive a lower subsidy, the sick would receive a higher payment if their conditions worsened, and lower-income seniors would receive additional assistance to cover out-of-pocket costs.
This approach to strengthen the Medicare program ensures security and affordability for seniors now and into the future. First, it ensures security by setting up a tightly regulated exchange for Medicare plans. Health plans that choose to participate in the Medicare exchange must agree to offer insurance to all Medicare beneficiaries, to avoid cherry-picking and ensure that Medicare’s sickest and highest-cost beneficiaries receive coverage.
I would love if the entire Democratic establishment could unequivocally beat up on Ryan and the rest of the Republicans for promoting such a horrible plan. They could point out how the Medicare Advantage private insurance exchange ended up significantly more expensive than traditional Medicare, show how public insurance has always been more cost effective (PDF) than private insurance and explain how the largest private health insurance exchanges in America have been a total failure at controlling cost. They could mock that we are to believe an 85-year-old with the beginnings of dementia is going to be a super savvy shopper able to understand the complexities of insurance and select the best deal.
And after demonstrating what a costly and wasteful idea premium subsidized private health insurance exchanges are, they could than show that Ryan’s plan only “saves” money by drastically reducing the level of coverage we provide our seniors.
Unfortunately, this task has become monumentally more difficult in the last year because President Obama, Congressional Democrats, and the bulk of “liberal” pundits endorsed the new health care law, all claiming profusely what an amazing idea it is to use sliding scale premium support payments to provide individuals with insurance on private exchanges.
The basic description of Ryan’s Medicare privatization program is essentially indistinguishable from the new “Obamacare” exchanges. So, basically every progressive complaint you will hear about the horrible design of Ryan’s Medicare privatization plan could apply equally as well to the Democrats’ new health care law.
Democrats could have made a very clearcut and principled case for why Ryan’s plan is so wrong, but now they need to tie themselves in logical knots explaining why it is a great system for Americans under 65, yet a horrible one for those over 65.




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So if the differences are negligible, why should we support Obama again?
Ds don’t want to push back. They want the Rs to do it so they can hide behind it.
This is what happens when you always seek to cut the baby in half.
DING!
ding!
whatcha drinking? looks like i owe you one :)
This is what the Vichycrats do. Obama and Congressional Vichycrats are bending over backwards to rescue the Republican caucus who are determined to march over the cliff of a government shut down, and the “budget deal” gets progressively shittier for everybody but the rich and the corporations. Stand up. Stop trying to save the Republicans from themselves.
Yep, plenty of money for ws and bombs but nothing for main street, so is there anything new today?
Look at the world. Look at what works and what doesn’t. Look at what systems control costs and provide excellent care. It’s all sitting there awaiting observation and analysis. What the fuck is the big problem? Why start with the idea that all solutions must be private, whether they will function or not?
This is just pitiful.
Wheatgrass shot with a dash of ginger juice, please. Plumeria garnish is fine. Thank you! :-)
THANK YOU JON!!!!!
I’m sure Jonathan Gruber has a perfectly sensible way of explaining away the similarities.
Added: Come to think of it, since (in Gruber-land) taxing people’s employer-paid health benefits will result in them getting raises, shouldn’t forcing people to buy private insurance result in them living longer? Win-win!!!
Another dishonest, frivolous, circumlocutory proposal from the Liar’s Club, designation R-Team.
No it’s criminal and that’s a feature not bug.
“Disaster” (hat tip Mark Fiore)
Sorry, I can’t get beyond the similarity between Ryan’s haircut and Ronald Regan’s.
Great comment. Your insight would make a great diary if you were to expand it.
Thanks for being spot on.
How about:
Obamacare was a compromise from a starting point that was better than Medicare, and would have provided fiscally responsible care covering a greater number of Americans. Ryancare would throw your grandma’s care from the train.
The subsidies covered all premiums over a certain percentage of income – that is the exact opposite of fixed cost vouchers.
