July was also the month that President Obama made a “quid pro quo deal” with the hospitals to exclude the public option from a final health care bill. Miles Mogulescu reports that White House Deputy Chief of Staff Jim Messina confirmed the deal to David Kirkpatrick of the New York Times.
President Obama disingenuously confirmed his support for the public option in his September address to a joint session of Congress, but, behind the scenes, he was actively working to kill it. Obama wanted Harry Reid to be responsible for taking it out of the final health care bill so he, the president, could remain popular, according to Brian Beutler of Talking Points Memo.
But Reid is facing a tough challenge of his own and didn’t want the honors, so — as predicted — Joe Lieberman was called upon to do the dirty work. Far from opposing the President, Lieberman was doing exactly what Obama wanted him to do so that the deal with the hospitals to kill the public option would be honored.
Tom Carper famously said that it was the Senate’s responsibility to honor the deal that Obama made with PhRMA, because after all, they paid for it with $150 million in political advertising for House Democrats. And although PhRMA was nervous about putting more money in until the President delivered on that deal, they have now agreed to another $6 million ad buy in the districts of 38 Democrats.
The objective of the White House with the health care bill has been from the beginning to secure donations of the medical industrial complex for Democrats and assure their re-election in 2010. But recently, they switched their battle plan. While Rahm Emanuel may have been protecting Blue Dogs from “fu&1ing r#%&rd” liberals who wanted to challenge them last fall, the Democratic establishment have now turned on Democrats in conservative-leaning districts for their unwillingness to take a vote that will no doubt cost them their seats. So much for the “big tent.”
The generals are firing on their own troops in the trenches for their unwillingness to go on a suicide mission. It is indeed like a scene from Paths of Glory.
There are currently 36 resolutions in states across the country to ban the mandate which forces people to buy private insurance, or face a penalty of up to 2% of their income that the IRS will collect — the very thing that Obama campaigned against. It will become a rallying cry for the right.
John Shaddegg gives a preview of what the GOP will be saying in the fall:
SHADEGG: You could better defend a public option than you could defend compelling me to buy a product from the people that have created the problem. America’s health insurance industry has wanted this bill and the individual mandate from the get go. That’s their idea. Their idea is “look, our product is so lousy, that lots of people don’t buy it. So we need the government to force people to buy our product. And stunningly, that’s what the Congress appears to be going along with. Why would they do that?
As Jon Walker noted, the President’s recent campaign wherein he railed against insurance companies for jacking up premiums was an exercise in incoherence. “If private insurance companies are evil, why are you forcing me to be their customer?”
The claims made by the administration about the virtues of the health care bill are outright fabrications. As Marcy Wheeler has documented in her post entitled “Health Care and the Road to Neofeudalism,” it does not control either insurance premiums or health care costs. Forcing 31 million people to buy a product they don’t want and can’t afford to use does not constitute health care reform. Once again, the poor get used as human shields so corporations can be the beneficiaries of massive government bailout.
Rather than actually helping the poor, this bill is a dangerous and unprecedented step on the road to domination of government by private corporate players who use it to suppress competition and secure their profits — the textbook definition of fascism.
When we launched the public option campaign in June of 2009, I made several assumptions. One, that the White House ultimately cared more about preserving the Democratic majority than they did about passing a corporate bailout and when forced to choose between the two they would pick the former. And two, that members of Congress have a base interest in keeping their seats and would not cast a vote that jeopardize them.
Both of those assumptions were wrong. Members of Congress are dealing their seats away, planning to retire after the vote is cast in exchange for appointments or other sinecures from the administration. The alternative, as Dennis Kucinich found out, was to be hounded from office by liberal interest groups whose job is now apparently to play enforcer on the left so the President can follow through with his PhRMA and AHIP deals.
This bill has already triggered an electoral crisis that will continue, not only for members of Congress in 2010 but for Democrats across the country.Polling indicates that Democrats plan to stay home just as they did after the passage of NAFTA in 1994. Down ticket races are at serious risk of the “Coakley effect” as independents flock to the GOP. While members of Congress in strong Democratic districts may feel safe from the repercussions, state legislatures that progressive activists have worked so hard to take over the past few years could become casualties of war.
I spoke with Dennis following his speech, and his campaign will return the money to those who have donated in support of his pledge to vote against any health care bill that does not have a public option. It’s the honorable thing to do. While he shouldn’t be expected to carry the weight of the health care bill on his back when the other 64 members of Congress have abandoned him, it is both disheartening and illuminating to realize that the progressives in Congress have no true commitment to anything but putting on a show. Rep. Edwards and her fellow members of Congress should follow Rep. Kucinich’s lead and return the $430,000 they collected from donors for their part in the House kabuki as well.
A PR blitz by the President may sway liberals to support this bill, but it won’t hold. You can’t fight for Medicare prescription drug price negotiation in 2008 when it has no chance of passing, and then fight against it when it actually can, and hope that nobody notices. This is a deeply corrupt bill that among other things puts lifesaving cancer drugs out of the financial reach of many cancer patients by keeping them from becoming available as generics, even after taxpayers footed the bill for their development.
Cokie Roberts said on This Week that the reason the health care bill is so unpopular is because the public option campaign dragged out its passage for so long. She’s right. By forcing the President and members of Congress to keep passing the public option hot potato and reporting on the corruption, lies and lack of affordability that were the hallmarks of the bill, it allowed the public to measure the gap between what Obama says and what he actually does.
That in itself has value, because without broad awareness of the bad faith with which the President engaged in the health care debate, it was difficult to get people to shake off the pixie dust of the 2008 election and deal with the reality of what progressives are up against. We also got to see that the veal pen institutions will be flooded with corporate money expressly for the purpose of neutralizing progressive organizing attempts against corporate control of government.
Few organizations resisted the urge to whip for the very bill they asked members of Congress to oppose last August during the fundraising drive for the public option. The entire progressive movement devolved into complete message incoherence as the unions announced their willingness to step outside of the Democratic party in order to enforce corporate deals within it. The PCCC deserves special mention for staying true to their word throughout.
If indeed this bill passes, people across the country will have to start examining the basic assumptions with which we have heretofore approached politics. The thing I have learned above all else in this campaign is that the corporate control of government is much more extensive than I ever imagined, and the tools we have to fight its influence are ineffective.
We need to develop new partners in the fight, because there is tremendous public will to resist and the old ones can’t be trusted. We also need a new language to describe it, because the old “right-left” paradigm is firing past the true opponent.
The effort to keep this bill from passing lives on after Dennis Kucinich’s defection, though it did indeed signal the death of the progressive resistance in Congress. In the end, what we learned is that we can’t count on members of Congress in either party to do anything but play their part in “villain rotation” — a game they can only play as long as we let them. It is up to each of us to challenge our old ideas and forge new ways to seek out those who are truly willing to oppose the corporate domination of our political system, and help them to do it.




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i actually have a pitch fork………….
Jane “The thing I have learned above all else in this campaign is that the corporate control of government is much more extensive than I ever imagined, and the tools we have to fight its influence are ineffective”
Having been involved with Hillary Clinton’s push for reform back in the 90′s and even before that. This is a lesson that many who have pushed for real reform keep getting knocked out by. That is why so many in congress are willing to roll over right now. Millions billions being put up to fight reform.
I really believe if we keep pushing we can still witness the public option become reality via reconciliation. I believe Senator Brown. Keep pushing after this legislation is passed
You folks seem to be completely surprised that you’ve been betrayed again. Amazing. FDL definitely has a case of battered wife syndrome.
Me too!
Good to know Kucinich is returning the money.
Green Party of the United States:
http://gp.org
Greens worldwide:
http://www.greens.org
There is an alternative to continued failure within the Democratic Party. You can spend the next two decades complaining about being sold out — or you can support a second party.
Clear, concise, direct, and documented. Excellent! Thanks!
Well, Obama and DailyKos couldn’t (didn’t try to) break Joe Lieberman, so they broke Dennis Kucinich instead? They must be so proud! I’m so disgusted that I can hardly type. I don’t entirely blame Kucinich… the “left wing blogosphere” in large part hung him out to dry, the White House leaned on him, and where else could he go?
To have allowed the liberal/progressive voters (who were certainly instrumental in getting him elected) to invest their hopes, dreams, energy and money into trying to bring true reform to his cooked deal is unconscionable. What a cynical, manipulative man. Transparency my ass.
And it’s pretty clear what the result of passage will be – at least this year – because actual coverage probably won’t be forthcoming for a few more years. Teabaggers will be apoplectic. Don’t be surprised if some resort to full-on anti-govt terrorism. Republicans will pound the message all through the fall that they are being required to buy insurance they can’t afford and the IRS will come after them if they don’t. Since there will be no experience of actual benefits this year, and because Dems are also incapable of effectively arguing and defending a position, the message will take, and a very angry voting public will slaughter Dems in Nov. And if people think Repubs won’t dare try to overturn it all if they take over Congress, they’re in for a surprise. They can and will do it, and they will probably get away with it. Because as insane as they are, they are not afraid of their own shadows.
The money DK is returning is chump change after the Citizens United ruling. Perhaps Obama promised him some of the real corporate money that’s going to fill party coffers. If progressives blogs ever ask for money again it should be targeted to something/one other than politicians, no matter how good they may look on paper.
YAR! That was a beautiful thing, Jane. Sad, but well said.
JH, I agree with much of this, and encourage you to keep sharing your thoughts about how to proceed.
I’d add that you recently ran a poll of fdl community, taking stock and looking forward. Have you crunched through that, do you have any results, and was any of that useful/interesting.
Outdone only by Republicans like yourself who never wake up to the fact that the GOP made a deal with corporate America long ago.
Good to see you as always, Mr. Cleveland.
It’s time to push for real voting reform, like instant runoff balloting. Nothing else will allow us to punish politicians who turn their backs on what they promised to do and not punish ourselves more. Every time we hear a politician talking about wanting to change Washington we need to bring up this issue.
Jane, I’m a relative young pup here at FDL, ~ a year old.
You earned my utmost respect throughout this long HCR debate. Unlike so many who count themselves as progressives, you still have it.
Please continue the fight knowing we support you.
My own conclusion from this: any strategy that does not include non-violent people in the streets is doomed to fall short. The corporatist grip on Washington is just too tight.
Great work on this tragic day, Jane.
It can’t happen here? It has begun.
All of that money should now go to defeating conserv-a-dems. There are no incumbents who need AND deserve our support. Defeating rethugs is pointless if you just make the dino’s more powerful.
bingo
Please let’s not forget that the old partners can’t be trusted.
Principled populists
vs.
Unprincipled corporatists (including bullshitters who pretend to be conservative, progressive, or “centrist”)
It’s clear that Obama and Rahm are more interested in destroying the progressive wing of the Democratic Party and/or a woman’s right to choice. Obama is the greatest threat to working and middle class Americans since, well, GWB.
