Welcome to the liveblog on the House of Representative’s health insurance reform vote live on C-Span). Whether you support the bill or opposite it, whether the bill passes or doesn’t this is a historic vote.
If a potential deal is struck with the Stupak bloc and the “pro-choice” caucus does not bolt, there would seem to be little standing in the way of the bills final passage.
CBS News has a preliminary schedule as of last night:
2 p.m.: The House will debate for one hour the rules of debate for the reconciliation bill and the Senate bill.
3 p.m.: The House will vote to end debate and vote on the rules of the debate.
3:15 p.m.: The House will debate the reconciliation package for two hours.
5:15 p.m.: The House will vote on the reconciliation package.
5:30 p.m.: The House will debate for 15 minutes on a Republican substitute and then vote on the substitute.
6 p.m.: The House will vote on the final reconciliation package.
6:15 p.m.: If the reconciliation bill passes, the House will immediately vote on the Senate bill, without debate.
Expect Democrats to deliver floor speeches about how this bill is the best piece of legislation ever and expect Republicans to talk about how it is the end of our nation as we know it.
Yesterday Republicans introduced three amendments regarding the individual mandate, so expect much of their focus to be on that. Although these amendments have no chance of being allowed onto the floor for a vote, they do give some insight insight into what the upcoming GOP campaign against the bill will be in the midterm election.
The liveblog will be mainly focused on statements in support or opposition from previously undecided Democrats, Republican statements which might probably form the basis of attack ads in the midterm, and of course the series of procedural votes.
2:00 pm – Happening right now is are votes on matters unrelated to health care. This allows the Democrats to make sure all their members are in the chamber and gives the whip a final chance to make sure the votes are locked down. As always it looks like Congress is going to run a little behind schedule.
2:13 pm – The debate on health care reform has finally began.
2:17 pm – Rep. Paul Ryan (R) begins by raising a point of order related to the large number of “unfunded” mandates in the bill. Ryan’s talking point mandates, mandates, mandates!
2:27 pm – Patrick Kennedy (D-RI), son of Ted Kennedy, ask the chamber to support this health care reform bill in memory of Ted Kennedy. He compares fight to universal health care to civil rights.
2:40 pm – Paul Ryan makes completely absurd statement that we are setting up the same bureaucracies that they have in Britain’s actual socialized health care system. If we actually do that our health care cost would be cut by more than 50%.
2:42 pm – They are now voting on Ryan’s point of order if it did pass it would kill the bill. Expect this vote to closely mirror, but not be identical, to the final vote on the bill.
3:03 pm – The point of order failed with 228 voting with the Democrats.
3:07 pm – Rep. Darrell Issa (R-CA) offered a motion to recommit the bill to remove the earmarks. Not surprisingly “earmarks” have been a big Republican talking point against the bill.
3:10 pm – Rep. Louise Slaughter (D-NY) makes the point that most of the state specific deals in the health care bill will be removed by the reconciliation measure.
3:18 pm – Dale Kildee (D-MI) said he is confident that the Senate bill as written would not use federal money to fund abortion. (He is of course entirely correct regardless what Stupak says.)
3:24 pm – Rep. Christopher Smith (R-NJ) is falsely claiming that the Senate bill would spend massive amounts of federal money on abortion. He claims “abortion is not health care.”
3:28 pm – CNN is reporting that a Stupak press conference will take place at 4 pm. If Stupak’s bloc decides to vote in mass for the bill it will pass baring a large revolt from pro-choice Democrats. (Just imagine of progressive had held firm on their demands for a public option like the Stupak bloc did.)
3:34 pm – Rep. David Dreier (R-CA) got into a bit of a yelling match with Slaughter making the point that at the end of today only the Senate bill will become law with all its special deals. They special deals will only be taken out when the reconciliation bill passed the House and the Senate. Expect Democrats to be attacked by Republicans in the midterm for voting for the special deals in the Senate bill.