Well Jon, maybe, but it’s a wonderful idea for a bumper-sticker attack on Ryan’s plan:
“Obamacare for Seniors!”
Who needs to explain anything?
I’ve watched the U.S. med ind economics problem for 2 decades.
Not only did it just get worse & worse, as each new ‘fix’ made it worse than it was before, now it’s getting worse at an accelerating rate.
The only thing I would add Jon is that the R’s will have to tie themselves into equal knots explaining how they spent the last two years talking about how evil Obamacare was and now are proposing expanding it to our seniors.
Of course, hypocrisy and tying themselves in logical knots is a daily occurance for Republicans, so it won’t be such a big deal to them.
Would soooooo love to be in the middle of a bunch of teabaggers right now and confront them with the question of why if Obamacare is so evil we should extend it to our seniors. I know, I know, I would likely never get a good answer, but it sure would feel good asking them the question directly.
What about the whole “starter home” BS.
The Democrats claimed up and down that HCR was just the start of a better system, perhaps ending up as a Medicare like program. It’s an easy argument saying that vouchers would be a step backward for Medicare.
When legislation ends up resembling, in every respect, a hairball, is just won’t work worth a shit. It will be gamed and abused. Consumers will never understand it, and implementation will be a nightmare. We all know this. Look at the banking industry. Look at Britain’s rail system.
Triumphs of privatization and hairball legislation.
Yep. I’ve been waiting eagerly for the teabagger response about the Republicans putting their government hands all over their medicare.
The Ryan plan proposes differing amounts based on income too, and it even gets to zero for wealthy seniors, JUST LIKE OBAMA’s subsidies.
It’s Obamacare extended to seniors.
That is EXACTLY what it is, and all those that supported Obamacare need to explain why it’s so wrong now to extend it to seniors if it was so right when Obama did it.
Jane was right. Far too many “liberals” aren’t really upset with the stuff the R’s do, they’re just upset at who does them.
“progressively shittier for everybody but the rich and the corporations” is redundant… “progressively shittier” suffices
yum! i think i’ll have one of those too!
Cue the popcorn, continued problems in bankster land as a hedger talks: ‘Michael Steinhardt Tells The Truth, The Whole Truth, And Especially The Truth About The Greatest “Con Job”: Warren Buffett‘ (CNBC video ; by Tyler Durden, Apr. 5, 2011)
A must see!
Wow. Who knew that passing a Republican-designed health care program would further the US down the path of Republican health care policy? What a surprise.
You might even think Obama and Co. planned it that way.
No. If I had left off the rich and the corporations, somebody would have come along to inform me that they are doing just fine, thank you. I guess I can’t say anything without it being picked apart and criticized by someone though.
Sliding one to you … { One for the mods }
Uh-oh: “Irish coffee: S.F. elixir on brink of extinction” (Apr. 3, 2011)
Exactly. And this is why we might even be better off with a Republican in the WH. “Liberals” and “progressives” will fight actions from a Republican and won’t fight those same actions from a Democrat. Or at least — not from one named Obama.
I keep thinking he should be in one of those old timey barbershop quartets
With all due respect, there’s an old joke about a man who asks a woman would you have sex with me for a million dollars, to which she says yes.
Then he asks, how about fifty dollars and she yells what the hell do you think I am — a whore. He replies, that you’re a whore has already been established, we’re just negotiating the price.
neither picking apart nor criticizing… just agreeing with you that the budget deals keep getting shittier from a progressive pov, i.e., progressively shittier
I agree with the general premise of your post Jon, but you make a mistake
of equating progressives and Democrats as being the same. While some Democrats might be progressive, not all of them, or enough of them, are
I love it.
Oh no, don’t take it the wrong way. I just figured out that around here, you have to be pretty specific sometimes. :)
potential catastrophe!
i haven’t lived in northern CA for almost 20 years, but i still have 4 of those glasses and NOTHING comes close for making irish coffees (don’t do it often, but when i do, i follow the BV recipe exactly). that first bit of sweet hot coffee and wiskey, sipped through the cold cream. …rapture is not far off the mark.