Excellent idea.
Wow.
Excellent post Jane, maybe best evah! At least since I’ve been here.
As far as lessons learned, the one lesson I learned (in addition to the corporations having more control than I/we thought) was the “dittohead” group on this side. I never, ever would’ve believed that to be true. Especially after “our side” was always so vocal about the Republicans merely saluting and following the party. That there are Democrats willing to do the same thing was a shocker to me.
I always thought of Democrats as being wedded to issues/solutions, and not to one party (thus the old saying of organizing Democrats is like herding cats). Never in my wildest dreams did I suspect there were so many. And so fucking nasty about it to boot.
They come here and name call and belittle, but NEVER, EVER talk about the bill itself and what’s in it. That alone says all you need to know about those supporting this POS.
Moving forward I think it’s important that we make sure that those who supported and voted for this OWN IT. Credibility is going to be crucial in the future, especially for younger voters. A lot of young voters have been disheartened by the events of this year after the election of last. So it is vitally important that we make sure those that support this OWN IT, because those of us that actually do care about real solutions DO NOT support it.
Jeez, sorry for the length. Got carried away.
Another item–what about campaign finance reform. I hope you’d agree this lays at the heart of the corporate control mechanism. How can you combat this corruption without doing something about the mechanism through which corporate control flows into the poltical system, like a drug.
We are all Socialists now.
We may as fess up to it.
As I said before, the Democratic Party left me, I didn’t leave it.
I got a torch…
My only contributions this year, if any, will be to primary incumbents.
Nothing left to do now but swim out past the breakers and watch the country die.
It’s amazing to me how incredibly short-sighted some of you guys are.
The only thing WORSE then passing legislation which isn’t popular with everyone, is trying to and FAILING. Being ineffectual in Congress is worse then doing things people don’t agree with.
It’s pretty obvious that a lot of the anti-Obama PUMAS didn’t just give up and go away after the election, instead deciding to hold on to their anger and allowing it to override their common sense.
I’m kinda hoping it reaches that point. I’m afraid of more frog in the water stuff.
Good question. I haven’t looked at the results recently, but will now.
I’m reminded how George Carlin used to say that America’s “owners” control the country, not its citizens.
Jane lays out the case that it’s true — even when it comes to life and death.
Heartbreaking, when we were sold hope and change. Obama did a masterful tap dance to stay popular while dissing his supporters every chance he could. Mr. Bojangles.
Thanks, Jane. And my condolences.
As disappointed as I was to hear Obama was a liar and shill for corporate entities like the insurance companies. I am disappointed in Kucinich. But at least he does not keep his thirty silver pieces, and donates them to a worthier cause then himself.
I think it’s time to focus on the latest legislative atrocity to come down the road: S.3081 – Enemy Belligerent, Interrogation, Detention, and Prosecution Act of 2010. Heath care reform appears to be a lost cause. Stopping Joe Lieberman and John McCain from lighting the Constitution on fire should go directly to the list of top priorities. Read Glenn Greenwald’s column today for details.
http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2010/03/17/torture/index.html
Hang your head low Dennis, you set us back. You’re promoting fascism. You’re contributing to more bankruptcy. You’re padding the insurance and pharma cartels’ pockets. You’re not promoting healthcare. You’re setting up a Martha Coakley-esque congressional sacking. You know it. That’s why your statement was so lame. Enjoy the back-patting and champaigne next week if this steaming pile passes, because we’re all going to suffer for it in the long run.
Conseva dems like Dennis K…..give me a break…He was the progressive of the bunch so we thought
Its all about the CASH now,,,,
Keep pushing the House too – if a public option is in their reconciliation bill it will pass the Senate. Getting it in via amendment in the Senate is a much harder slog.
I don’t see how “fallback” options could get past a filibuster. Smaller popular provisions are still going to be opposed by Republican Senators without exception.
What passes now is not as bad as nothing passing. Ending denial of coverage for pre-existing conditions is worth quite a lot. Atul Gawande made a reasonable case that the Senate bill will control costs over time back in December.
Corporate influence over Congress is a much bigger fight. We lost this battle in that war, and in so doing we are getting some help for sick and wounded people.
Losing some blue dog seats will be a net positive effect. We’ve got 2 years to find progressives for campaigns in 2012.
So, Jane, you are saying we have a government unresponsive to the people?
That the people are no longer in control of the government?
That the tools for which we have used to shape government no longer work?
Sounds eeerilly familiar. Hmmmmm, what is one to do when their government becomes a tyrannical regime?
Seems like I remember somewhere some moldy old piece of paper saying something about what to do in these cases, but I just can’t put my finger on it. Damn, it’s on the tip of my tongue. Help… anyone?
JH, when all the veal pen, Kucinich, and other people who’s opinion I respect (like Krugman) come out and say, “pass the bill”, I have to take a long hard look at my conclusions about whether it’s better to pass it or not. A long hard look…
But, after having done so, I still think it’s a bad idea and worse precedent.
Your point about corporate control of government is an important one: it is vast and growing. Before Obama, we could suffer along under the delusion that it was the ideology of the ones in power (and I’d include Clinton in that analysis), but now it’s clear that it’s the structure.
After the great post-Bush revulsion that got Obama elected with a real mandate and large congressional majorities, the structure and Mr.-Empty-Rhetoric have made it abundantly clear that the progressive agenda will primarily serve to enrich the existing powers that be rather than advance the interests of the people.
That we are dealing with a President who campaigned on rhetoric of such broad hope is truly frightening. The sell-out that much more painful.
You are right: our leverage is incredibly poor and approach not up to the challenge. A new way forward is needed; more of the same clearly won’t work.
Awwww, how cute. They think that their voice matters to congress. Isn’t it just dear?
With the exception of covering children, most provisions will not go into effect until 2014. I suppose this could change in reconciliation but then again the intent was not to provide health care to the people but deliver customers to the insurance companies. In that they just might decide, “let the people wait” the profit margins are just fine.
Oh, and I forgot the MOST IMPORTANT thing going forward in addition to making those that support this own it.
We absolutely must not support any Democrat that voted for this. If they’re going to always be beholden to corporate cash, then they do not deserve the one thing we’ve got. The vote.
I eagerly anticipate the bloodbath this November.
It will be well deserved.
1. Wonderful synopsis.
2. Disengenuously? Come on!
3. I said it months ago, until these Pols believe “going along” will cost them more than “not going along” will win them, they’ll lie all the way to the bank.
4. When all’s said and done, I see little difference between “Chauncey Gardener” Bush & “Clarence Thomas” Obama. One, an incestuous insider lives with an abject disdain for those who’d dare hold him accountable – for anything. The other desires membership into the ultimate insiders club so much, he sees selling his soul and the lives of those stupid enough to buy into his scam as an inconsequential price of admission.
5. The Democratic Party is dead. Who, but those getting paid by it, would support it after this charade?
Well hate to be one of the “I told you so’s…” but at least now I won’t be verbally assailed when posting cynicism about the so called “Progressive Democrats” anymore. But then again, I live in California so I’m used to my elected leaders selling me out on a regular basis, hence, I may be a bit more cynical than most.
Bottom line here is that money talks. They got it – we don’t. At least, not enough to override the slimy influence that can even wrap it’s tentacles around Dennis Kucinich.
Seriously people, when they’ve beaten down Dennis, you know we are in deep trouble. Wonder how long it will take for them to get to Howard Dean’s family? Look for that announcement any day.
WE MUST TAKE TO THE STREETS!! It’s the only way we will get it all back. At the rate this is going, I figure we have about 2-3 more years of an opportunity before the Corporations own every last thing.
Or…sit at home and get used to that sickening feeling. It’s gonna be around for a long, long time.
Is there any “law” he can’t change his mind again?
He sure threw away a good chance to do a Grandstand speech-spectacle, and gain notoriety there!
so even if it is the perogotive of a woman… (strike through text.. I don’t know how) He’s eminently now just one of the boys,,, and can move along,
DK was kind of a disgrace at the mock debates last year, and I would have liked seeing him walk across the room and physically harass the moderater of it, for the gratuitous remarks etc.
So not so presidential after all maybe, wait to see. No need to rush to any judgements in these things.
Something else… isn’t it totally awesome that the result of all of this, is that Kucinich, who has been with us for years and has fought harder than almost anyone for real reform over the last year, has now been transformed into a villain? Now we’re supposed to treat Kucinich as being of the same stripe as Conrad, Lincoln, Lieberman, and Stupak? I already see some comments to that effect, as though caving into pressure from all sides is somehow now equivalent to actively campaigning against reform for a year?
The REAL heartbreak here is that Kucinich put his neck out for Americans, and he couldn’t find enough support from ANY side, including his own, to make a real difference.
Jane,
Do you know what Dennis meant by this statement?
I would paper FDL with a ton of posts on the “affordability” concerns of the health care legislation over the next few days. Rerun Marcy’s posts if need be.
Well it is the Republicans fault. Blame them. Because they forced Barack Obama to the back room and made him cut deals with AHIP and PhRMA. They really did. Really. The poor Democrats–what could they do? They only control the WH and both houses of Congress? They just had to cave on doing any real and true HCR becuz the meanie Repugs will make the Democrats cry if they try to do good governance or what poor and falling down Americans need or needed done. War in Asia? How many billions you need? How many dead Americans you want to support the corporatists and militarists? You want more? U betcha. HCR? Go fuck yourselves poor and underemployed Americans. And pay your damn taxes. Now get outta here. We have K Streeters to plan a AHIP/PhRMA “Our Big Win” Party with. Get the hell outta here and back to your miserable lives.Mercy? Compassion? Get the hell outta here!!
Of course the POTUS was forced to kill off any discussion of single payer or any discussion of expanded Medicare. In prelude to coming attacks more than likely from this Obama WH (D PARTY) on SS and Medicare. SS taxes having come off poor and near poor Americans shoddy labor income for decades now while the capital gains income of the super wealthy remains untouched. Around 2016 SS funding will need payback from Treasury for the SS funds Treasury converted into IOUs.
The screwing of American poor,near poor and working poor is just beginning folks. And your POTUS — Barack Obama — he will screw you first and good.
And then give you his sh** eating smile and tell you how he CARES about you.He is FIGHTING for you. He is a liar. Really hope Obama is unelected in 2012. This prick deserves that so much. More war. No justice on torture or CIA abuses. Corporate shill. HCR backstabber. Fake ” yes we can”.
What’s not to like?
We’re not surprised in the least. Most of us have been expecting this for some time now. The difference is that we didn’t give up hope like everybody else did. We didn’t give up the fight like everybody else did. We didn’t compromise our core values like everybody else did even in the face of insurmountable odds. The FDL community is made up of fighters, not of finger-in-the-air Democrats who obsess over what can’t be done instead of pushing for what should be done. And we didn’t bend over like everybody else did. I am very proud of the FDL community. We are strong and we will keep being strong while everyone else pats themselves on the back for being right about the death of the public option.