3:40 pm – This is some really slow walking and lack of decorum from the Republicans. Jesse Jackson Jr. is doing a good job as chair handling dozens of parliamentary inquiries.
3:34 pm – A 15 minute vote on the point of order on earmarks is now taking place.




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Zed?
Booya!!
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public’s money. – Alexis de Tocqueville
And away we go!
We’re toast.
Zed’s dead, baby.
Why don’t they just suspend the rules of the House, let Ratzi the Nazi come down there in his Pope Suit, speak his piece in like five minutes since he’s paid good money to Stupak et al and get the vote on.
I mean really, just cut out the middle-men and get the former head of the Inquisition to make his point, then he can head out to have sex with a young male hooker… Bart can probably set it up via Craigslist, and I hear there’s a nice quiet house on C-Street, with low-cost furnished rooms.
anyway!
“Nice furniture.”
Patrick Kennedy: obligatory honor my father blah blah blah.
Excellent point.
Tanner and Davis are ‘no’s. Voted no 1st time.
Somehow envision Obama Creed coming down from the rafters, with his Uncle Sam hat on, in boxing gear, with “Living In America” blaring from the loudspeakers.
You would think the way the Ds are talking this bill will actually do something good. Nov. will tell the tale.
There’s about 5 votes in the Stupak bloc, right? Here’s what Obama said back in 2007 (video, 5½ minute mark, skip around if there’s no sound):
I guess he was foreshadowing his eventual betrayal of what he also called a “fundamental freedom”.
Don’t think we have ever had a bill quite like this. The Rs are voting “no” for the wrong reasons and the Dems are voting “yes” for the wrong reasons. A pox on all.
What about Sanchez and Boucher? I thought they were “no”, but in the latest FDL count, they seem to be undecided.
I believe that Sanchez is a yes now.
The latest FDL count says 9.
It’s like bizarro world for sure! Big corporations are sitting back today, sipping their expensive alcoholic bevvies, grinning like cheshire cats, and asking each other who we gonna throw the most money at for the rest of the year boys.
Yes, it is truly remarkable how many were prescient way back when; ever read Washington’s farewell address? He warned about ‘political parties’. Many of the ‘founding fathers’ were concerned exactly with what this nation has become.
Help defeat Bart Stupak in his zeal to kill reform by supporting his primary challenger, Connie Saltonstall.
Visit: http://www.actblue.com/page/defeat-bart-stupak
Bart Stupak stated (in an interview on FOX News) that he does not listen to the nuns because these courage women and nuns are “lower” on the Catholic Churches’ hierarchy.
Part of me is starting to believe this has all been a giant ploy on Bart Stupak’s part to blow up his name recognition without paying for it.
Christ, I hope he comes back in the next life as a woman with Tribble-like multiplying ovarian cysts whose insurance won’t cover their removal because the D&C procedure is “too much like an abortion.”
They’re really laying it on thick; Pelosi marching with 1965 Medicare Gavel
Control your gag reflexes:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100321/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_health_care_moment_in_history
Gather the kids, Maw, it’s historic!
This certainly is going to pass. Stupak will fold, as he intended all along. He is only looking for a fig leaf.
Now, the real battle begins.
Democrats in the Congress have been living in a bubble for the last few weeks. That is going to end rudely in a few days.
In their mutual back slapping sessions they can convince each other they are wonderful.
But, the public, on both sides, isn’t buying it.
They can shout CBO all they want. People are not stupid. No one who doesn’t depend on money from the party believes what the CBO says. They KNOW this will cost more and earn less than projected. It always does. They really are not stupid.
The Dem’s can get some bubble headed news caster to just “Uh-huh” their talk of the CBO, but among the public it is, and will continue, to fall on deaf ears.
Dem’s will want to talk about pre-existing conditions (which don’t start for adults until 4 years from now), etc. But, the public will want to talk about:
1. mandates
2. plumping up insurance companies with government money.
