Shorter Simpson: “To keep paying 100% of benefits, we’re going to cut the benefits to 75% or less and call it the new 100%”

What a crock of horse shit he spews.

We all need to go out and inherit something. Then we wouldn’t be “little people.” “Big people” have grandparents who actually worked or inherited money from someone who actually worked, or actually stole the money in the first place. Max nix. Yes, there are people who stole the money in their own generation…an exception that crops up too often.

You pick your crap and I’ll pick the real stuff.

Such a diplomat.

And so wrong about the facts.

I’m probably going to have to work until at least 70, but that’s not by choice. It’s so I won’t be penalized for my second job working for a private client. (2040 more days…) I’m lucky enough to have a desk job, one that doesn’t require me to work outside in the blazing heat or down in a mine or on a fishing boat in Arctic waters…

I’m sure that electing more better Democrats will stop them dead.

Retire at 70? Pffft! I’ll be 55 this year and after losing 60% of my 401(k) I’m now looking at a retirement age of 72. Between now and then I guess I’ll just have to make the tough choice ~~ kibble or canned?

It really irks me when people who will receive a retirement pension paid for by us taxpayers and already have Cadillac health care, also at our expense, want to cut the meeger benefits to us poors. To quote Helen Thomas, “where is everybody?” (:>

electing more better Democrats

We’re trying to down here in Savannah. Regina Thomas, who’s really good people, is primarying our loathsome DINO Congresscritter John Barrow. Keep your fingers crossed.

I know where you’re coming from. I’ll never forget getting my statement and realizing that thanks to the stock market (remember when we were supposed to privatize Social Security?) I had lost more than my annual salary in one month.

LAWSON: Two wars, tax cuts for the wealthy.

SIMPSON: Whatever, whatever. You pick your crap and I’ll pick the real stuff.

I am guessing the rest of the Catfood Commission feel the same way about their two wars. Actually Pete Peterson is one of the biggest warprofiteers and financial arsonists of anyone. But they think “our crap” are wars and redistribution of more wealth to the more wealthy. So “their crap” is Highways?

Perhaps someone should call up the Veal Pen and tell AARP about Peterson’s opinion of the elderly. That they are old and in the way and why do they not die sooner. The old people need to be patriotic and stop living so long and help the millionaires and the billiionaires of the Catfood Commission.

Simpson said “We are going to stick to the big three,” meaning Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid.

Someone ought to tell Simpson that the “big three” are Iraq, Afghanistan and Korea. The trillion dollars we’ve already spent on Afghanistan would have gone a long way to paying back the Soc. Security fund. But, hey, I guess that’s way too easy.

Someone should also tell Mr. Simpson that since no one over the age of 50 can find a job nowdays, if they tinker with the retirement age they might as well send everyone over 50 a loaded gun so they can just shoot themselves and help the Beltway crowd keep those wars going at all costs.

It’s good to be simpson, great pension and health care, why would he even care about they little people.

How about an article in the LA Times today by a doctor advocating lowering care and basically letting the old folks just die off rather than pay for their care? She thought this is the only way the government is going to bring down health care costs.

so when does our side start fighting back in this war on the poor? at some point we have to realize that words aren’t effective…

Simpson is a dead man talking.

Alex Lawson was incredibly respectful and polite as the crankly Simpson berated, interrupted and cussed him. Simpson has been a long-time supporter of rolling back the New Deal, and when asked about cuts he would recommend to the President and Congress on CNBC, Simpson said “We are going to stick to the big three,” meaning Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. His sentiments haven’t changed.

That is not the big 3. Please try again Homer Simpson.

Von’s has 10 cans of Fancy Feast for $7.00 sale going. Just a tip there for those of us who are victims of the Catfood Commission.

Can we set up a blind date between Barack Obama and Monica Lewinsky?

Paging Miss Monica Lewinsky…

This is why I believe in anarchism. Does anyone think for a moment that you can reason with the amoral, blood sucking elite of this country? They are out to destroy us, take our hard earned money away from us and give it to their criminal friends on Wall Street. This old codger is no better than Obummer who believes the same thing—that the “lesser people” have to pay for their McMansions and pools–but couches it in prettified language to fool people. I’ve had enough! And I hope you folks have as well.

Let’s see: all Republicans will vote with Simpson’s and Bowles’s recommendations, and so will the Blue Dogs.

The Secretary of Treasury is the Chairman of the Boards of Trustees of the Social Security and Medicare trust funds. He serves with five other trustees, three from the Federal government (the Commissioner of Social Security, the Secretary of Health and Human Services and the Secretary of Labor) and two public trustees who are appointed by the President and confirmed by the Senate.

Unless FDL helps mobilizing physical demonstrations, the one pronged, inside the Beltway track approach is not going to stop the Obama driven American train wreck.

It’s already started. the House jumped the gun before Memorial Day recess and the Senate…just….can’t…do…it
Jobs Bill Bombs In Senate, 45-52

You pick your crap and I’ll pick the real stuff. It has to do with the highway system, it was to run America.

So…
I am paying in every paycheck for federal highway projects?
No wonder I am confused, here I thought it was for my retirement.

Logic doesn’t apply, petitions and emails will do just so much, but an outright mobilized popular rejection of Kleptocratic rule, in concert with online activism, may just snatch the safety net from Wall Streets grubby hands.

There is more merit in that suggestion than you realize.

I think the power of AARP is being ignored.