Congratulations MrCLeaveland, you were right. Good for you. And BTW, battered wife syndrome would be best applied to those who still support Obama and the Democrats. You are the ones who’ve been beaten up, lied to and thrown under the bus and yet you still stay with your abusive spouse. I find that very sad.
I want to shout out to Jane for another great post! While others get caught up in the emotional drama of it all, you stay grounded and focuses and it is much appreciated. I am proud to call myself a member of the FDL community.
Jane you have a gift for writing eloquent posts. This is one of your best. Thank you.
The Democractic Party has turned its back on the public interest. We must now find away to regain control of our political system of the people, by the people, and for the people. It hasn’t perished from the Earth, but it appears to have gone on extended vacation.
Thanks Jane
Among Crooks like these Dems in congress their will be no trust. They will start killing each other rapidly soon.
The Hope a Dope by Barack Obama
Thank you, Jane, for telling the truth and for fighting for true health care reform when so many other prominent bloggers have rolled over.
Dennis said he caved to save Obomba’s phony image. That’s worthy of whose respect?
Put his neck out until Mr Hope and Change said “stop it or else”….not really putting one’s neck out, is it? Would wager he had support of his constituents and bottom line, his vote might have meant hardly anything on the No side, except to make him true to his words. You don’t get respect, you earn it or throw it away. He threw it away. Now if he ever decides to tell everyone why, now that would be interesting.
Jane, we have acquired a tremendous amount of (disturbing) new information in the past year about how the system behaves.
We are certainly counting on you to continue your leadership.
“If private insurance companies are evil, why are you forcing me to be their customer?”
Because after this bill passes they can’t deny you coverage when you get sick. Thus people can’t game the system by only buying insurance when they get sick.
The logic is pretty straight forward, but I can’t make you understand something if you don’t want to understand it so you can feed your own delusions about the bill.
If nothing else, Jane, you’ve exposed many self-described progressive members of Congress as a bunch of liars.
Watching them fold, one by sickening one, has taught me that many progressives in Congress are progressive in name only and not progressive in fact.
Those who have caved to Obama should not only return the money, they also should renounce the progressive label they principally employ to con us into thinking they give a shit.
Didnt you read? They don’t give a shit whether they get re-elected or not because they will be given, as Jane put it, SINECURES. I had to look that one up, but it amounts to a bribe to give your vote to the Fascist Corporatists in exchange for a corner office overlooking the Potomac with a hot blond Fox News style secretary, or Scott Brown style gigalo, or pehaps an Ellen Degeneres, whatever their cup of tea party to look after your every need and feed you grapes.
So where shall we hold it and who shall be with me to attend the funeral for Democracy?
Hope we figure out a way to pass good legislation, cuz i’m about burned out, sorry to admit.
Why is FDL promoting GOP talking points now?
Jane, you are about the only progressive blogger I can believe in at the moment. You tell it like it is.
Sadly, we need to prevent from insurance companies denying coverage for pre-existing conditions. That is the one element of this bill I want to see passed. As well as making sure that insurance companies cannot drop people when they get sick and need insurance the most.
As for the mandate. That has to go.
At least you have the courage to speak out. Somebody in the progressive community needs to.
They can do whatever they want if it’s written in their policy. Healthcare does not equal Health Insurance. Please repeat that until it sinks in.
Could this be what was on the tip of your tongue?
http://www.ushistory.org/declaration/document/
Delusions? Americans don’t have health insurance. Oh I know how to solve it. Let’s make them BUY IT or face penalties, fines and possible jail. You call that good? Who’s delusional here. This isn’t reform. This is Insurance Bailout 101. This is almost the same plan Bob Dole wanted back when Clinton was Prez. Did you like it then?
Next stop… cut, ponzi, privatize, loot social security.
Bernie Sanders is a socialist and he is voting for it. What is your lame excuse for him?
“We need to develop new partners in the fight, because there is tremendous public will to resist and the old ones can’t be trusted. We also need a new language to describe it, because the old “right-left” paradigm is firing past the true opponent.”
Any lefty ‘blogger who mocked the Naderites in 2000 can now apologize.
Jane, I’m glad to see you’ve finally got a picture of how this game is played.
Well said, Jane.
This is indeed a sad day, but I see no point in making a bad situation worse. I didn’t pay Kucinich to vote how I thought he should. That would be bribery. That would be committing the same wrong that the corporations I loathe are committing. I donated money to him because I believed in him, as I have for years, and even though I think his conclusion on this whole health care ‘reform’ thing is flawed and wrong, I do not want my money taken back from him. To take it down to an old cliche, two wrongs don’t make a right.
I’ll second that. Thanks for your hard work as well all the other FDL contributors.
That is true. But in the end, it’s hard to accept leadership from someone who won’t go the distance. If they crumble in the face of opposition, the result is the same.
Actually they can’t do whatever they want. If it is in their policy then that would be an illegal practice.
Bingo!
Now where can we buy some F-16′s and pilots?
What’s most disturbing to me about getting Kucinich to flip, is that it’s only taken a year to drive progressive principle and policy, you know CHANGE which people overwhelmingly voted for, completely out of this and probably the next Congress.
Women’s rights, SocSec and Medicare are now undoubtedly on the block.
Do you have private health insurance?
Millions of Americans are homeless? I know just the thing to fix that — we make them buy houses!
Uh oh, your slip is showing. Socialist? Why hello Mr Republican. May I call you Mr. R. for short?
Bernie Sanders clinics are what bought off Planned Parenthood’s support for rolling back “choice.” Again, chicken feed when measured next to the real problem.
If you are going to be disrespectful enough to toss out the “spouting GOP talking points” crap about what you say Jane Hamsher wrote, have the courage enough to give a detailed rebuttal.
If you were honest at all, you would know that she is echoing the sentiment of true progressives. This is NOT health care reform. It is, mostly, a boondoggle for insurance companies.
Rather than spouting your own White House talking points, in an effort to defame Jane, have the decency to talk in specifics.
Now we get to talk legal. Who has the better lawyer? Joe Schmuck and his ambulance chasing scheister, or Aetna and their multi-million dollar team?
These are dark days for progressives.
Social Security has already been looted. They have been ‘borrowing’ from it since the Reganites took over. Now they say our fiscal burden is too heavy to pay the money back. $3 TRILLION bucks. That’s been their plan, (since the 1940′s at least!) from the beginning, to destroy social security, the ‘borrowing’ was just the means to that end.
Think socialism Mr. R troll. You know, all money goes into a government run system, and everyone is covered. I know, it sucks so bad that nations that have it, actually refuse to give it up. Why they like the American system so well, there is a massive populist uprising demanding American style healthcare worldwide. Go away troll.
But what they can do is claim fraud (like they do now) and drop your coverage. That doesn’t change, there is still a “fraud” exception to the recission ban.
why can’t we go back to the roman days, when bribing a public official earned a death sentence?
I wish Kucinich would stand as strong in the face of opposition as Lieberman did when he opposed the public option and then the Medicare buy-in for Americans ages 55-64.
Kucinich’s votes have never been about how much support he got from others, but about him standing on his principles. Why does he need others to join him to vote against this bs now?
“…. state legislatures that progressive activists have worked so hard to take over the past few years could become casualties of war.”
This could be the most important line in this article. This is a census year to be followed shortly by redistricting. Every possible effort should be made to elect progressives to state legislatures even if it means abandoning national politics in the short term. Whatever policy victories progressives may hope for in the future start here.
Why are people like Bernie Sanders and Kucinich not aware of the “real problem”? Are they not as educated about the bill as you are?
What I don’t want to hear from Kucinich is one bad word against the bill he now supports.
That kind of rhetoric about “evil insurance” and “drug comapnies” is best left to Obama. He’s great at it.
At least hold your head down, Dennis, admit you caved, and move on.
There are no “fixes” to come. That’s pure fantasy, an opiate to satisfy the left supporters who feel we’ve gotten something historic with wonderful possibilities.
Realists will choose to see things the way they are and fight from there.
Dennis, they will never take you seriously again. Your progressive voice, once loud and meaningful will sound a little more hollow now. I understand they were probably coming after you but I guess I hoped if ANY member would have borrowed an Eastwood line and said: “Make my Day”, it would have been you.
Reality check for me.
You too Brutus? ..well kiss my grits, RIP Dem Party…it was hope while it lasted.
Boots on the streets is certainly needed but the question has to be, who can call them out? The unions have been co-opted, university students are self-absorbed and “intellectuals” and opinion makers don’t seem to have the stomach. The American public would seem to be by and large modern day serfs, passive, superstitious, and fearful.
I demonstrated against the Vietnam War during my college years, and was tear-gassed and photographed by the FBI. We knew we had few allies in the government and had no choice but to take to the streets. Then, as now, neither party represented the majority of Americans.
I campaigned for the primary challenger to President Johnson, Eugene McCarthy. I recall going door to door canvassing, working at his headquarters, talking to everyone I could to help his effort. His candidacy failed, but had so much popular support that Bobby Kennedy entered the race as an anti-war candidate and Johnson announced he would not seek another term. If Kennedy had lived, he might have won the Presidency, and the anti-war forces would have won the fight.
A primary challenge to Obama from the left would at least stir things up. Someone like Elizabeth Warren, who has stature and credibility, but who hasn’t been rolled by the corporatists.
The over $400,000 that we should get back from the turncoat progressives in Congress could be the nest egg to start a campaign. Even if the challenger did not succeed, the American people would have a real choice in the voting booth.
It’s either a third party at this point, or a continued struggle for the soul of the Democratic party, a struggle that we are losing at this point. Because of my personal history, I favor the latter. But maybe it’s time for a completely different approach, a genuine grassroots third party. I’m agnostic on that. But either way, it’s time to plan a new strategy. The one we’ve been working from has manifestly failed.
I don’t think Reps will be able to overturn HCR for a couple years. Even if they win big I doubt they’ll be able to override the Big O’s veto power.
Covers it well
A week ago Dennis talked about how this bill was a major step in the neoliberalization of our entire healthcare industry. He said that Medicare and Medicaid was going to be assimilated into the private for-profit industry. He said that this bill will do more harm than good for average working Americans. And today he threw his support behind this bill for no other reason than…
“We HAVE TO BE COMPASSIONATE TOWARDS THOSE WHO ARE CALLED UPON TO MAKE DECISIONS FOR THE NATION”
This is a major betrayal by a man who knows exactly what is going on here.