3. no public option
4. No cost containment
5. the new bureaucratic structure needed to support this Rube Goldberg deal.
and on an on. Since they have only had a ready audience in their fellow Reps and staff recently, they don’t realize the deaf ears their baloney is going to fall on once they get out of the capital.
Tocqueville, always the optimist. Instead, the Democrats end up bribing the insurance companies and PhRMA with the public’s money.
“The numbers are huge: the United States has 11 million illegal immigrants (or in the movement’s preferred phrase, undocumented workers) and millions more who are descendants of immigrants, and even more millions who have become American citizens. In the face of such numbers — Hispanics are the nation’s largest minority at some 40 million — legislation opening a way for illegal immigrants to reach legal status is viewed by advocates as the only acceptable and sane solution. That’s understood, on the right and left, Democrats and Republicans, border hawks and bleeding hearts.
But timing for such an overhaul couldn’t be worse. After the long and bruising fight for health care reform, the Democrats and President Obama have exhausted political capital and worn thin the patience of the American people. You can almost picture Americans out there in the middle of the country, which is to say most of the country, nodding off or shaking their heads in disbelief at the thought that coming around the bend is another nationwide brawling town-hall-style shouting match — this time over immigration laws.
From here and note what the legislation says about immigrants. Gonna be some pissed off hispanics.
It must be a very tough situation for them. Actually, the republicans could be in big trouble if they actually stopped all of our money going to the health industry thugs. But I am sure, it should not be a problem for them because the democrats have come to the rescue for them.
NBC reporting that Bart Stupid is “poised for a yes vote”.
Every Nun working in hospitals, hospices, shelters and other places like that should just take a day off and when their “more important” male “superiors” ask why they are not at work they should simply reply that they are waiting for either that person or Bart Stupak to come and do their job for them, after all, they’re just not that important, Bart said so.
…if the GOP is so proud of their henchman, Paul Ryan’s bill, why are they hiding it?
…why are they not bragging about their plan?
In an interview, John Boner said Paul Ryan is on his own.
During the GOP medicare bill reconcilliation process, the Democrats were literally locked out from the conferences.
Don’t forget the provision that says insurance companies can not charge those of us over 55 and under 65 more than 3 times the younger people. Soon the democrats are going to have to pass a bill raising the minimum wage from $7. How else will they force us to fund the lobbyists (pimps) so they can pay the democrats(whores) what they have earned.
I agree.
The news of the under-the-table deals last summer hasn’t really broken yet. Nor have:
* The realization that the hated IRS has become the collection agency for the medical-insurance cartel, AHIP.
* There’s no restriction on out-of-pocket expenses (copay and deductible), IIRC.
* This represents a tax increase on the middle class.
* This represents a reduction in Medicare benefits.
* This represents a direct pipeline from the U.S. Treasury (which will subsidize premiums) to the coffers of AHIP members, who can raise premiums at will.
An historic victory for our ‘Narcissist-in-Chief’, all the good little foot soldiers falling on their swords for him.
The hill is reporting that Dems don’t have the votes unless they get Stupak.
Kill the Bill!
There’s nothing to keep these insurance companies from charging us huge rates for a worthless product and everything inn this bill is geared toward encouraging them to do just that.
Exactly. Congress spills the Treasury to the cartels, who flood the public with propaganda and bribe the politicians and pocket the rest.
Stupak has successfully maneuvered himself, just as he did last November, into a position that guarantees that the White House (last time it was Pelosi) must offer concessions, or face defeat.
Amazing…
Kucinich, Grijalva, Woolsey…are you paying attention?
Bart Stupak is taking all of you to school.
Yeah, pretty remarkable how silent it has been since the regulatory function was taken out of the bill to satisfy reconciliation rules. No statements from Dem ‘leadership’ or Obama on that issue.
That’s right…the Dems admitted that our premiums will go up…but their bill will slow the rate of increase. HA.
And the more I think about it, the more irritated I am.