Churchill originally, I think.
Of course the plans are nearly identical. Both come from hard right-wing Republicans, why shouldn’t they be virtually the same?
They are looking at the world and what works.
You want medical care that works.
They want campaign contributions that work.
I’m sure the Insurance/Medical Industries planned it that way.
Let’s ask Liz Fowler. Any have her direct line?
All those Ds who thought Obamacare was just the first step in eleven dimension chess, got it exactly right…
I do have to give a lot of those folks that were posting here back in 09 in support of Obamacare some credit though. They insisted it was just a starter home and could be expanded.
Turns out they were right after all. Now they want to expand it to seniors and do away with Medicare.
I think I can see where this is going. Subsidies for those under 65 and vouchers for those over 65 will gradually get smaller and smaller until they’re gone completely, and what’ left will be a mandate for American to use their own money to purchase insurance.
If anyone thinks that’s hyperbole, I’d answer that this outcome is FAR FAR FAR more likely given the evidence to date than any type of movement in a progressive direction.
What a once in a generation opportunity the D’s wasted. Assholes.
There really are very few good scheme that do an excellent job of ripping off both regular people and the government at the same. Think of it like convergent evolution.
Heh, wow, talk about having an idea simultaneously, your post and mine have the same time!!
Whatcha drinkin???
Just to lighten things up..WATCH THIS…WALK THIS WAY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbbIvGVQqKk
LOL.
I’ll take a rain check. Just sipping water at the moment.
Sounded like a bummer not having the little glasses. Maybe a cottage industry opportunity for someone that’s enterprising and ca provide the proper glass thickness?
When a trojan horse DEM like Obama gets other trojan horse dems to pass a GOP health care bill written by Bob Dole, this what U get. “no one likes marrying their cousin!”
OBAMACARE = Bob Dole Care = Ryan Care we call this ” the trojan horse way” or the “HOPE A DOPE” written by OBAMA
However, groups like PCCC, FDL, and others make it very hard for Dems to embrace OBAMACARE, because doing so will result in political death.
Again we must thank Gov. Walker for waking up the Dem Base nationally, and destroying the idea of the mythical middle. Go ahead trojan horse Dems endorse Ryan plan, and watch your political careers go up in flames.
Obama and his trojan horse buddies did not want the Dem base energize.
No Dem in DC wants to look like someone who works with GOPers, because GOV. Walker and other GOP governors don’t work with Dems.
Obama also knows new Dems coming in 2012 will attack Obamacare like GOPers.
Obama better work on his Public Option lie, he is going to need a good one. Someone is going to ask why Obamacare does not have a Public Option and Obama is going to say what? :)
Obama can’t say something to stupid, because BLOGS like FDL will rip him a new one.
Me thinks a lot of dems are going to throw OBAMACARE under the BUS.
get your pop corn ready folks the presidential 2012 elections are going to be hilarious.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! That did lighten things up! Just your thinking that I would click on any link that you provided.
Up to you..but you are missing something awsome!!!
This is how it looks when a Trojan Horse Dem attacks GOPers
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102×4801704
“Sen. Baucus Rips Paul Ryan Budget: “Not On My watch”
Max Baucus (D-MT), chair of the Senate Finance Committee, has seen enough of Rep. Paul Ryan’s “Path to Prosperity” to declare it dead on arrival. In a statement to reporters on Tuesday, Baucus ripped into the Republican proposal to privatize Medicare while slashing benefits for seniors over time as a betrayal of the program’s core mission.
“Independent experts agree the House Plan would make deep cuts to the Medicare benefits seniors count on,” Baucus said in a statement. “It would end Medicare as we know it and funnel Medicare dollars directly into private insurance companies’ pockets. Under the House plan, seniors’ coverage would be cut drastically, benefits would no longer be guaranteed and seniors’ costs would skyrocket. We can’t allow the House to balance the budget on the backs of seniors and we won’t – not on my watch.”
let the Kabuki games begin! a year a go Old Baucus would have hug Ryan, now he treats him like scum
Me thinks Senate Dems are marching toward the left? wonder why?
we call this the “TROJAN HORSE BOOGEY”
Okay, I thought it was another Paul Ryan video. I’m not into country music though.