Sounds like your investment allocation was completely screwed up if you lost 60% around age 55, that’s your fault, don’t cry about it here.

Regarding life expectancy and his statement about who could have expected it to change from 57 years to 78, 75 or whatever… In 1935, the life expectancy for both sexes was 61.7 years, by 1960 it was 68.2, and by 1980 it was 73.7 years. I think there might have been some “reasonable” expectation by those in government to expect that life expectancy might increase over time.

Life Expectancy chart

Are you seriously suggesting that it’s a great idea to just let us wrinklies like me (I’m 76) just die? Don’t think so.

What gives me a real rash is that ActBlue has a donations page up for John “I wish I were really a Republican” Barrow. I called them on it and got weasel words about how, well, he calls himself a Democrat after all, and, like, you know, people don’t have to donate here… Pig shit.

HEY — I’m 64½ — why are you still sucking up my air??? /horrible snark, and please don’t take it personally…

I stopped giving through ActBlue. They’re far too easy on Blue Dogs for me.

LOL. I’ll try to breath every other minute. That’s very funny.

They’re far too easy on Blue Dogs for me.

As long as they’ll call themselves ActBlue and still have pages up for the likes of Barrow I’ll call them ActCorporate. As far as I’m concerned to be BLUE you have to, you know, walk the walk and talk the talk and, most importantly, VOTE the VOTE. /rant

Back on the subject somewhat, I’d like to say that I detest Alan Simpson. The man doesn’t have an honest bone in his body.

Alan Simpson must be one of Obama best friends, because Obama doesn’t have a honest bone in his body

Once a toad, always a toad. When Bork was nominated for the Supreme Court good old Alan couldn’t understand why anyone would be upset by his role in the Saturday Night Massacre… After all, it was YEARS ago… Fucker.

Might that conceivably be because it currently appears to be primarily an insurance scam? I just turned 50 and nobody I know in my age cohort has recommended joining.

I. Do not. Want. My Dad. Hurt.

So now the newest talking point on Social Security from a Republican Senator is that the Social Security Trust Fund is all IOU’s due to funding our Interstate Highway System???

Someone please explain, if our Social Security Fund is full of IOU’s and there is no surplus as stated by Senator Simpson, is he implying that all FICA taxes immediately coming to the Trust Fund are sent back out to current recipients? This does not make sense. And…why were previous administrations “allowed” to leave IOU’s in the Trust Fund? Aren’t those “IOU’s” government bonds? We can fund endless wars but not repay the government bonds for Social Security???

I disagree strongly with that wholly unnecessarily hostile sentiment.

ducktree, please feel free to tell us more about what happened.

Asked in another way: Who has supplied the perverse framing that Simpson has adopted here, and why is Simpson going along with it?

(Simpson, eh?)

Once the IMF demands that public infrastructure be privatized, can we put that money back into the trust fund?

Obama is the real pig here!

Please tell us who you are to tell someone NOT to explain their circumstances.
Show your work.

“We can fund endless wars but not repay the government bonds for Social Security???”

That is exactly what they’re selling. As Jane noted, they’re betraying Americans and not the Chinese or the Saudis. Any member of congress or Obama who votes for this is committing treason. That means you Alan Simpson.

Traitor.

Obama put Simpson and Bowles in place knowing full well their views on Social Security. Stop taking that bait!

I’m aware of that, what bait?

I wonder how much time you have spent in nursing homes. Obviously you are not there yet. So, I suggest you spend six or eight weeks volunteering four hours a week at your typical local nursing home. I think you would have more appreciation for my point. I should note that I provide clinical services in nursing homes, and have done so for fifteen years.

There are those frail elderly who want to, and are ready to die. They have lived their lives, and are tired and are ready to go “whenever the Lord wants me.” Are they depressed? Almost never. But, because of modern medicine, many of these folks live many more years longer than they would have twenty years ago. You will very seldom find and elderly person in their nineties who wishes to live to be 100. A few, yes, most, no. Why would it be wrong, AT THEIR request to discontinue the medications keeping them alive, except those keeping them comfortable?

Then there are those whose heart is beating, their lungs are still working, as is their intestinal track, but no body is home up there in the brain. But again, modern medicine maintains them, and often a g-tube for feeding. I would not advocate doing anything active to kill them; indeed, maintain the medications that keep them comfortable but discontinue the rest, and let nature take its course. I think you would find very few folk who work in long-term care who would disagree with me.

I love my elderly clients; my work is to make their life more fulfilled, in some cases more bearable. But there is a point one has to say enough is enough; this is usually after the elderly person has already said enough is enough.

I should also note, my wife cared for my elderly grandmother in our home; we saw her through her 99th and 100th birthdays living in our home before we had to put her in a nursing home.

One final comment. The phramaceutical companies have an enormous stake in keeping the elderly alive as long as possible. I have few elderly clients whose medication bills are less than $1000 monthly.

Wake up America! You are getting screwed up the arse! The big jowled white man corporatists are out to make each and every one of us eat of garbage cans. You can’t reason with evil amoral capitalists. Listen to the arrogant asshole BP CEo today. You can sense he’s appalled that he even has to answer for his crimes. The white man corporatist elite are killing our planet, bottom line!

I didn’t say anything about keeping people alive. I have a Living Will and will not allow that to happen to me. I am speaking about people who are not frail and sick who have lives and fun. Many people are still going strong in their 80s and should not be denied the right to food and housing. My mother-in-law died in a nursing home and I spent lots of time there. I saw the horror of people breathing but not living.