If they WERE passing Medicare for All, I think it would be a neat idea. But what they’re (probably) going to pass doesn’t remotely resemble it, and somewhat tarnishes the historical gavel.
Blech.
“Don’t forget the provision that says insurance companies can not charge those of us over 55 and under 65 more than 3 times the younger people.” ; and why do you suppose that has not received media attention?
Ryan and now Issa – the Point Of Order guard…
Question:
Is Stupak willing to kill the bill? If progressives wanted to they could join Stupak, bail on this bad bill and force Congress to start over. Would they?
FDL has 208 “yes”, 209 “no”, 14 “uncommitted” (9 Stupakers + 5 others). So Dem leadership needs to get at least three Stupakers.
I think they’ve shown that they haven’t the nerve. I mean, how would that look?
How would it look to those they claim to represent? Probably pretty good. Politics does make strange bedfellows…
Absolutely, I agree with you. I would love it! But you know how the Republicans and MSM would chortle, and the centrists would pile on…
His leverage is that nobody knows for sure. Hostage takers need a credible threat of the sort that bleeding-heart liberals can never have until they actually kill some save-the-children legislation.
If Diana DeGette could support the idea of an EO, surely no pro-life Democrat could join her—and no one who joins her could be called a pro-life Democrat.
Who cares. Really? The MSM would love it…it was a bad bill…the public opinion was ALWAYS against it… the loser would be Obama, not the American people.
From here:
You just completely arbitrarily assigned which goods and services fall under “general welfare” and those that don’t.
Why is the Internet, as an invention, necessary for the general welfare, but access to it is required to be orchestrated by for-profit gatekeepers, whom are just exploiting public research and infrastructure for private gain?
I’d be very interested to know what metric you applied to determine that the research and infrastructure for the Internet fall under public expense for the general welfare, but that gatekeeping access to it should be for-profit enterprise solely the purview of private industry.
Is that the point of government? To spend collective money to enrich industrialists?
Here’s the thing about healthcare, it isn’t a functional market; not even close. It has extreme demand inelasticity, when paid for via risk-pooling (which makes sense due to uncertainty) the most effective way to dual optimize for coverage and cost is with a monopoly risk-pool, the information asymmetry is an enormous delta between consumers and producers, and you have almost no capacity to adequately shop for substitutable goods. In short, if you leave it up to markets the producers will always exploit the consumers, because that’s how the balance of countervailing forces works out.
You should better understand the things you advocate for.
Where can I find a link to the text of the Bill? What is the Bill number? Thanks for any help.
If a deal with Stupak cannot be reached, the bill is dead. Progressives live to fight another day for Medicare for All or whatever it is they want. All progressives need to do is to encourage Stupak to hold fast…no?
I was being sarcastic.
Parliamentary inquiries galore! It’s getting fun now!
“Walking into Capitol this morning on phone, Speaker Pelosi tells Hoyer: ‘Steny, we have to get to 217. None of these members wants to be the deciding vote’…”
Wonder why? Because they know they are being forced for a POS bill that is hugely unpopular to face the President’s pride. You would think that Dems would be vying for the honor of awarding Obama his ‘historic’ victory….
Well, I like your optimism. You’re right about the cost to Obama, which he richly deserves, but I doubt if the MSM will suddenly be happy to fete the progressives. They’ll find a way to frame it against the DFH’s, again.
Again, everyone will win. Progressives will not be feted…but the American people in toto will!
If this bill could have been killed I thought the rising premiums would have put made health care a priority for congress again pretty quickly. Perhaps that may still be so. Insurance companies are still the ones who limit benefits for people paying through the nose, while at the same time paying execs figures like the $73,000,000 bonus the retiring Cigna CEO is getting. (Isn’t that about 6,000 years worth of insurance premiums for a small family?) Hopefully we’ll be able to get health care reform back to the front again pretty soon.
C’MON GUYS, REALLY??