Yes, that eleventy seven dimensional chess is a bastard when the full agenda is revealed.
“OT”– Avaaz.Org petition, “US: Stop Torture of Bradley Manning.”
It’s Carrie Underwood and Steve Tyler. Cool vid, actually.
Hey Thanks..I really thought it to be FREEKIN AWSOME
its not country
Why should Dem pushback be tricky? They think they can win with the slogan “We suck just a little bit less.” Well, as per their part in the kabuki, they do appear to suck just a little bit less, so I don’t see that they’ve got much of a problem.
Yeah it was, that was an especially good performance of Walk This Way I thought.
Good one alamode!!!
Hey thanks..we need a little entertainment today
Capitol Hill Dems would find pushback tricky if the Republicans came out for repealing the Bill of Rights. They are the worst negotiators in the history of politics.
Yup. It’s pitiful.
“I do have to give a lot of those folks that were posting here back in 09 in support of Obamacare some credit though. They insisted it was just a starter home and could be expanded.
Turns out they were right after all. Now they want to expand it to seniors and do away with Medicare.”
I’ve never bought that excuse. With that justification, you can use that as a reason to pass every single bill, which those same ones advocating the “starter home” position didn’t feel that way about Bush/Republican bills…because they knew their stance wasn’t intellectually honest because bad bills in reality can’t be cured that way. For “starter home” legislation to work, you have to start off with a structurally sound bill rather than it being an excuse to pass a defective bill. Passing bad bills certainly starts something – as in getting bad policy engrained.
So . . . both the article and these totally dis-empowering comments reminded me of something I read on Counterpunch. This link takes you to a description of Bruce Levine’s new book Get Up, Stand Up, which is an analysis of why we’re taking this sort of crap.
http://www.counterpunch.org/mokhiber04012011.html
If we don’t understand where we are, I see little possibility of finding our way out.
i’d think.
well, thanks for the news. a manageable bummer is most welcome :)
Sen. Baucus Rips Paul Ryan Budget: “Not On My Watch”
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/04/senator-max-baucus-d-mt-rips-paul-ryan-budget-not-on-my-watch.php?ref=fpb
they are what they are Margaret. they are republicans. it only looks as if they are not standing up because they are standing in a hole.
The corporados will oppose the Repug plan. The insurance industry doesn’t WANT any of those expensive old people to get insurance. What the insurance industry wants is what the Dems have already given them–a two-tiered system where people who won’t cost the industry much are forced to get insurance, and people who will cost the industry lots are taken care of by the government. The industry gets to take lots of money in, and the government gets to pay lots of money out. Corporado heaven.
The libertarian ideologues’ anti-government crusade is leading them into direct conflict with the corporados–and in the end, the corporados always win.
This will be smacked down in a big hurry.
Well Jon, maybe, but it’s a wonderful idea for a bumper-sticker attack on Ryan’s plan:
“Obamacare for Seniors!”
Who needs to explain anything?
+1000 doc
weevil medical school paid off for you, that’s f’in brilliant.
Tricky pushback? I don’t think so. I definitely am not a fan of HCR as enacted on behalf of the corporations, but it’s about where the affected came from. For the most part, benefits are not being reduced with HCR, and many millions should gain a significant benefit. Ryan’s plan would severely reduce benefits for the elderly, and I assure you that scares the hell out of anyone contemplating their retirement years.
Telling the public that instead of the contract they thought they had with their decades of Medicare withholding, they get “no rest for the weary” is not a difficult pushback. Lousy insurance coverage instead of no insurance coverage is one thing, but lousy insurance coverage instead of good coverage is quite another.
Yep!!!
I will definitely relay this information to the tea parties.