That is something that really scares me. There IS a great deal of discussion by THIS administration to privatize public assets.

As I understand it, no one is required to take medications they do not want, unless a member of their family has the legal authority to make that decision. You may be able to speak with some authority about how people in a nursing home feel, but not about people who aren’t.

You’re right. I watched a bunch of the hearings this morning…..it was astonishing. This man, who is the head of a huge corporation that killed 11 people, and is destroying the entire GOM, had the nerve to basically dare every single Congress Critter that questioned him. He knew that nobody would really take him out right there on the floor. He knows that Obama will get rid of any truely odious recommendations or legistlation. He’s not scared, not one bit.

Welcome to the U.S. of A….a country governed by the corporations, for the corporations, and of the corporations.

Thank you for your comments. These are reasons why the screaming about “death panels” during the health care debates really angered me. It was obvious to me that anyone who could call discussions on end of life issues as “death panels” was clueless about how difficult it is to deal with those issues. Far easier to take care of it early on when people will know what your actual wishes are.

I absolutely agree with you that folks should not be denied food and housing and adequate medical care, indeed no matter what their age. But, there is a discussion those of us on the left need to begin, per my prior post.

Something further I would note, is that for most people in most nursing homes most of the cost is paid for by Medicaid. All too often when people hear the word Medicaid, they think of poor people who don’t want to work. They don’t think of the elderly in nursing homes.

I don’t agree with Alan Simpson on a lot of things, and this is one of them. That said, cranky & cussing is his shtick. He was a far sight more considerate of Alex Lawson, giving him 8+ minutes of back and forth, than some of the people on my local city council have ever been to us Lesser People.

I think the people here have woken up. The question is how to get the message to the remainder of the country.

I am not aware I was speaking to anything other than those in nursing homes. There is a point of clarification worth making here. Too many people believe that a DPOA (Designated Power of Attorney) has the right to make decisions for the elderly person; the fact is, they only have that right when the elderly person does not have the capacity to make decisions for themselves. A guardian, well than is a horse of another color.

Hell yeah! I sat in my car on my commute listening to this BP prick evade questions. He needs to be tar and feathered. White man corporatists have no soul. They are all about money. Obummer is a facilitator, so he is complicit in the death of the Gulf. He allows this circus to continue because he is a soulless corporatist himself!

Jane, there seems to be a problem with your transcript. You missed the bit where Simpson shakes his cane and yells, “Get off my lawn!!!”.

Holy crow who thought putting a senile old coot on the commission was a good idea? Honestly, who could possibly say something this ignorant and be taken seriously anywhere…

SIMPSON: They never knew there was a baby boom in ’83.

Ummm, yeah they did. The Baby Boom generation was born following World War II — why, I bet Simpson might even remember that (maybe) — and is consider to have ended in the early 1960s. By 1983 they had actually managed to work out birth statistics over the preceding several decades! Who’da thunk? ; )

Just to be clear then. This was cregan’s original comment.

How about an article in the LA Times today by a doctor advocating lowering care and basically letting the old folks just die off rather than pay for their care? She thought this is the only way the government is going to bring down health care costs.

To which you replied.

There is more merit in that suggestion than you realize.

What exactly are you advocating?

I would not advocate doing anything active to kill them; indeed, maintain the medications that keep them comfortable but discontinue the rest, and let nature take its course. I think you would find very few folk who work in long-term care who would disagree with me.

Who should make that decision in your view?

What seems ‘great’ about this interview is how the interviewer got Simpson to drop his guard and to express his real hostility toward the interviewer and toward the people who will be affected by Simpson’s ideologically twisted decision to cut benefits. Simpson’s transcript reads like a classic aggressive personality. Blame is externalized to others: seniors, anyone who argues against his point of view. He intimidates by repeating himself and by getting louder. He uses name-calling and dismisses his opponent’s argument with demeaning names: calling it blathering, sophistry, when really he is the one being unreasonable. I always am fascinated with how they manipulate language to create the idea that x is really y when it always will be x. So social security insurance which is made of taxes paid in by workers gets “Simpsonized” into the word “entitlements” which suggests a service or ‘gift’ of money which a person never worked for or paid for. That is a subtle lie that this conservative group is promoting in order to de-legitimize seniors rights to the money they contributed to Social Security.

Dear Jane,

Got any Free Press remarks regarding PCNAA a.k.a. Liebermans idea to limit the internet? I heard a rumor that Rockefeller and Snowe are on board with it. [think i'm gonna puke]

I love they way that FDL consistently stands against minions of the Anti-Christ like Simpson.

I trust this is the genuine FDL site.

Here’s the deal, and we make Simpson agree to it (or I take off his arms and beat him with them on camera): EVERY cut in SocSec, Medicare, and Medicaid sees an equivalent cut in Congress pay, retirement, and health insurance.

The government criminals need to eat the same shit they are trying to force feed THEIR OWNERS (that would be We the People).

Have to say, I laughed when I heard that. Are the people of Wyoming getting true representation when they have a Senator making comments like that?

All 545,000 of them.

Have to say, I admire Alex Lawson for maintaining his composure during this interview in spite of all the uncalled for derogatory name calling by the Senator.