With all due respect to my Progressives, does anyone for a second think this day wasn’t so well planned in advance if they didn’t already know they had at least the minimum votes?
This is Obama and Rahms’ show, to distract and downplay their pre-planned failures at ‘reform’.
Notice it’s now called a ‘health care overhaul’.
Stupak 4:00 news conference.
Obama is a MIC loser already. blood thirsty random killer.
You give Obama too much credit.
Jesus Christ is this what we depend on to run our country, GOD DAMN AND DESTROY AMERICA
You spent an awful lot of time in that thread being sarcastic then.
Perhaps you can explain to me how the “free-market” will function efficiently regarding healthcare considering all the inherent perversions to competition, demand, supply, and information that are built into it?
Does Frank Luntz get a penny for every “Louisiana Purchase” or “Cornhusker Kickback” uttered?
Fun while it lasted.
The people that oppose this health care bill belong to the same forces that have successfully stopped health care for millions of americans for the past fifty years. Its time for them to lose and time for America to win. Its time to “Gitterdone” and stop these forces of non progress once and for all. Stop the party of NO…Stand up for change Congress, we the people voted for it, now Gitterdone !!!
Because that would be the compassionate “progressive” thing to do.
Not to put too fine a point on it, but you people are nuts.
I entirely agree.
Pelosi would never ever ever EVER endanger her perfect streak.
They sure love a slogan, don’t they.
Ready, get set, Rapture!
I’m beginning to think that I may be seriously nuts, but I’ve watched the past hour with reasonable attention and I’m beginning to think that this may prove to be a significant milestone in the demise of the GOP as a meaningful political party.
Their insistence on waving the bloody flag of abortion, their needling about procedural minutia**, is making them look like a pack of children stomping their feet because daddy refuses to indulge their whims and emotional demands.
—————
** I get this as a tactic, but these GOPers are all tactics, no strategy.
It’s weird.
“Gitterdone?” I’m thinking that little punchline doesn’t particularly resonate ’round these parts…
;-))))
YoU”RE GOD DAMN RIGHT TORTURE TREASON AND PROFIT GOD FUCK AMERICA LIKE IT FUCKS MANKIND
~~~ModNote: please cease shouting (typing in all-caps). Your point is made.~~~
Who’s the one republican voting yea?
Settle down.
“Jesse Jackson Jr. is doing a good job as chair handling dozens of parliamentary inquiries.”; yeah, he is taking no prisoners.
All due respect, TBogg – but tjbs is not “you people.”
Hilarious snark!
To the dedicated mods,
A contrite sorry, no buts.
And perhaps you can explain to me how the government will function efficiently regarding healthcare considering all the inherent perversions to money (that is NOT the property of the government),power and influence that are built into it?
The government can assist in regulating markets but who will regulate the government? Who will hold the government accountable? The people? Riiiight…we’ve done so well so far.
Already individuals feel disenfranchised, unrepresented, watching ‘cronie capitalism’ expand before their very eyes. I trust the private sector over the federal government.
Thanks
Well, what I meant was that you are not necessarily representative of all of us. But, you’re welcome anyway.
The Democratic leadership, corporatist running-dog lackeys we can believe in.
Precisely.
Only dumb Dems and BlueDogs.
And after some of the sh!t pulled by healthCos on this whole drawn out mess, I’m not convinced there’s a whole lot of love left for healthCos among some of the Dems. I think some of them have really ‘had it up to the eyeballs’ with the Death Panels, the Tea Party threats, etc.
And at least some of their staff are in the very same boat.
I talked to a staffer in my Congressman’s office who was really spooked by the crazies and bullying. That’s not yet fully played out.
When you lose your job (and with it, your benefits), you will, out of a sense of public service, decline Medicaid.
When you turn 65, you will, in line with the spirit of the TeaBaggers, decline Social Security and Medicare.
Is that a promise?
Politico is reporting Obama has made an agreement with Stupak.
Stop sugar-coating it, and tell us how you really feel.