After all the Demanding for ones money back now that that has happened no one seems satisfied. I remember in Vietnam we would be thrown into a firefight and we fought like hell. Sometimes we won and sometimes we lost and the funny thing was even winning occasionally felt like losing. I have been a FDL soldier fighting the good fight. I phone banked,signed every petition and threw what little money a disabled Vet could dredge up to our reps. I knew in my heart like in Nam it was an up hill battle but that didnt turn me against my buddies or my Country. I refuse to turn against Progressives in congress who didnt keep their promises. By turning against them they will turn against us, then what. Lets put this battle behind us and pick our selves up, dust off our boots and get psyched for the next fire fight!
You guys make no sense to me… Kucinich held out for a long time, and you folks are acting like he’s a bigger enemy than all the Democrats who didn’t need any arm-twisting at all. Let’s not let the perfect be the enemy of the good. Let’s REALLY not focus our negative attention on those who tries and failed, when there are so many who didn’t even try. Kucinich failed, and it is disappointing, but shouldn’t the real target be those Democrats who didn’t even put up a fight?
You can tell Kucinich is disappointed and unhappy, but he’s probably considering the choice between his “willing to fight” with being replaced by someone who won’t even make an attempt… shouldn’t we target the Dems who are celebrating this loss?
Yeah, I think the Citizens United decision and the Obama experience have crystallized the overarching mission/message for the whole spectrum of the progressive movement (or I think it should at least). People power vs corporate power. Democracy vs corporate oligarchy.
“boondoggle for insurance companies”
If this bill benefits them so much then why have they spent so much time and resources fighting its passage? Let me guess it’s reverse psychology, eh? Sorry but the logic is not there.
Jane, I can’t believe you didn’t see this coming. When the President started calling the public option a sliver, the handwriting was on the wall. When news of the PHARMA deal broke last summer, Obama revealed his true colors.
I wish everyone would stop talking about Rahm’s hands in all of this. The blame for this lands squarely in the President’s lap. No one should allow him to escape criticism by claiming this is all a matter of happenstance. You had 59 votes in the Senate for the public option in December. Now they can’t muster 50. What happened?
Obama is great at giving speeches. You have to be when you’re trying to convince people that you belive in something that you really don’t. I won’t vote for Obama again. I’d rather face the devil head on than having to deal with a “friend” who doesn’t give a second thought about stabbing you in the back.
Just as only a Republican could “approach” China (think Nixon), only a Democrat could shred SS (think Obama). He’s already said he thinks Republican Congressman Ryans attempt to include a buyout has some interesting points.
There is a silver lining: we can all now forget the myth that there is any way to change or work within the system.
We’re back to the early decades of the last century, where people in the streets overcame the money and the army troops and the corrupt cops and the company goon squads. Those who say it will be bloody aren’t just speaking methaphorically.
Face it: there are NO good guys left in either house of Congress. None. How sad is it that there is not one single “Profile In Courage”?
Who is smarter, progressives or corporatists? Now we’ll find out. How about fighting them on their own ground and setting up our own “private” insurance company?
The brains, talent, know-how–everything needed to do it–are available. Those not knowledgeable in this field (like me) will help every way we can.
If I am required to buy insurance, I want to buy it from FirePups Insurance Co. or something similar. After all, insurance companies started when working men (it was mostly men, then) put something in the pot every payday, to go to the widow of the next guy to die on the job. (No Department of Labor or safety regulations then.)
What say you?
Penalties that amount to paying Medicare payroll tax a second time. Yes it stinks. But a 2% penalty is less than the combined (1.65% employee + 1.65% employer) Medicare portion of FICA taxes. It would be appropriate to have all penalties go to hospitals for uninsured care.
I’d love to see Medicare tax extended to unearned income (capital gains, dividends) and if needed given a progressive rate structure to extend it to all Americans. Not happening this year, but maybe we can elect people to do this before I qualify for Medicare in 2026.
You have a great point BUT……if you don’t at least force them to face reality, you are doing nothing but endorsing the status quo, and then every sellout for them will get easier and easier.
Jane. Just wanted to say whatever the result of all this, you squared off and fought them toe to toe as an equal, and I think very few people are capable of that considering the size and power of the bastards. You fight damn good and I thank you for it.
: )
“And if people think Repubs won’t dare try to overturn it all if they take over Congress, they’re in for a surprise.”
They don’t need to repeal it all at once. All they need to do is eliminate, reduce or freeze the subsidies and the middle class will be screaming for repeal.
And remember, regarding SS and Medicare, everything is on the table. Unlike for health care.
Gosh yesterday sports metaphors, today war metaphors. what will tomorrow bring common sense?
Hahahaha……more Rethuglican talking points..health insurance companies haven’t “fought it”…they’ve “bought it”. Read Jane’s post again.
They know. They are opting to remain a part of the system. They are doing what they must to remain in positions of access to media and other opportunities to work from within to get a more honest if imperfect message out.I can forgive them for this. That is not to say we outside the system should follow their example in what could be called “pragmatism.”
Please read the “PhRMA likey” post and explain why they’re pushing for passage.
You mean when the White House and more than a few Democrats either backed or remained silent while Lieberman pushed his crap? The White House and Democratic leadership allowed Lieberman to stand strong for Republican principles, while they (and many liberal groups) attacked Kucinich. The two situations aren’t remotely comparable. If the Democratic leadership had pressured “centrist” Democrats a year ago, we wouldn’t be in a place where Kucinich has been made out to be a villain.
I’m sorry but simply giving the money back is not enough.
I direct you to my diary here
http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/35633#Respond
All 3 firedogs need to be publicly shamed for this. Jane, you should be screaming about it from MSNBC.
Make the story about how this betrayal has lost them the support of this community.
We have to finally start playing hardball.
Watch insurance company stocks the day this bill is signed into law. Or perhaps the day it passes the House.
We’ll be waiting for your response then.
I don’t know. I think most Americans who don’t pay attention to the particulars of legislative policies simply think this bill is the best they can do. They believe this bill is the only moral course of action left.
http://www.thenation.com/blogs/notion/541516/why_62_million_bleeding_heart_liberals_back_health_care_reform
Fraud for what? Not about a pre-existing condition. What insurance companies do now is if you get cancer they can go back and say, “whoops you said you had a head cold 2 years ago when it was actually 1 year and 300 days ago, so I’m dropping your coverage.” They can’t pull crap like that anymore because they can’t base coverage on your physical condition.
Verbing the noun changes the meaning. Just sayin’
Jane: “The thing I have learned above all else in this campaign is that the corporate control of government is much more extensive than I ever imagined, and the tools we have to fight its influence are ineffective”
Yes, and Pres. Obama is building the road taking us to a Fascist, corporate-owned and controlled state. Finishing the road that Bush and others built.
Thanks for nothing Obama. You are one and done. We are not going to turn out for you in 2012.
Sounds like a deal.
Of course they are aware of it.
Thank you. But it is a group effort. And it’s not over.
It’s just time to regroup. And rethink.
;)
Kucinich stood tall right up to the time to vote, true.
But he has no reason to be proud of himself, having had no significant impact on the legislation over the course of a year of debate, having called the final product a POS, and then having announced that he’s folding and voting FOR it anyway.
WTF?
The next time he stands up against something, he’ll be laughed at.
You’re right about that. What they won’t repeal is the mandate. Insurance companies want it and it fits right in with they’re mantra about “personal responsibility”.
if and when this bill passes and we are unconstitutionally “mandated” to buy insurance from the private insurance cartel we all need to organize, take to the streets and rally around Keith Olbermann’s comment that he will not buy health insurance from the robber barons and neither will we.
let the IRS agents come and haul every single one of us off to jail.
I just saw Rep. Grayson on DemocracyNow indicate he is going to vote for the Senate Bill. He is trying to draw attention from his sell out by moving a bill to allow everyone the option to buy into Medicaire.
While I love the idea, it has no hope of passing. He could deny his vote unless its passed, but that would be more than just rhetoric. This just looks like more self-serving Kabuki to try to not appear the complete sellout that he apparently is.
Someone should tell Kucinich to take notes from Grayson so he can see how to sell out while looking as much as possible not to be a sellout.
Go Jane. A real fighter.
They can’t deny coverage but they can deny treatment.
I find it hard to believe an independent socialist is dependent on the “system”, but hey whatever helps you sleep at night.
No, now they’ll just say, “You didn’t pay your premium, sorry. Go die.”
I’m willing to bet that this will be far from over. Supreme Court constitution challenges will be on all the media from this. The government cannot force anyone to buy anything from private for profit businesses. This fight will be years.
You are a fool. who has no comprehension of social structures. IOW a Republican.
Civil disobedience is necessary. Is the commitment there?
yes because spending millions of dollars on ads opposing the passage of the bill is buying it…
Funny that you mention Nixon because I keep thinking about how the EPA was created under his administration. From the perspective of the conservative movement that must have been the same kind of betrayal.
THe way the fraud loophole works is like this.
You get sick (cancer), the insurance company looks into your background and finds you had some disease 20 years ago. Then they pull out your application (you know, that piece of paper you fill out when you purchase insurance), and if that isn’t listed on your application, then they can still drop you for fraud. They claim you committed fraud by not listing everything on your application.
It’s the same thing that happens today.
There’s that “socialist” word again….ah the good signs of a troll on a “socialist” site.
How many lobbyists are in DC? Who wrote the bill? You are seriously misinformed.
Ya, right. Go back to Redstate.
Many states today mandate that residents buy auto insurance from for profit private insurance corporations. Don’t count on a Supreme Court battle.
Um, I’m all for the little guy, but If you are going to buy an insurance policy I would hope that you would pay for it. I think that is a concept that most people would agree with. That is not fraud, that is being delinquent on your payments.
Jesus you guys act like its the end of the world! This is a on going struggle. The only route that will work is pushing harder from the left for what we know is right. Progressives have been put in a marginalized position by the Rethuglican, wingnuts and MSM. This battle is on going. It certainly won’t be won by whining or feeling sorry for our selves at every setback. As my wife constantly chides me when I complain, “Just get over yourself”.
I am really not sure what to do with the hold Corporate America has on government. It took me quite a while and a lot of reading to really see how entrenched corporations are in our government. The problem to fight this is how do you fight big money when you don’t have so much?
I read one of the posts regarding the Democrats and I had the same experience as the poster when he stated that he thought he could count on the Democrats but found out they weren’t a lot better than the Republicans.
This health care overhaul process has brought that home to me. Wasn’t health care a Democratic platform yet you have Democrats who will not cooperate. That is when I got the message.
The only thing that I can suggest is to start a third party but that takes lots of people and money. Maybe the lack of money at least compared to the corporations can be made up by aggressiveness but for a movement to succeed people would have to have different values then most people in the country. In other words stop making money your God.
have you seen this recipe for cheesecake brownies. It looks good.
http://baking.about.com/od/brownies/r/creamcheese1.htm
I agree. It’s bullshit. Grayson’s full of shit. He should vote against this bad joke or stfu.