When Lawson attempts to qualify ‘two wars’ as part of the government’s deficit spending, Simpson rebukes him, “You pick your crap, I’ll pick what’s real.” His defense is a total offense, basically shouting down the opponent, by calling what he is saying, ‘crap’ and unreal. He does not allow the defense department budget or the money spent on waging wars to become ‘real’ and valid for discussion. The tragic conclusion to this committee may be that the targeted programs are really damaged and that people are impoverished because of that. I could see how a populist candidate could swiftly rise to power if there was a voter backlash in response to the cold, arrogant, indifference we are seeing in Simpson and Nelson.

Jon Walker is upstairs!
Marijuana Legalization Possibly Headed to Detroit Ballot

I didn’t watch the video, just read the transcript, and there were lots of laugh out loud moments. The only problem is, this isn’t even remotely funny. They have a belligerent ignorant, and quite possibly increasingly demented old man serving on the committee. This is completely indefensible and a betrayal of the responsibility to the public of those who determined committee membership.

What happened to government by, of, and for the people? Must have been another era I guess…

I am not sure how I can articulate what I am advocating much clearer. Discontinue the medications and treatments superfluous to keeping them comfortable.

Who should make the decision? Where possible, the person him or herself. Several years ago I had a client who had been going to dialysis for twenty years. Both legs were amputated at the hip, and he was in constant pain. When he asked me what would happen if he quit dialysis, I told him, and encouraged him to visit with his pastor. He did visit with his pastor, he quite dialysis, and he died four days later.

When there is nobody home in the brain, the family makes the decision. When there is nobody home in the brain, and no family, the physician makes that decision in consultation with relevant nursing home staff.

Right now the populist outrage and mobilization is on the right. If we fail to bring out bodies into the streets to counter theirs, we may find ourselves with a populist nationalist a la Mussolini. We remain passive at our peril.

Something we can finally agree on:)

I’m under the impression that’s the way it is now. cregan and yourself seemed to be suggesting something different.

No, unfortunately, that is not how it works in reality, most of the time.

That’s very mysterious. Do you not want to say what you think? Are you in favor of medical staff being able to remove care from patients over the objections of their families, or against their legally expressed wishes?

Has anyone tried laser-mic’ing the door to the meeting room? I don’t know how good the dampening and sound insulation is, but it might be worth a try. Perhaps if there’s any steel plating around the latch/handle, etc. it might make for a better resonating surface.

As far as I know it only works on windows, you need a high Q.

This conversation is more evidence that if you want your loved ones to be happy and functioning to best level keep then out of nursing hones. Yes the caretakers love them. They love them to death because that is how they experience their role in the community. Well meaning but deadly.

What is the evidence that treating all treatable conditions regardless of age actually increases total medical costs? Most of the costs in the last months of life are not related to specific treatment but simple basic care. Unless euthanasia is resorted to it is unlikely withholding treatment will decrease costs to any significant degree.

Simpson’s aggressive doublespeak is disappointing. The payment of the bond obligations of the United States taxpayers should not be in dispute. We must show “Good Faith” and “Credit” toward our elderly citizens. Simpson says that we benefited by spend social security taxes on the Interstate Highways. Conversely, those same highways must have generated enough tax revenue from the increase business activity to pay the money back. Otherwise, why were they built in the first place?

An elderly patient saying they are ready to die will not be advised they have the right to discontinue, for example, their heart medication. In general, they will be regarded as being depressed, and will be started on an anti-depressant.

In most situations, even at the request of the elderly person, the physician will not discontinue medications, again such as heart meds, until at the very end of life where the physician will right an order for “comfort care.”

In a situation where the elderly person wishes to die, but the family is against that decision, I have yet to see a physician go against the family’s wishes in favor of the wishes of the elderly person.

There are there rare situations where I am consulted to evaluate the mental competency of the elderly person in order to give an opinion as to whether they have the mental capability of giving informed consent to discontinue treatment/medications, as well as to screen them for depression. In most situations, even though in my professional opinion they are competent to give informed consent and are not depressed, the physician almost always goes with the wishes of the family.

Nonsense

Very selfish of the family but I don’t know what you can do about it. There should be a way for the patients to say that they will make the decisions if they are capable. I would be furious if my family did that to me.

I see the complexity. Still, I don’t agree with cregan’s joyful suggestion.

I stand by my observations.

OK, two points. First, many nursing home residents, who are going to die, are transported to the ER, and admitted and die in intensive care after having been intubated, etc., etc.

Second, end-stage renal disease is treatable with dialysis, and you can keep a comatose patient physically alive for many years. That is just one example. With heart meds, you can keep a comatose patient with a bad heart alive for years as well. So, these are treatable conditions; make sense to you to exercise them?

The ones I’m familiar with are designed to be pointed at an object inside a room through a window. Based on that, I figure if enough of the vibration is making its way to the surface of the door, it might be possible to make out some of what’s being said. The problem of course would be identifying who said it, and whether or not it was intelligible enough at all.

It’s rarely wise to do something just because you can. In addition to my LIving Will I have told my children to pull the plug. I don’t wish to be a living relic.

I agree, there should be. And yes, there is much complexity. Especially when dealing with a family wherein there is no agreement amongst the family as to what action should be taken. I have all too often seen the family member who took no interest in their parent demand that all efforts be made to keep their parent alive.

It really takes a physician with courage to stand-up against this sort of thing.

Which Twain, this is why you sit down with your kids and hash this out ahead of time; just having a living will doesn’t necessarily get it.