The colloquy between Rep. Dreier and Rep. Slaughter about passage of the Senate health care bill before the reconciliation package is voted on by the Senate is a fine example of how convoluted this has gotten. Republicans made a stink about having a self-executing rule, now they want to make a stink about allowing a clean vote on the Senate bill?
The Tea Party hurt themselves with that crap yesterday.
Oooh! Pick me, pick me! I kin dew it.
By the by, the GOP fellow earlier who talked about ovarian cancer patients in bad old socialist England being denied the drug Avastin, which he says is keeping his mother-in-law alive here in the US, disproved his own point.
Avastin in the US is considered an investigational drug for ovarian cancer and routinely is denied — by insurance companies, not doctors — to patients who are not participating in a clinical trial.
Since only a sliver of a percentage of adults participate in clinical trials, the US begins to look a whole lot like bad old England.
Oops.
Yes, yes, yes, and also yes.
I have made enough money to provide for myself and my family. It was a promise I made to myself years ago.
I was taught that ‘no one is going to look out better for yourself than you.’
So..yes…that’s a promise.
Fixed it for you.
Does this go beyond the Executive Order that David reported? Do you have a link?
Indie @ 85
“Mommy, Mommy. Look over there. A faith based believer in corporate socialism!”
“Don’t stare at the troll, Jimmy. It’s not polite.”
Yeah. Don’t forget to check those stock prices tomorrow.
That’ll tell us how crushing Obama’s entre’ into fascism will be for us all.
ROFL
WH just released statement that O will issue exec order that will uphold existing law on abortion.
Artfully phrased.
And absolutely true.
The Dems can’t leave it at this bill.
But they need the experience of moving forward, even if it’s a first step.
Then the rest of us need to figure out how to better communicate precisely the issues that you raise.
“For profit” health care is economic lunacy, except for an oligarchic minority. It’s also a bad model for health care delivery.
We are at a point where Pelosi/Obama need both the pro-life and pro-choice votes. Both sides have to believe they are getting what they want, but that simply isn’t possible. Either federal funding of abortions will happen or it won’t. If both sides vote “yes”, one side is being sandbagged by the President. Which side do you think he will be more likely to sandbag?
Oh Jeez, another Obama deal?
Now what did he give Stupak. No abortions with federal US dollars, only with Columbian pesos?
Just keep telling your self that.
dday’s doing the presser
http://firedoglake.com/2010/03/21/liveblogging-bishop-stupaks-presser/
Stupak is just now announcing that he and his few remaining cohorts will now vote for the bill.
I think they’re up nearly 30% from where the process started. Yet, according to the administration they are fighting it tooth and nail.
With Obama’s turn toward corporatist fascism, the Tea Party is starting to make more sense to me. As I noted months ago, Palin wasn’t so far off in what she said about death panels, she simply accused the wrong party:
Now I no longer see that as a meaningful distinction; Obama and the corporations are one.
Yup. They shot themselves in all 81 feet, God bless ‘em.
This is supposed to be news?
All of this was choreographed long ago.
Nothing like being called out on the floor of the House like Slaughter from NY just did.
You fail to recognize how the the gravitational pull of the 2-senators-per-state rule of the Senate, combined with the filibuster rule, has subverted America’s ability to adapt and function. Layer on that campaign finance issues, and you have a formula for near-disastrous dysfunction.
When we’ve had month, after month, after month of some obstructionist Dem (or Lieberman) who represents a population of fewer than 1,000,000 citizens totally screw the other 308,000,000 of us, you have to realize that what we have is sub-sub-sub optimal.
The Senate’s rules, plus the voting based on ‘states’ rather than population, have made this nation almost ungovernable. It’s a miracle that Pelosi and Obama can get anything done, given a system totally rigged and geared to servicing private interests.
Not unexpected, but now official. Thus news.
Not even close.
If this had been a real bill maybe. But with the mandate and everything else the GOP will have enough to reclaim the house, and all our precious little promised fixes will go the way of the dodo.