If I bought into the story presentation so far, that being a leg breaker against leftish dissents would lead to proof that Team Obama was capable of leadership then this would be a big win. Of course then the question of outcomes and motivations around the current Bush-lite administration would have to crop up. I’m disappointed in Kucinich but the actual source of the wider problem is still Team Obama and the wider set of circumstances that let the corporate apologists win greater and greater control of our government and the election process. Supposedly the average Senator must earn $33,000 in campaign donations a week in order to run for reelection and the proof of how much that matters is in the power of the White House to control only those who require their support. Making this bill about the obstructionist right versus the do-gooder Ds rather than on the merits has been proof that the without the MSM echoing Obama’s talking points has totally masked those on the left that find the bill offensive.
The Ds, and the left by inference, will be tarred with this for many years to come.
When this bill passes and if the precedent of using the IRS as a collection agency for private industries stands the partition between corporate and civic responsibility will be only as subtle as the next corporate welfare that passes through congress. Just wait until the next deeply thoughtful R takes over the Presidency.
B-b-b-baby, you ain’t seen nothing yet.
Only if you want to drive a car. It’s optional. And the IRS doesn’t enforce it.
Blue Texan’s regularly scheduled post is ready and waiting: Compare and Contrast: How Obama Treated Dennis Kucinich vs. Blanche Lincoln
I heard on the radio, I think it was NPR, that the health insurance plans proposed by Truman, Clinton and even Nixon went further than the reeeeform Obama is proposing. The U.S. is moving backwards, not forward.
Even if you don’t list it after the bill passes they still can’t deny you coverage, because that is not grounds for denying you coverage in the first place.
Gee am I going to eat today, lose my house, or pay Aetna? Which would you choose?
sure does.
Every village needs a scold.
“The thing I have learned above all else in this campaign is that the corporate control of government is much more extensive than I ever imagined, and the tools we have to fight its influence are ineffective.’ Here’s why they win Jane and we lose. There is an old martial arts saying. “The reason the rabbit almost always escapes the FOX is because he’s running for his life and the FOX is only running for his next meal.” The Health Ins. mafia and the rest of the CORP. elite accurately see the political struggle as a fight for their very lives in a vicious political warfare. We are approaching this whole struggle like it’s a debate and the opposition is playing it more like a WAR. They are winning because they are willing to plunk down the cold hard cash and the troops ( lobbyists) on a daily basis to win. It’s that simple. If we were willing to somehow spend all our time haunting the offices and homes of Congress and the rest of the bureaucracy then we’d be in the catbird seat and not AIG, Goldman, GE, etc et al. There is no other way to win right now because the Congress is an expensive place to own and we can’t afford it. It’s nice for us to discuss why this is wrong morally and ethically and even harmful to each of us and the Planet and the Nation but no matter the Congress and the Admin. listen to the sound of $$$$ not our online musings or our street marches etc. These are INFLUENCE PEDDLERS friends they make they’re living by trading political power that they EARN by raising money to obtain their seats of power and they trade it unfortunately for us to the highest bidders. That’s politics in AMERICA as we chat here and it’s only going to get worse now that the Corporatist SCOTUS says so. So, how do we counter this harsh reality? If I knew I’d be doing it. In DC and every other political realm today MONEY talks and BS runs the MARATHON! So, the COFFEE klatches and Meet ups and Street marches and letters all count for what they are but in the end they’re trumped BIG time by the 500 lunches and the plush Vacation suits in Hawaii and the millions in campaign contributions that these people can choke up and that’s what we have to figure out how to counter. Good luck to us.
Jane,
I am so glad you posted these FACTS and acts of deception, duplicity and sleaziness on the part of the useless Democratic Party and the dirty Obama White House.
Dennis Kucinich like Obama is a FRAUD!!!!!
Dennis “little nuts” Kucinich and Barack “Fraud” Obama and Rahm “Worm” Emanuel can all go and have a seance together tonight and get in the sauna without their clothes on and frack one another.
use the subsidy the government gave me to buy my insurance.
Of course they’re fighting it. They have to give the WH an enemy to battle with.
It’s a fake blow, and you’ll notice that most of the paid for opposition actually comes from the red team.
The lessons from this healthcare debate and the Obama Administration and Democratic Congress have been painful, but also illuminating. We have learned that there are no progressives in Congress or this Administration. We have learned that many “liberal” institutions and figures are really nothing more than fronts for the status quo, conduits via which liberals and progressives can channel their hopes and anger without really affecting anything.
Yes, the Democrats are going to get hammered in November. Yes, they are too stupid and greedy to care. Yes, Republicans are going to do well in the elections. But the take home lesson is that no matter the outcome in November, ordinary Americans are going to lose.
Our country is facing real fundamental problems, like healthcare, the economy, corruption, Constitutional rights, the survival of the middle class. The truth is that neither party, nor the media, nor Kos and the veal pen are addressing these in other than purely cosmetic fashion. We are not in the situation of a boat that is being run well or poorly but rather one that is sinking. Nothing is being done to stop this, but do any of us have to wonder who will be in the life boats?
The point is though that FRAUD becomes the basis for them denying you coverage. They’re not denying you coverage because of pre-existing condition, they’re denying you coverage because of fraud.
I think you’re right, that is exactly how the SCOTUS will fall on the side of the mandate.
In so many ways we are in Roman days. It won’t be long now I fear until our government implodes.
Isn’t this like the government telling me I have to buy some crappy investment from Goldman Sachs?
Jane says “We also need a new language to describe it, because the old “right-left” paradigm is firing past the true opponent.
I completely agree with her. As a transpartisan libertarian conservative type, who works with progressives on so many issues ( patriot act reform, anti-war, medical privacy, ending drug prohibition, etc) I think we really need to reevaluate the language we use and the partisan stances we hold.
When I say partisan stances, i dont mean our principled stances but the ‘groups’ through which we construct and attempt to implement our philosophies and principles. We sometimes hold our group identification to be more important than what we are fighting for or fighting against.
An example would be ‘progressives’ not being willing to work with someone who is not part of your particular progressive group i.e. partnering with a social conservative, a libertarian republican, a constitutionalist, a paleo conservative, an anarcho capitalist, etc .
Just because you are willing to work with someone from a different group who holds a different world view does not mean your selling out; it means your strong in your convictions and are able to see partnerships as a key to victory. It also might allow you to persuade someone who holds the world differently than you that your particular view on any particular issue is a better one to hold and its possible that you also might learn that your view is ‘right’ but only partial. It also might allow both of you to realize that you both were only holding partial truths and together you can create new one’s that serve everyone’s interests.
I do hope these transpartisan initiatives on healthcare reform, federal reserve transparency, civil liberties, anti-war, etc are just the beginning of the creation of new agreements by the American people from across the political spectrum on how they want to develop and implement social policy in a more sustainable way.
I also hope that the same initiatives will prove to be useful as we see more and more of our institutions fall apart from medicine to education, to banking to the family as they hopefully will allow for the creation of new more sustainable institutions that are more reflective of our needs, aspirations and life conditions.
Michael Ostrolenk
Go back to Fox News to enlist the support of their viewers for your petitions. Go back to the American for Tax Reform website.
The interesting thing is, I don’t actually read Red State, but you do team up with Norquist and Fox news. And we both know that to be the truth.
But your bill is WAY more than the subsidy. What are you going to do?
For this to be true the Reps wwwwaaaayyyy smarter/better/faster/etc. than the Dems.
True, insurance is mandatory for your car, but they don’t obligate you to buy a car.
Health insurance purchase is mandatory if you exist…
no excuse at all, he’s just wrong in his analysis of the consequences of his vote.
Point taken.
Right it is all a grand conspiracy and Republicans have colluded with Dems to vote against the bill. For what reason? Only you delusions know.
Good summary Jane… it is true insanity…
And the most mind-fuckingly absurd part is how the whole narrative has been so twisted so that Dems are supposed to be voting for the healthcare “reform” really in order to support Obama for fucking it up so bad…
If you listen to Kucinich this morning… the last part was the most telling… that Kucinich apparently bought the whole enchilada about how this reform is pivotal to Obama’s “success” and the future of our country.
I say if this is an example of Obama’s fucking success… he can shove it where the sun don’t shine and I frankly do not care about his “success” if this means there’s more of this crap to come.
Apparently Obama painted this as an historic moment… and I agree … it is truly historic forcing Americans for the first time to buy a product from a corrupt criminal industry with no government regulation on their pricing.
Talk about the fleecing of America. Thank Mr. Presdient.
An excellent post, Jane, on a sad day. Your courage and persistence are inspiring.
I want to focus on the next to last graf, hitting the points in reverse order.
“We also need a new language to describe it, because the old “right-left” paradigm is firing past the true opponent.”
So true … and (“firing past the true opponent”) beautifully put.
“We need to develop new partners in the fight, because there is tremendous public will to resist and the old ones can’t be trusted.”
I also believe there is tremendous public will to resist, but I question whether it can be channeled into effective action. Too many are content to indulge in activism only when they’re online. Online activism doesn’t seem to scare the corporatists — not so far anyway.
If that is the case I would have to imagine you are on medicaid.
You can’t base a fraud claim on a physical condition, which is what you are saying.
As for now possibly entirely losing the House and the Senate to the conservatives: Short term pain, long term gain.
Politicians who betray the trust of voters cannot expect anything else except “Massachusetts”.
A redo of a passage by William Congreve is appropriate: “Heaven has no rage like trust to distrust turned,….Nor hell a fury like a trusting voter scorned.”
This “Obama Wave” of 2008 is this, which was verified by “Massachusetts”: “Please, We The People, please oh God please save us from this incessant raping by The Corporation”.
I just communicated the one thing that is common to liberal progressive Democrats and Tea Party conservatives.
Another way of looking at it: 2008 was the Silent Majority looking for the next FDR. This Silent Majority actually bothered to vote because it thought Obama was the next FDR and the new Democratic Congress would be accordingly.
Obama and the Democrats have no one to blame but themselves for showing that they aren’t.
The Silent Majority has no choice now but to look beyond Obama, to keep looking, waiting, and hoping with increasing angst, because this incessant raping is taking its toll.
excellent comment Hugh.
This is exactly as I see it…
The ship is sinking and we are not in the life boats.
Your imagination, like your appreciation of the reality of the consequences of this fiasco, is too limited.
Actually, if you look at the Senate bill it’s essentially the 2008 Republican Presidential campaign stump speech proposal for healthcare reform. Literally the only thing missing is tort reform.
It has been, yeah. Obama belongs in the old GOP, but today he’s a “liberal”– or socialist if you watch a lot of FOX news.
At least Dennis is returning the money. (make sure you confirm it is back in the account!)