And be clear; the Right to Lifers believe in preserving the life of the elderly as long as possible, no matter their own or their families wishes.

Marion: Here is a funny little tidbit about John Barrow. Over 20 years ago when he was practicing law in Athens as a “young” lawyer, he was at the firm Winburn, Lewis & Barrow. The law student clerks called the firm “Windburn, Sunburn & Diaper Rash.” The late Gene Mac Winburn (RIP) and Lamar Lewis were/are fine lawyers and pillars of the community, so no disrespect to them was intended. As for Rep. Barrow, some things never change.

Really? I thought the window was used as a diaphragm, I could be mistaken.

Isn’t it unbelievable that the Right to Lifers feel that they can interfere in other people’s business? They are going to need some real grit if they go up against my children.

When it comes down to it, that is the responsibility the family must carry, whatever their actions.

I am not willing to get into case by case discussion but will stipulate to some change in guidelines for treatment of brain dead patients. Though I thought that was pretty well settled. That is not what the article Cregan was referencing is talking about, nor does it appear to be the only group you have posted about.

There are movements, some well organized that are pressing for simply no medical care beyond a certain age. Even Bill Gates on a recent tv program questioned whether a 75 yr old should have a knee transplant. If you know much about the subject you likely know that cataract surgery, hip and knee replacements are probably the most cost effective procedures in the elderly, permitting them to avoid needing long term care.

If money is your thing show me the figures proving that there would be any significant cost savings. I have not seen any comprehensive studies, only for the specific conditions mentioned above.

This ugly fucker is the true face of Obama phred. This commission is Obama’s creation. And Obama is the true face of the Democratic Party. Old people will be impoverished so that rich people can get richer. Brought to you by the Democratic Party.

It’s crystal clear, yet there are still Obamabots.

Good, good point. I will not donate through Act Blue again until they prune them dogs.

You are correct that hip, knee and cataract surgeries are very cost effective in enabling elderly to remain at home. And, I have no problem at all with these being funded, no matter what the age. That does not negate my fundamental premise that there are a whole bunch of elderly being kept alive because we can, and at great expense, who would rather be allowed to die, and a whole bunch who are not there anymore, but still kept alive.

And you know, with the latter group, it really is not that difficult to make the determination.

I agree with you. Have you ever read Dorian Gray? Simpson is Obama’s portrait ; )

Death Panels.

We, my wife and I, last saw my wife’s life long friend in a nursing home in Cloverdale, California. Out on the terrace, a nice scene overlooking a valley with its opposing hills, a very vinyard sort of scene. Except for the 8 or 10 vultures soaring in the afternoon updrafts, as the few elderly able walked their walks in the mindless Califonria sun.

She died a short time after. No help for ailments, no call for expert help.
Medicaid put her therir. Medicare was all she had. She was caught up on a vortex of surgeions greed, and caretaker’s callousness.

It’s important to note that sometime just past the 20 minute mark in the livestream, Alex Lawson comments that Speak Out is conducting a public service announcement in the committee chambers. Speak Out is a spawn, a moneyed spawn of Pete Peterson. Are these goats that they soil the public soil of ours?

What incredible arrogance and callousedness.

Please tell me you have spent significant time in nursing homes. Please tell me you have cared for an elderly relative in your home.

Life and death decisions are made every day, and often for the wrong reason. For you to characterize what I am saying as “death panels” reduces you to the intellect of Sarah Palin. Yes, when an individual does not know their name, does not recognize anyone, has to be fed, has no bowel or bladder control, and largely is only responsive to pain, yep, that is an easy call. To characterize such decisions as a death panel is, in my opinion, cowardly. It is an unwillingness to deal with the reality of the world. Now, if you think it is reasonable to spend $50,000 yearly to keep that individual’s heart, lungs and bowels functioning, then you think that is the right thing to do.

Ah, now I understand the problem!

Workers are supposed to die at age 57.

Obama sure picked the right man in Alan Simpson to fix that problem.

We spend 2.8 Trillion a year on health care in the US for what? So the health industry can spend 2/3 of Medicare in the last 12 months of life? A neighbor went in for the triple slam, carteroid clean outs and a ballooning vein. He died 2 weeks after the third operation.

And you know, with the latter group, it really is not that difficult to make the determination.

It should alwaysbe difficult to bring about the death of any living creature and I suppose especially humans.

The hubris in that statement is what is so disturbing.

You make it sound so logical with the descriptions and examples you give. But the reality is that is not the condition of the majority of nursing home residents, especially when they are first admitted. Often the “comas” and weakness and confusion are the results of medications given to “keep them comfortable.”

If he hadn’t died in the process of trying to keep him functional he might well have consumed years of care; unconscious.

Why don’t you just say you believe in euthanizing the elderly before they get too expensive?

Simpson is an optimist. We have only 109 million full time job holders in the US and 57 million on SS or SSI or Disability. That 2.55 Trillion lock box is only good for 120 Billion a year right now at 4.93 percent interest, and that is going down.

http://www.socialsecurity.gov/OACT/ProgData/fundFAQ.html#n3
http://www.socialsecurity.gov/cgi-bin/investheld.cgi

I could dream that my subject to change predicted benefits will come through but I doubt that when the trust fund empties in 2037 or whenever the job holders will be willing to keep on paying.

Before messing with SS though I agree with the posters talking about where that 2.5 Trillion went to, wars, defense industry, bailouts, subsidies etc etc. We should fix those now.