Well, congratulations progressives…you own this bill as much as any other Dem.
Careful with that broad brush, libertarian.
Yes, the government does own all money- by the law of the USA, each and every penny, and bill is the property of the US Government.
Who regulates the government in a democracy???? WHO? Tell me, WHO.
Who do you think?
You’re crazy if you trust the private sector over the government. The government is a democracy, and you have say over what information about you it can collect, how far it can go, and what it can do- because you choose its officials, not a stock holder. You have no such power over the private sector. It can spy on you, and does, any time it wants. It can lie to you, cheat you, sell you something that could kill you, and you have no members on its board, no representation during its meetings, no way to regulate the private sector. You do not have a choice to simply ‘not buy’ its products, because it makes everything from cars, to houses, to FOOD. You will starve and freeze to death, and it does everything for a profit, it doesn’t care about you. But you trust it over your own government, which belongs to you. Utterly absurd. That’s all I can say.
Bahaha. Ain’t that right.
I just asked to some commenter on another thread if she was planning on relying on the crack negotiators and warriors in the Congressional Progressive Caucus to push through those “changes” she’s sure will happen to “improve” the bill.
yeah. jump back.
Well in this case, I wish obstructionism had won. But then, that would not have “serviced the private interests.”
OMG! I’m nodding my head in agreement with David Dreier! Help me!
He may be a libertarian, but he’s right.
Not about “us” owning it, but about congressional progressives owning it.
I almost feel we need a different name than progressives for ourselves.
Gotta be specific.
That doesn’t make any sense at all. You trust the private sector, but it’s the private sector that you admit to perverting the government to service the needs of the private sector rather than the public trust.
Your position is self-contradictory.
You would trust the private sector to operate emergency services like the fire department? What about when they’re extorting you out of every last penny you have whilst “negotiating” over their price as you watch your house burn?
Jeez, you’re one lucky son of a bitch, then. No tragedy in your life, eh? Opportunities and hard work. Well, good for you.
~~~EDITED IN MODERATION~~~
Just wondering.
People don’t want a freaking handout, jerkoff. Nobody can survive very long with the pittance the government hands out. Over 90 million Americans are living 200% below the poverty line. That’s 1/3 of the country.
People want a good job and fair pay; just a chance to provide for their families.
With smug, selfish, people running rampant through this country, we can only go in the down direction.
Thank Ronnie Raygun for making selfish people fashionable.
~~~ModNote: Flaming other participants is prohibited.~~~
Use the scary “L” word.
Re take the proud Liberal moniker.
“Crack negotiators” is right. Like feeble crackheads negotiating with their dealer:
Crackhead: You promised me I could have better stuff this time.
Dealer: You’re getting what you’re getting — now pay up!
Crackhead: But you promised…
Dealer: I ain’t got time for this shit –
Crackhead: Can I at least have a little more…
Dealer: Look bitch, you getting what you got — now pay the fuck up or I’ll beat your ass!
Crackhead: OK, OK…you don’t have to get so hostile.
Yeah, I saw they’re up about 30% since October. Nice, eh?
I wanna see if they take a jump tomorrow.
Can’t do it…so called Liberals are destroying that word for themselves also.
I prefer to call myself a socialist.
We have been witnessing the self-inflicted humiliating and disgraceful death of the once proud Democratic Party, a motley collection dollar vacuum cleaners so lacking in principles and honor that it took down a woman’s right to choice with it.
RIP.
A time will come in November to kick some dirt on its rotting corpse. In the meantime, it’s time to move on and form a new political party
Want a breath of fresh air amid a sweet sweet smell?
Check out the 50 plank Rose Party (new name) here.