Maybe the lesson learned should be that the people you thought had the intention to serve the people were only putting on a front.
But, really, these guys are the foot soldiers. They are being pressured like you wouldn’t believe to support the leadership. It is the leadership which has turned the foot soldiers against the people.
I don’t really blame the individual reps. There are likely very few who would be able to withstand the pressure and threats.
You can be sure that if they get to 215, the pressure on the last person will be out of this world.
Don’t get down on the reps, get down on the leadership that pressured these people to abandon their principles.
brilliant piece, Jane.
yeah, except I don’t think you would die from a crappy investment.
http://firedoglake.com/2010/03/17/compare-and-contrast-how-obama-treated-dennis-kucinich-vs-blanche-lincoln/
I’m not the only one who noticed.
Or put another way. Let’s not let the shitty be the enemy of the shittier. I believe this is a more accurate representation of what we currently see happening.
Don’t fret. His imagination won’t be deceiving him in November when the Democrats get the ass whooping they deserve.
how do you feel about SS, should it be opened to privatization?
How would you improve our education system?
Give us something of yourself other than methane!
I like sports got any uplifting metaphors for us nomo? Nothing like a bit of nit picking and condescension to make a small mind feel superior now is there!
And what will I use for the co-pays, deductibles and uncovered procedures?
Point is, this is insurance, it isn’t health care…and insurance companies will still have the incentive to shed costly insureds. That’s their business model. Whether that happens through rescission or extended appeals for claims denials, we’ll see functionally the same results: medical bankruptcy and insureds passing up covered procedures for lack of cash to cover their portions.
I would not privatize SS, but I’m not sure why that is relevant? Are you trying to construct straw men arguments?
Well certainly, this passing of HCR by reconciliation opens the door to privatizing Social Security with reconciliation the next time the GOP has the Congress and Presidency–which will happen again at some point.
The door is now opened to anything.
I fully expect tort reform will be their main focus up if they come back to health care and start talking about actually “fixing it”. If you want to see what the health care “fix” will actually be, simply visit the AHIP website.
Yep which is almost identical to that which Bob Dole endorsed in the 90′s. Yet Dems just luv them this here bill!
Thank you for continuing to support real progressive reform. I’m new here and this is my first post. I have been posting at DKos since 2004 but now feel alienated and have decided to leave. I just can’t stand people who capitulate and then threaten others to capitulate. Markos has capitulated. Maybe he’s been pressured like Kucinich has been pressured.
What is happening is no surprise. It’s been obvious since the primaries during which Obama campaigned against telecom immunity and then once he became the nominee, voted in favor of that immunity in the Senate. It was obvious that he has very few principles. Everything he has done since being elected has confirmed my feelings.
I live in Sonoma County, California. It’s a liberal bastion and my community is sometimes called Berkeley north. I’ve been a supporter of Lynn Woolsey because she talks a good game even though she doesn’t have to make many risky votes. Her utter capitulation on HCR and the public option was made so near the cut-off date for a primary challenge, I can’t help but think that it was part of the equation. Hopefully, there will be a challenge to her on the left. I’m done with my support for her.
Thanks again and I look forward to checking in here everyday.
a bombing of Iran would still fail to disabuse the Democrat numb nuts from the sad reality that the battle lines are drawn across class distinctions.
What do these Democrat(icky) trolls stand for, if at all.
Exactly. Medical bankruptcies will continue. And folks who don’t have access to care still won’t. They’ll have an insurance policy that says instead of paying $150 for an office visit, they only have to pay $40. But the first $250 a year the full amount. Which means they will still not be able to afford health care. And those with insurance will continue to become financially ruined from a devastating illness.
Only now instead of blaming insurance companies, we must blame all those who supported this bill. They own it now.
“is the committment there”?
it is on my part, we don’t have the tsunami of $$$$ to fight back but we have the numbers and activism and it would entail a collective effort by all of us even if it means collaborating with the TPM(tea party movement).
“Democrats in disarray”
“Obama struggles with signature issue…”
Are all headlines the GOP loves to see.
The GOP approach is verdict (“No”) first, question after.
It’s working really well for them.
What’s not to get?
It has taken some great political genius to craft a lose/lose situation in politics.
They are trolls. They stand for nothing and everything.
It hit me a couple of weeks ago when I was trying to decide if the bill is “bad” or “good”… that the clever Wellpoint insurance writers on the Baucus committee put JUST ENOUGH “good” in the bill to qualify for Dem talking points…
so that the really bad stuff sort of just floats along with the “good.”
They’ve been doing this for a long time I guess… and know quite well how to craft a bill that has some good points… so that their corporate Congressional representatives can justify voting for it.
I’m thinking of buying one. Maybe a torch, too.
You can even quote me right.
I was saying the insurance industry is giving them a fake enemy.
The Rpublicans don’t care either way, they just want Obama to fail for the sake of Obama failing.
Quote me accurately or don’t bother.
Yeah, I guess… and if we pretend that a shitty day and a shitty vote for Kucinich is equal to a shitty career for Lieberman, then we’ll end up with a bunch of Liebermans, and Lincolns, Bayhs, Conrads, and the rest of the Conserva-Dems.
We need to be realistic about what this vote represents: Kucinich had the weight of the both parties, the media, and much of the liberal blogosphere against him. I doubt many of us could stand up to that, and the fact that it took all of that to make him cave means he’s better than 90% of the Democrats out there. That doesn’t make him perfect, but it sure as hell means we have better targets for our anger.
and you do have an “OPTION”, it’s called PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION.
Comrade romo2austin,
I guess you won’t like my 2012 Socialist Party presidential platform. It calls for an 8 hr work day and a 40 hr workweek.
I was thinking about a chicken in every pot, but I think that’s already been used.
Happy St Patrick’s Day.
The cheering will be so loud when this passes from the media that you could set yourself on fire and no one would notice.
I still say him simply returning the money is not enough.
Weiner, Grayson, and Kucinich need to be blasted by us on the MSM. We need a stick, carrots aren’t working.
Because he simply didn’t just take our money, he took our trust.
NO WAY. I hear Martha Coakley’s gonna be elected head of the DNC. She’d never let that happen.
Well if you can’t afford your co-pay I expect that you would probably be on medicaid.
And they can’t rescind your contract with them based on a pre-existing condition, which is what this bill corrects and was the prime reason if no the only reason for that action.
And this bill isn’t perfect, but it makes some things better, and it certainly doesn’t make things worse.
sounds good to me
As much as I’ve supported the efforts of Kucinich, Grayson, and Weiner during this year-long Interactive Kabuki Theater show, I have to say a silent I Told You So, because I never donate $$$ in response to show my love/support. I find that distasteful and encouraging false behavior. I contribute to those who have stood for what I believe in when they are actually in their campaigns, in October. This rewarding of promises is like giving a dog a cookie, or a seal a fish; e.g. recall that money-grubbing wanker Chris Dodd fighting against FISA wiretapping? Every time he made a statement against that bill, I got an email asking to donate. I was totally fooled/robbed by Obama, but hey, I’m sure I’m only one of millions in that boat, no? I say, show them the love $$$ when they’ve proven their mettle, then you don’t have to ask for it back!
lol
We should actually start calling each other Comrade.
Until we remove the stigma from scoialism we’re gonna be in a bad place.
So, as Hitchens would say, “Brother, sisters, comrades and friends”.
Jane,
It is so sad to see your super-human efforts rewarded with betrayal and worthless promises. But your ceaseless work has nonetheless been very valuable because it has exposed the baseness at the heart(lessness) of our current system.
Your article is an excellent analysis that I share. I am seriously contemplating de-registering as a lifelong Democrat. But a new viable political force must be forged and I am unable to visualise how this should best be approached. I look forward to your further leadership – I hope you will be continuing (though I wish you a break to regenerate and take care of yourself).
You have my respect and admiration. Thank you so much.
This. ++
fine so was there like a secret meeting between all the liberal democrats, Obama, and the insurance companies to come up with this plan? And why aren’t the blue dogs in on it? You would expect the blue dog democrats would be the biggest supporters of this bill if it did help the insurance companies. But why are the blue dogs opposing it then? LOL.
Y’know, those are the best kind.
After reading through the comments, this dawned on me: When Obama pressured the progs by saying if he lost this battle, he couldn’t pass any more legislation, what he didn’t say was what kind of legislation he still wanted to pass. Gee thanks, Congress and Senate, now we can pass the gutting of social security, more money for defense, mass firing of teachers, clean coal and nuke plants, the right to hunt down and kill Americans and anyone else we dislike, and the list goes on.
It will take me a while to bounce back and I’m not sure where I’ll land, just yet.
Sinecure is actually worse than that. It’s a “paying” job that does not require you to do anything to earn your “pay.”
Jeez, can you believe this thread already has 215 posts?
It isn’t his actual vote that’s the problem, it’s the blatant caving in of principle. The vote is a smokescreen. They could have squeezed that single vote out of anyone but they chose Dennis Kucinich.
What is really the most disturbing to me is the complete suppression of ANY progressive voice that dares to disagree with the President. A president, I might add, that ran on a progressive health care agenda.
HIS PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENT OF DEFEAT is what they were really after. Especially this most important line “If I can support his than so can other Democrats” Meaning “So can YOU (insert name here)”
They went after Dennis because they know that within a crucial voting block he wields respect and they were after his reputation and the potential influence that could have in stifling the blow-back from progressives. Blow-back that he was taking directly and consistently to the House floor!! This was flying in the face of the false narrative Obama has been peddling.
His vote doesn’t really matter to them – only to hard core Progressives. And THAT is why they went after Dennis Kucinich and why he was forced to go out of his way to make such a public announcement that he was basically, eating shit and incidentally thinks that all of us should do so as well.
Bottom line, they already go what they wanted – no vote required!
Jane,
You’ve done yeowoman’s work on this issue. No one could ask any more of you than that.
add to that my theory that the reason Obama did not expand Medicare is because he plans to gut it ….
Not good to expand something before destroying it… doesn’t look good.
Don’t change your registration. If a real progressive runs in a primary you’ll want to support him/her.
Just don’t vote for these corporate Dems.
If we stick to it election after election they’ll either come to us or move further right to compete for the right votes with the Republicans. If that happens the void left will be so huge a third pary will have to emerge.
the only difference a congressman makes is either a yay or nay
of course the big joke is that even if there weren’t enough dems to vote for this, a few repubs would cross the line, because they’re corporate whores as well
seems like there’s nobody left in government who still supports the people
Oh! But it’s win/win for the insurance/pharma companies… that’s all that matters!
Under Obama the inequality in this country will deepen and the grip that corporations have over the political process will tighten into a vice-like stranglehold. Those two things will be Obama’s longest-lasting legacy to America.
Oh noes! Disingenuous public shaming!