My neighbor wasn’t unconscious. He was just in pain. He got sold a bill of goods, and the US paid for it. Profit maximization has them do the most dangerous operation last heh?

I have nothing I need to prove to you, I guarantee it.

You can squawk and tussle in discomfort all you want, but what you’re insinuating about is a death panel. It seems rather cowardly of you to be so delicate about hearing the term. Find your composure.

Simpson is an asshole.

Simpson has always been an arrogant piece of shit. Perfect guy for Obama.

Jeez, I’m so glad that the commission is stocked with empathetic people who are going about their work with compassion. Imagine what a panel full of arrogant pricks would come up with?

I actually know a similar story. They replaced his hip, then discovered he had bone cancer and 6 months to live. Let’s remember that it was the doctors who lobbied against any form of medicare for all during the HCR battle because they got more money from the insurance companies than from medicare. I had one tell me the same right here on FDL. He said he had a lot of college loans to pay off, so we can thank Greenspan and the bankers for that too.

That interview was awesome.

FDL should put up a fact box explaining the issues with social security. It’s not that complicated, but guys like Alan Simpson love to confuse people.

I am so old, I remember when Simpson was in Congress. And he was considered one of the GOOD Republipigs!

Sometimes it doesn’t seem like it, but we ARE making progress.

This kinda jibes w/ what I’m thinking — Most Tea Partiers are Good Americans who have been sold a bill of goods and have had their baser passions inflamed. I’ve found that if I just let my Fox-watching neighbors rant long enough, they’ll say something I can agree with. The agreement builds trust (even though they remember me from my longhair days) that we’re not totally from different planets, and provides a way forward.

The point is, we’re all Merikuns here, we’ve all got reasons to feel pissed-on and pissed-off. I feel distinctly un-threatened by my neighbors’ expressions of honest rage relative to the DISHONEST crap like the “cat food commission”. Unlike the Good Germans of two generations back, each of my teabagging neighbors has queers, brown people, hippies, etc close enough in their family circle that it stops them from being totally bigoted. I just keep emphasizing that “us peons” have more in common w/ each other than we do with the Class that Is Making War On Us!

ALAN SIMPSON: We’re really working on solvency… the key is solvency

Answer is Progressive Taxes. The ones we had till end of 1960s with the top bracket paying 90% (on a progressive scale, so still being rich then others with incentive to make more & work hard still present). We had un-interrupted growth in the economy and society was a more genuine, friendly place. If one doesnot believe it watch the movies of that era which is a reflection of the time and you will see the difference. Test of Time has proved that strategy works.

SIMPSON: We’re trying to take care of the lesser people in society

BTW. How many of the social security panelists are non-millionaries or whose net worth is less than a million that they have a perspective of how the lesser people make their living. Is this panel a representative of the American population that they make to recommendations on behalf of everybody. Anyway this exchange simply confirms my guess that panelists are chosen for their pre-conceived opinions and so answers are already in. So all the hulla-balloo in the panel is about how to show a well run solvent system to be in trouble to public.

SIMPSON: Just listen, will you listen to me instead of babbling? In the year 2037, instead of getting 100% of your check, you are going to get about 75% of your check. That’s if you touch nothing. If you like that, fine. You’ll be picking with the chickens yourself when you’re 65.

Well, we will worry about that than in year 2037. Panel, can we focus our thoughts and energies on current issues like creating jobs instead of year 2037 issues and ending in a responsible manner an unjustified war in Iraq which will save lots of invaluable lives and ton of money.

Finally in my opinion it can only be democrats who can put a tweak in social security to dis-mantle it in a generation since Republicans know if they touch it they will lose by a landslide in the next election and will be brought back. So Republicans might grumble but will not touch it.

Money for roads comes from the transportation trust, filled to the brim with gasoline tax money.

10 cans of fancy feast for $7 is a SALE????

At Meier’s, the REGULAR price is 60 cents/can, and it was just on sale for 30 cents/can last week.

I understand your paranoia and one now in this world of selfish profit is the greatest virtue one never knows. But…

Those procedures are intended to prevent brain damage including unconsciousness which untreated he likely would have fallen into. Money would have been saved had he survived and was saved by his dying in the process of humanely treating pain and trying to keep him functional.

Actually the majority of physicians favored and still do Medicare for all. Obama trotted our his own white coats but according to all the polls they were in the minority..

So they found bone cancer at surgery? What does that have to do with anything? Unless you think expensive MRIs should be done on the whole body before deciding to treat?

Arrogant.

He should never receive one bit of tax payer money if that is how he represents as a senator.

He works for US, the citizens.

Get a humble work attitude Senator Simpson.

“You people” senator, are YOUR BOSSES. Get respectful sir.

“They never knew there was a baby boom in ’83″

Yeah, that one popped out at me, too. Maybe the single stupidest thing said in the entire interview. I’m sorry Alex didn’t do a better job jumping all over it. I know I learned about the baby boom in school in the 70s. While I suppose it might be possible that my public school had access to demographic information that the Greenspan Commission did not… its far more likely that Alan Simpson is a moran.

He is not a Senator. Retired some years ago.