I hope Bart Stupak really liked the Senate bill, since that’s what he’ll end up with. The President can’t issue an enforceable executive order that violates equal protection provisions in the Constitution, so the money will end up getting released for abortion claims (see the legal decisions that led up the pregnancy SAAOD requirements). Beyond that, we’ve got a situation where the reconciliation bill was passed when there was no underlying legislation for it to reconcile. The Parliamentarian can then rule that, while the reconciliation bill IS a law passed by the House, it’s not technically a reconciliation bill and is therefore subject to filibuster. Bart ain’t much of a negotiator – I’ve got a bridge I’d like to sell him.
Introducing a one-plank political party: The Neko Party.
The Neko party has only one plank:
1) Cats rule.
That’s all, and the cats thank you for your obeisance.
Do you trust our government run military?
Well, the big point is the government IS an agent for the private sector now, always carrying out their wishes.
So, there you have it. Just what you wanted.
Privatization of our health care system. They’re about to be so entrenched in our lives, they will never let us out.
Yes, it’s better than Liberal.
So without knowing what the actual deal is that Stupak has obtained, the “pro-choice” (yeah, right, they care….) bloc will vote for the POS?
At first I thought you called it the Nekkid Party, which really would have been something, huh?
Coinkydink, but my swearing parrot’s name is Nikko and his ego will be impossible to live with if the party bears his name.
I love cats too.
We thank you for your support.
So, after Obama makes it the rule of law to steal billions from desperate middle class Americans to hand over to his corporate cronies, he’s gonna’ turn around and tell us that he’s gotta cut Social Security.
The guy is a real monster. He’s quickly honing in on every cent he can get from us. He needs to be run out of town before there’s absolutely nothing left of us.
No, you’ve got it wrong. His bi-partisan deficit commision will tell him to rip apart social security. You of course understand the important difference this makes for the poor and needy of the US? ;-)
It appears all the dems are voting for this bill which is a wind fall for the corporations, does that mean they are all dumb or bluedogs?
the left of course
Why the name Rose Party?
Mr. Hopey Changey ain’t nuthin’ but a flim flam man and he’s laughin’ all the way to the bank.
I dont’s get the suspense or the idea that this is historic. Pelosi would have never done this over the weekend if they didn’t have the votes. It’s just more propaganda and grand standing. As far as it being historic, I would think that we could reserve that description for legislation that was actually transformative in some way. This bill is such a far cry from that it’s downright obscene.
Macaquerman suggested “the party of the red, white, and blue roses?”
That led me to write,
“The more I think about it the more I like the Rose Party.
FYI: The rose symbolizes rebirth and resurrection, which is what we’re doing out of the ashes of the Democratic Party.”
and
“A rose is a rose is a rose and the right wing would disgrace itself by attacking it.
Using a flower as our symbol is a very powerful connection with the yin or feminine, which KarenM urges us to do, and even though “the yang is strong in this one,” as Darth Vader might have said of me in a galaxy far far away a long time ago, I am a peaceful warrior now dedicated to practicing the Golden Rule with love, peace, acceptance, respect, and non-violence.
I love it, so absent any objections I move we adopt “The Rose Party” as the name for our new political party.”
It’s a work in progress, really. But I love the name.
Red rose: longstanding symbol of socialism or social democracy.
White rose: German non-violent resistance to Nazi rule.
Hmmm, from wikipedia: “Blue roses, often portrayed in literature and art as a symbol of love and prosperity to those who seek it…”
Interesting.
Indeed, but maybe we should leave out the purple rose of Cairo.
We’d have to pay royalties to Woody Allen.
“We will not be silent. We are your bad conscience. The White Rose will give you no peace.”
Leaflet 4
Still relevent.
Too bad the Visitor’s Gallery isn’t filled with people wearing white masks and holding white roses.
Yes, and we’d also have to eliminate the prohibition on bad homages to Ingmar Bergman from our new party’s platform.
Indeed. I shall “Make it so, Number One.”
(which beats Yul Brenner’s utterances as Ramses in the Ten Commandments”
“So let it be written; so let it be done.”
Or
“So it shall be written; so it shall be done.”