Seriously? Being able to claim that people were annoying you, and saying bad things, is all it takes to get indefinite and impervious political immunity?
That’s a sweet, sweet deal.
You’ll have to wait for the social security fight for that one. :O)
If a politician can’t take a principled stand on an important issue he/she has no reason to be in office. Bart Stupak could stand the heat. Why couldn’t Kucinich? Kucinich also had a lot of the left blogosphere for him. Do you think Kos is going to be his friend now? Or Obama? Or Pelosi? All Kucinich has done is manage to disappoint a lot of people who believed, or wanted to believe, in him.
Yes, Dennis Kucinich grabbed his ankles today on behest of threats from criminals like Nancy Pelosi, Rahm Emanuel and Barack Obama. Grabbing one’s ankles is becoming common place with these spineless Democrats!
Nancy Pelosi will be threatening all the women in the party this afternoon today as well.
Threats and more threats have become commonplace with the Chicago thugs runnning America now.
America is being run like a thug nation led by Rahm Emanuel, David Axelrod, Valerie Jarrett, David Plouffe, Robert Gibbs, Joe Biden, Hillary Clinton and yes, Barack Hussein Obama.
Democrats and faux “liberals/progressives” continue to lie and lie to themselves. This Obama/Democratic Party HCR Bill lacks:
1. a public option
2. Single Payer
3. Medicare for all as Ted Kennedy said was a ‘right for all Americans.”
This Health Insurance Bill comes nowhere close to the type of plan members of congress receive as part of their deal and which your tax money funds!!!
Shame on any so-called “liberal/progressives” such as the DailyKos and Ed Schultz/Bill Press/Randi Rhodes types for supporting this criminal bill out of the Obama White House.
Obama is not a true “Democrat” but a Corporate Fascist!!!!
Soon, America will be suffering from Weimar Germany type of economics with hyper-inflation like you never saw before. Obama is already a TOTAL FAILURE and his BRAND IS SINKING FAST!!!!
Again, you faux “liberals/progressives” of the DailyKos persuasion—-I thought before you decided to bend over and take it, that you all supported:
1. a public option
2. Single Payer
3. Medicare for all as Ted Kennedy said was a ‘right for all Americans.”
This HCR Reform Bill lines the pockets of big insurance companies and big Pharma and penalizes those not able to afford it.
Where have the “liberals/progressives” gone? For now, they are bending over for Obama and Rahm Emanuel!!!! Perhaps in the nearest shower in the White House.
Just wondering why did you ignore the part of his quote concerning his worry over how NOT passing HCR would effect the future of Nation. Do you think he was lying?
Anthony Weiner and Alan Grayson are also complete fakes seeking media attention and not sincere at all.
I lost respect for Kucinich and his “principles” when he shifted his votes to Edwards in the 2003 Iowa caucus…
Dean was much closer to Kucinich ideologically… but Dennis apparently didn’t like him… and threw his votes to Edwards in a hissy fit.
So much for principles.
I don’t understand the question. Are you asking me, or the commenter that I was quoting?
And at the current pace of downward spiral – and the amount of damage do you these people can do in 4 years – what are the odds anyone on this blog right now will live long enough for this Progressive Wave to overtake Washington and turn this mess around?
I’m asking because I’ve been part of that strategy for over 20 years now and I gotta tell ya, it ain’t working out so well.
What heat did Stupak get? NONE! That’s the difference!
Before we attack the victims of the corporatist wing of the party, shouldn’t we target the corporatist wing?!?! Or is it easier to eliminate people who are mostly on our side, instead of fighting the people who crafted the policies we hate?
Because confessing that your reasoning is to defend the image of a scam artist is embarrassing. He was probably just saving DK THAT disgrace.
the same supreme court that just made the citizens united decision? the same one that stopped the vote counting in 2000?
Um, not sure what your point is. I think you are echoing mine, but the ALLCAPS shouting makes me uncertain.
I don’t have car insurance and am not obligated to have any…because I don’t own a car .
I have an existence, therefore under this bill, I must buy crap systemically flawed insurance from the cartel or have the IRS garnish my wages.
Yes, Obama and Pelosi are laughing at Kucinich behind his back…..Kucinich is now being seen as a little coward even by Pelosi and Obama…..
Kucinich and Obama Bootlickers in the Congress—–Nice to his face but laughing at him when he ain’t around—
Of course Obama didn’t visit his stomping grounds and send out feelers offering to not allow Ds to support Stupak’s reelection. Hardball is only being played against a limited number of those that Obama can easily attack with impunity. The blame for being obliged into thinking that you might live to fight another day still comes from the source of the threats. Team Obama.
That was my point. as I said earlier, go check out my diary calling for us to publicly denounce them on the MSM.
A liar is a liar, even if he wears progressive clothing.
2014 wonder why? Is there an election in 2012? The faithful fools that want this bill because it comes from those with D’s behind their name-and their main man, Obama-are not even going to realize that the bill is doing shit for them until after Obama has his precious second term. Nice scam heh? Which is the ONLY reason I got from Kucinich for passing this bill. Saving Obama’s presidency.
Wow. Lots of response!
Are you channeling Rush Limbaugh? This attacking progressive is disturbing and ugly. You have gone so far left that you have come full circle and ended up on the wingnut far right and fell face first into fat, drug abuser boys Lap.
So when knocked down and out of play-get back on; get back in.
Get a fresh horse and ride hard. The next best game in town is what: Grayson’s buy in on Medicare. What else?
Let’s go.
It will pass. Time to get a strategy of next steps. Repeal is not an option if you really want to move progressive policies forward.
Now let’s be fair here. Dennis said he is going to vote for this crap bill to save Obama’s presidency. So Obama thinks without this health fraud, he’s not getting re-elected? Who said he was going to get re-elected anyway? His entire presidency up to now has been nothing more than a farce by anyone’s standards.
No, the Democrats have become Reagan Democrats and the Republicans are the John Birch Republicans…..
You actually have it ass backwards dude…..
The Democrats have no “liberal principles” left. I am glad you listen to Rush Limbaugh. I do not listen to people like Rush and other idiots on talk radio.
Go back and listen to your buddy Rush and know you and he–Limbaugh and the present Dems all support Reagan’s economics such as privatizing healthcare and education…..
For those who disagree with me, and have decided that Kucinich is the real villain here:
“The alternative, as Dennis Kucinich found out, was to be hounded from office by liberal interest groups whose job is now apparently to play enforcer on the left so the President can follow through with his PhRMA and AHIP deals.”
Jane Hamsher gets it: the White House and liberal interest groups used their full force to destroy Kucinich, and not to pass the reform that we all wanted. If you guys don’t plan on voting and campaigning for Republicans, then you should understand the compromise Kucinich made.
Is that anything like embracing someone like Lieberman so hard you end up signing away everything your base elected you to do?
Repeal? That’s a Rethuglican idea and as a liberal i’m repulsed by it. There are some Good things in this Not so good bill. We must work to improve it, working toward a single payer Medicare for all.
So, I guess that would make Obama a Farcist.
I hope the “Kucinich Cave-In” becomes a permanent addition to our political lexicon.
Forcing medicare into bankruptcy is a real step forward toward that end?
I think that’s the best response I’ve heard yet. The amount of change that needs to take place in our political machine is much more widespread than any of us thought. The entire voting structure is a farce. The representatives of the people refuse to represent the people. There is an appalling lack of accountability at all levels of government. These politicians lie for votes, gain office, screw us all for money, and retire with impunity.
We really all need to sit down and figure out a way to combat all these issues. At these point we need social change, not political change. I’m pretty sure the Bill of Rights speaks to revolution in response to this type of situation. I’ve got a feeling that social revolution on a massive scale is the only thing that will upset the government in its current form.
A lot of people are going to have to fight. Really fight. We pulled this off once before. The French did it once. I fear that we don’t have the motivation or resources to do it again.
Do you think the insurance industry is going to decline to use their new-found profits to fight actual reform should it rear its head?
Describe the public policy implications of healthcare reform and the role of the HHS Secretary in this new bill?
Explain with examples what parts of this bill does not line up with neoliberal economics? Explain the privatization aspects of this bill and its consistency with neoliberal economics? Desscribe the implications for enhancing the private sector at the expense of the public sector? Is this a bill of choice or coercion?
Argue for or against the present notion that this bill will be affordable for all?
Give it about four more years and a couple million more Health Insurance Reform induced bankruptcies, and it’ll happen.
I’ve read you for a while, and I registered because I wanted to show my I appreciation for the fact that (almost alone) you refused to capitulate to yet another form of highway robbery perpetrated against us in the interests of the wealthy.
Coverage does not always translate to benefits.
Insurance companies thrive by DENYING claims.
Sure, they will be *mandated* (with huge loopholes) to sell you something called “insurance” and we will be mandated to buy it, but that doesn’t mean they will pay for any lifesaving treatments or medication.
Nothing in this legislation changes their ability to make obscene profits by denying benefits.
It’s sort of like global heating. It’s happening. The planet will survive. The only question is what if any life forms will.
Huh?
Via what possible means, using the mechanisms erected by this legislation, is there a route to Medicare-for-all?
Additionally, can you tell me unequivocally what problem among affordability, accessibility, and quality that this legislation actually resolves? Quite literally, if this legislation solves exactly zero of the problems that initiated its creation, then what is the point of it? Legislation for its own sake? Is it somehow innately good?
I endorse no person, only positions.
If Rush himself came out and said “I want single payer” you knwo what, I would support that.
Positions, not people.
And it is in fact the Democrats that have become centrist Republicans.
we’ve gone so far left that we realized Partisan politics as a weapon wielded by the economic elites against the wage earners across both Parties. We’ve analyzed and stripped the Potemkin facade to it’s bare essential truth.
The actors in this reality is the united them against the fractured working shmucks.
Yeah, because that’s somehow worse than the “Obama sell-out”?
Of course the ins cos will fight us, So? whats new about that? It certainly doesn’t mean we can’t take them on and win.
that’s why we have to talk about class warfare! The brainwashed workers in the Red states get it!
Unfortunately, we’ll be tagged with this failure, despite all our protestations to the contrary.
This will be a failure of liberal policies, just as the incredibly weak stimulus (shouldabeencalled Jobs Bill) is used as an indictment of standard Keynsian economics, because of the ongoing recession and 10% top-line unemployment.
Failure of the bastardized policies promoted by this administration will be used as evidence against liberal policies and analysis.
My expectation is that this bill will be used to beat the Democrats over the head in 2010 and 2012…Republicans will hold both houses in 2012, with a decent shot at the White House in 2012 as well. At which point, they will repeal the more positive aspects of the law and use the remainder to continue to cudgel the Democrats, using them as the nose under the tent to roll back Medicare and privatize SS.
I share your sentiments. I’m feeling like it’s time to create something new from whole cloth. My conscience can’t find a place in the current set-up (no pun originally intended).