Here’s the deal that was made in 1983. Tip O’Neill and Ronald Reagan agreed to double FICA taxes – mainly paid by the poor and middle class – to build up the SS Trust Fund so baby boomers could get their SS checks from the 2010s to the 2040s without bankrupting the country. Reagan passed huge trickle down supply income tax cuts for the rich promising it would launch an era of prosperity and increased tax revenues that would more than offset the loss of revenues from those tax cuts. Never happened. It was an utter fail that has left us with trillions in debt. And now that the bill is coming due and poor and middle class Americans are ready to retire Simpson who voted for such wastes of our money as Reagan’s stupid tax cuts, his 700 ship navy and Star Wars wants to back out of the deal. You want to fix it? Go back to taxing the rich at the same rate Eisenhower did when we actually built the interstate hwy system Mr. Simpson – sans the loopholes. Marginal income tax rates of 90% on the highest wage earners and lifting the SS cap won’t save us but it’s about time they started pulling their own weight.

I am 62, which makes me a member of the baby-boomer generation. That term was well known in the 1960′s when we came of age and hit the streets protesting the war in Vietnam.

We paid and continue to pay for our social security by paying the FICA tax. I have been paying my FICA taxes since I started working when I was 14. That’s 48 years and it’s a lot of money.

Obama the corporatist war criminal and his greedy heartless antediluvian role models that make up the Catfood Commission intend to default on the government bonds, or IOUs to pay back our money that the government borrowed without our consent.

This is theft, pure and simple. No amount of bullshit yelling, screaming, and intimidation can change that fact.

End of story!

We paid and continue to pay for our social security by paying the FICA tax. I have been paying my FICA taxes since I started working when I was 14. That’s 48 years and it’s a lot of money

But doncha know social security is a giveaway to the lazy? Just like your Medicare for which 3% off the top of your earnings has been being paid in all your working life.

They are scoundrels.

Simpson sounds as dotty as Palin.

He’s saying the government has borrowed SS money and now it is adding to the deficit to have to pay it back.

They stole our money and now they are figuring out how to weasel out of paying it back.

What a hideously ugly and destructive monster Simpson is. How could our president, Hopey-Changey, put this awful grotesque in charge of this commission?

Perhaps because hopey-dopey is a hideously ugly and destructive monster too, in his own way under the slick, no-drama veneer. At this point, what else is one to think? If Obama thinks he will dance with the devil, well, you can’t. The devil dances with you.
. .

I suspect that the purpose Obama serves most of all to the “owners” is to keep the agenda advancing without allowing a critical mass of dissension to be reached. If that happens, then the “owners” heads will also roll, literally. So, turn the heat down, a bit, for now, to allow the frogs to re-acclimate to their constantly deteriorating conditions but not jump out and save themselves.
. .

Whether Obama understands this and is a willing servant, like a Bush, or is a patsy, I am still not certain but I am leaning to willing. That’s too bad because he could have changed the meme and short circuited the Fascism we are in, but has failed on every opportunity to do so, thus far. I suspect that only way to move this country back to the people will be by 18th century means.

Simpson uses the word “I.O.U.s” as if they are a worthless piece of paper. Those are treasuries. The government used the money from treasuries it sold to the SS to do whatever. As long as the government had a positive cash flow, there was no problem, but now Simpson wants the government to default.

Greengiant (comment 107)

does not understand Social Security financing. neither do most people. including the President.

Social Security has nothing to do with the deficit. It is not welfare. It is a way for workers to pay for (insure) their own retirement. The government role is essentially to protect their savings from inflation by pay as you go with wage indexing.

The projected shortfall will only occur if the next generation lives longer than the last. if those people want the same level of benefits over a longer retirement (they will) they can pay for it with a payroll tax increase that amounts to 20 cents per week per year, while wages are going up ten dollars per week per year.

Medicare will be more expensive because medical care will be more expensive. Expecting higher medical costs is not the time to cut your insurance. The good news is that even if nothing is done to control costs, Medicare will rise as a percent of income, but in absolute terms after you have paid for Medicare and Social Security you will have twice as much money as you have today… because wages are expect to rise as well.

The whole “deficit commission” is based on a lie. The fact that you can’t get a hearing from the President, the Congress, or the Press, should tell you something about where American democracy has come to.

You’ve got to love the new candor in our civil discourse this week, talking so openly about the “little” people, or the “small” people. I’m so glad the “big” people care about us “small” folks. Everything’s going to be alright.

I read about these Congressional commissions all the time which recommend massive closures of a lot of the military bases, mostly in the South, which from my understanding, constitutes most of what the South has left for an economy. Which is the only reason these things even exist. Most of these commissions recommendations are ignored because of the earmarking by southern Congresspersons who are, not surprisingly, Republican and of course shamelessly hypocritical about budgetary discipline. I expect to hear a LOT more talk about closing a LOT of useless military bases before I even care to discuss this pile of crapola from the very aptly named “catfood commission.” How many bases did Simpson have in his state and how has he voted on closure of military bases.

I’m confused. Why didn’t the senator wring his neck and grab his wrist? Isn’t that SOP in these situations?

Unfortunately, AARP is a shill for the Obama administration
and the seniors listen to their spin.
As always, AARP’s reasoning is the lesser of the evils btw the corporatist Rethugs & the corporatist Dumbocrats
but never the populist, anti-war, people before profits, percolate up economic philosophy that it
will take to save the ‘Merikan Empire from doom.

Let me just say that my generation was ‘asked’ to pay double into Social Security, and we did, because it was not optional. Social Security in NOT an entitlement program. It is a forced retirement savings plan, automatically taken out of our paychecks. It is my money and I want every penny of it back.

If Congress and Obama are looking for entitlement programs to cut, I suggest they eliminate the LIFETIME MEDICAL BENEFITS that THEY enjoy at the expense of the taxpayer.

The Lesser People??? Are you kidding me, Alan Simpson???

What a giant hack that old bag is!

I agree. Strange that in the land of the free and the home of the brave,
we can’t voluntarily choose to exit this world with the help of our doctor
so that we have a dignified death. Yes Virginia, it’s all about the money.

I agree, he has the makings of a great journalist.

so will FDL set up an alternative to ActBlue ??

A lot of my Tea Party friends would join the Tea Party Branch of the Democratic Party –
except we don’t have one.
If it wasn’t for the fact that the Leadership of the Democratic Party is so stupid, incompetent,
and dishonest, the Republicans would never win an election.
During the Bush years, my Tea Party friends were against him too.
Both political parties keep screwing everything up, so the voters keep rotating them.
Ah nuts — pass me another Foster beer mate.

They should end the farce of deficit and just call it Social Security and Medicare destruction. Deficit reduction would eliminate the Reagan, Bush and Bush tax cuts, and Corporate welfare.

Another reform, that is reform in name only(RINO). Sick of it.

Wonder what is wrong with Obama, talk only no results.

Can we afford Social Security and Medicare ??
Can we afford to have adequate and competent school teachers, firefighters
and law enforcement officers (think BP and Massey Coal) ??
Can we afford to have legal services for low income ”lessor” people ??
Can we afford to have a safety net for those who lose their jobs, incomes and housing
because of the capitalist economic cycles, injury or death of the wage earner ??
Can we afford to have decent medical care available to all ??

what about . . .

Can we afford the continual wars of foreign occupation,
& the Wall St bail-outs,
& the corporate socialism
for the military-industrial complex,
& the medical/pharma industrial complex, & the Big Ag industrial complex,
& the privatized military contractors, & the privatized prison system complex,
& the tax cuts for the extremely wealthy, etc. etc.

One person, one vote.
At last count, I think the ”lessor” people outnumbered the non-lessor people.
But how do we get the lessor people to stop drinking the Kool-Aid ??
Obama, HELP ME — PLEASE.
To be continued . . .

Lawson did great work here but (at least in the transcript) there is one key point that does not come up. I think this is exactly why Simpson is so aggressive and spews so much nonsense — because this is the point he does not WANT to come up. It is simply “the cap” or more technically, the “wage base.” People earning more than a specific dollar amount don’t pay any Social Security on their earnings past that point. Currently, it’s $106,000. If I made $110,000 (and I don’t!), I would pay on 106 and not on the 4,000 above that. If I made a million… well, here, read how it works if you’re paid a million. Anyone who sounds alarms about Soc Sec “going broke” without MENTION of eliminating or deeply redefining the cap is either a moron or, well, the kind of soulless traitor we’ve been talking about here — traitor in the sense of one who will sacrifice the lives of his own countrymen to please the powerful. Details –

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Security_Wage_Base:

“In 2010, the Social Security Wage Base is $106,800 and the Social Security tax rate is 6.20% paid by the employee and 6.20% paid by the employer.[1] A person with $10,000 of gross income will have $620.00 withheld as Social Security tax from his check, with the employer sending an additional $620.00. A person with $110,000 of gross income in 2010 incurs Social Security tax of $6,621.60 (resulting in an effective rate of approximately 6% – the rate is lower because the income is more than the 2010 “wage base”, see below), with $6,621.60 paid by the employer. A person earning a million dollars in wages will pay the same $6,621.60 in Social Security tax (resulting in an effective rate of approximately 0.66%), with similar employer matching.”

Read the Report of the National Commission on Social Security Reform (Jan 1983) http://www.ssa.gov/history/reports/gspan.html Follow that with this, the Summary of the Trustees Report (Jun 24, 1983) which discusses the baby boom, that Sen Simpson says nobody knew existed in 1983: http://www.ssa.gov/history/pdf/1983.pdf Look at table three on page seven of that June 24, 1983 Trustees report, which graphs out and predicts quite well the higher life expectancies, which Sen Simpson also said nobody knew about in 1983. See SSAConnect.com http://tinyurl.com/2etze43

Gee, SS will be at 70% in 2037, but we SOMEHOW just managed to find $8 TRILLION in less that a year to bail out Wall St:

http://www.sitemason.com/files/eowqtO/bailouttallymay2010.pdf

Amazing how that works.

And Alan wants to default on the T-bills being held by SS. Even Bernanke isn’t that stupid.

There are some rather simple ways to fix SS such as raising the cap (as ennuendo points points out above), but once again, the choice is to bail out the elites that wrecked the world’s economy with taxpayer dollars and screw the rest of us.

Good job, Obama.

What really causes the federal debt is NOT Social Security, which is OWED about $2.4 trillion by the federal government because that is the to-date surplus that has been collected via payroll taxes, but not paid out over the years. Again, Social Security has a $2.4 trillion surplus!
In a cruel twist of logic, conservatives try to make it look like Social Security has added to the federal debt, when THE OPPOSITE IS TRUE. The more people realize that blaming Social Security and other “entitlements” for our increasing federal debt is false, the more they will begin to look for the true reasons for the debt, which are the wars and our military commitments.
For a concise, cogent explanation of all this, see this webpage: http://www.warresisters.org/pages/piechart.htm

***Mod Note: Edited for Readability***