You just handed them the revenues of federal subsidies and 30 Million new low-risk customers, and influence in our system is dominated by Dollars… and we’re uh, supposed to have improved our situation somehow here?
Man, that’s a good one! You had us going there for a while! We thought you were serious. Let me guess, AHIP will get a seat at the table before we start the fight?
Welcome. I think you will find you feel less alone. I have come to rely more and more on the inspiration of the good people, and awfully smart folks who write on these boards. I look forward to your comments.
No, that’s Social Security reform. The crash of Wall St makes us less likely to want to invest our retirement in the market while it makes them more likely to want to make us invest even more of our retirement in the market. There has already been talk of automatic opt-ins to such plans. I want to believe they can’t mandate, but isn’t it socially responsible for everyone to pay into their retirement account just like it is for everyone to buy insurance?
You cannot work alongside entrenched politicians on the inside or be buddy-buddy with them. I have known politicians for years. They are nice to you and all that when they need something like putting their sign on your lawn and similar things. Before or after that, avoidance and denial are the usual behavior traits.
I hope Jane who has a big heart and sound ethical principles realizes this now.
At the base level you have to be working against ALL POLITICIANS and never raise money for them……You have to work from the vantage point they will BETRAY YOU and THEIR WORD IS NEVER WHAT THEY SAY IT IS…….Pressure has to be applied on these people 24-7-365, and until their actual vote is cast–NO MONEY TO THEM and NEVER EVER Until that point in time!!!!
Epic post, Jane. Phenomenal. You set it all out. It’s tragedy really.
But the truth shall set us all free.
Thank you, Jane.
Ron Paul 2012. At least he’s not bought and he really wants to reel in corporate interests. I can’t say that about any Dem even if it weren’t crazy to think anyone would primary Obama.
I don’t know what they came at Dennis with, but at least he is upstanding enough to return the money….you guys are getting rolled left and right…why are you giving the money to people who sign a piece of paper that has shown to be worthless….collect the money in a FDL PAC and hand it out bit by bit after people demonstrate that they actually vote with their rhetoric….I think everoyne anyone here has ever cheerleaded for has rolled them by now…or is Grayson even at a principled NO?
Jane generally knows what she is doing…trust her with the money, and dole it out bit by bit….
I’m afraid that’s what it’s going to take. Freaking economic destruction, far worse than what we’re already seeing. Economic destruction and a greater consciousness on the part of more Americans. The rallying cry here needs to be “This is not our country.”
And MSNBC talking about how “America hates congress?”. Still not enough to do something about it, apparently.
Please pay attention: the last year was “us” taking on the “insurance companies”. And the result we see before us is the irrefutable evidence that they won. That’s what this post is all about.
Acknowledging that we didn’t have enough juice to win this fight is the first step toward getting the juice for the next go round. That in itself guarantees nothing, but denying that we lost to the insurance companies isn’t going to get you very far.
I hate to agree with MrCleveland since he’s obviously some kind of troll, but anyone who actually believed there would be a single-payer or public option in this legislation after all the signals that it was corporate-written and blessed was engaging in self-delusion.
Hopefully, this incident will awaken more people to the fact that the two political parties in this country are not the Republicans and the Democrats but the Corporation Party and the People Party. And unfortunately, the People Party has no representation in Congress at this time. There are a few voices in the wilderness, like David Sirota, who have recognized this truth and have framed their commentary around this political fact. I urge people to read his columns for a better understanding of how the current system works.
And I will say once again, as I do almost every day I post here, stop giving money to elected politicians. No matter what they verbally agree to or what document they sign or how well they make speeches. Once they get to DC, the system engulfs them and they get a taste of those corporate $$$ and go directly into whore mode. If you want to make a difference in this political climate, donate to primary challengers in the Democratic Party. Why? Because it’s the only hope of reclaiming control of that party. If elected Democrats understand that there is a movement out there that has the money to kick them out of office at their whim, they will begin listening, and voting, differently. Before progressives can become respected, they must be feared. Nobody is afraid of progressives right now, as clearly evidenced by current events. And joining the Green Party is not really an option due to the way the political system here is rigged against third parties. Taking back control of the Democratic party is the only option with any chance of success.
Can progressives take back the Democratic Party? Sure. This was done once before between 1968 and 1972, when a progressive named George McGovern ran for election against Richard Nixon. The years between the disastrous convention of 1968 in Chicago and 1972 saw radical rule changes within the Democratic Party that resulted in McGovern’s nomination. After his loss, those rule changes were reversed and the hacks resumed control. So it can be done. But not without money and effort. So donate generously to primary challengers from the left. Please.
I agree. We don’t currently have a course of action that is effective. What our government has done, in conjunction with corporations and banks, is essentially strip us of our voice in the government. It is absolutely no longer of the people, for the people, or by the people.
17% approval rating, btw. 77% disapproval.
The trouble with “doing something about” Congress… is that the founding fathers cleverly set it up so that fixing congress is a piecemeal approach…
I wish we could do like the Japanese prime minister did last year and throw the bums out en masse… I don’t think the U.S. would be any the worse for wear…
And we could get new blood in across the political spectrum… and frankly, we should probably just do away with ruling elite called the Senate and stick with the House.
“The effort to keep this bill from passing lives on after Dennis Kucinich’s defection, though it did indeed signal the death of the progressive resistance in Congress.”
The effort, going forward, “to keep this bill from passing” in the House is now in the hands of Republicans, Blue Dog Democrats, and what’s left of the Stupak coalition.
The old saying, “the enemy of my enemy is my friend” has never been more appropriate Jane.
They CAN rescind your insurance based on fraud, which is the same reason they use now. They give you the insurance and when you get sick enough to cost them money, they accuse you of some fraud in your insurance application. Fraud is hard to prove or disprove, so the case winds its way through the courts for the long haul, no easily knocking the case out on either side. In the meantime, they bank their money and you die, problem solved. Even if they lose a wrongful death suit in the end, it’s years later and a dead person is worth less in damages than a really sick one. They do it now and the same language that allows them to do it is in the new bill so they’ll keep doing it after passage.
This is a pro-Republican, pro-businees HCR bill and does not emulate the European healthcare system whatsoever.
The Republicans do not really “oppose” this bill because it is so close to the GOP economic ideology. The Republicans oppose this bill only because the Dems have introduced it and will get credit for it…..
I am amazed how DUMB The Many Obama/Dem Party aplogists are regarding this bill. This bill transfers public dollars into the private sector and mandates people take their net profits from work and put into private insurance companies….It also ensures that more and more dollars will be printed at high and higher inflationary rates and making the American economy weaker and weaker.
This is a Bill that warms the hearts of corporate execs working in big Pharma and Big Insurance companies.
Any true leftist worth a damn would never ever support this Republican, pro-Reagan bill.
It’s time to vote them all out. That’s about it. Stop spending our time trying to work with these people because clearly they lie and steal. If we want to do what’s best for this country, we need to start helping 3rd party candidates run this year. I’ve never been so disappointed in our government in my life. I am stunned that the president was making backroom deals while saying the complete opposite in public. We need to stop worrying about the Republicans winning if we support 3rd party candidates.
The Japanese prime minister had it right, but who are our replacement options? The people that sell us out at the state level? Or the county level? We don’t have viable options right now. That’s the point I was trying to make. We don’t have an effective, viable candidate to rally behind. We thought that was Obama. He failed. Who’s to say the next sensation won’t do the same to us all?
We need the guy that runs the local grocery, a rural farmer, a 911 dispatcher, a gas station clerk. Someone who fucking GETS IT.
No one in our government right now GETS IT.
So, we have the Greek, Hebrew and Japanese talented troll and the urberVU troll.
Please stop feeding. They feed all over.
“I hate to agree with MrCleveland since he’s obviously some kind of troll, but anyone who actually believed there would be a single-payer or public option in this legislation after all the signals that it was corporate-written and blessed was engaging in self-delusion.”
Duh….duh…..uh….duh….huh to you….
No shit sherlock….man, you are so astute ain’t ya?
Who said I “actually believed there would be a single-payer or public option in this legislation after all the signals that it was corporate-written?”
I knew the score long ago of what was gonna happen here. I also have known all along that Anthony Weiner, Alan Grayson, and others in the Democratic Party have been blowing smoke up the asses of the gullible and naive, in their various pledges—they are SCONDRELS & PIGS!!!!!!
That being said, I can still oppose this bill and point out what asswipes the Democratic Party are and being run by the criminals from Chicago.
I was never, contrary to your baseless charge, ever, “engaging in self-delusion.”
and these are the people you would like in charge of a public option?
Trust me, as someone who has lived in lots of countries with public options….tonnes of decisions regarding what gets covered and to what extent are these sort of backroom political arm-twisting deals….
I don’t see how you can consider it such a panacea….government isn’t really good…doesn’t this prove it?
Thank you, PCCC!
What about DFA? Shouldn’t they be commended, too?
One can make a very strong historical, logical, and mathematical case for abolition of the Senate on the grounds that it services exactly zero of the functions ascribed to its necessity, and further acts purely as a defense for the government against the people.
That is the most foolish, unthinking, lame talking point of this entire debate. They spent the money SHAPING the bill NOT KILLING IT. There is a difference. If they were trying to kill it, you’d have Harry and Louise sitting at your kitchen table tsk-tsking about how this bill is going to raise your premiums. For crissake, AHIP practically wrote this bill. Wake up and smell the coffee. No one has made a serious argument that the insurers are trying to quash this bill because they are not.
It’s ok if it is your guys doing it, remember? That’s how American politics works.
For once I side with Republicans I hope this bill doesn’t pass, what an abomination.Obama is a fraud I have lost all faith in politics. There is no chance this country will ever be a progressive/liberal one. We are on our way to being a third world nation it’s so sad what happened to this country.
The owners don’t like it when we slaves get uppity.
I think Haiti’s probably the most revealing example.
And at that ‘must see tv’ meeting with republicans, Obama himself bragged that this bill was the same as what the republicans had proposed in the 90s; it was written by Dole and some other republicans.
Hello?
Again, with democrats like these, who needs republicans?
A second party would be welcome even now!
Shifting to the right is exactly what they’ve been doing since Clinton because that’s where the money is.
Blogs are neat and cutting-edge and all that, but the activist message is diametrically opposed to push media. TV telling people to get off their couches and agitate in their collective interest? Would that work in this day and age, even if the corporations who stand to lose by it in the long term would allow it on the air?
We should first abolish the Executive Branch and get rid of the President acting as King position……
Presidents have become every bit as distasteful as the congress.
Jane, is there any possibility of starting a “movement” of real Democrats to show up on election day, but only vote for good down-ticket folks?
This would demonstrate that we’re still out here, we vote, but we only vote for good people, not the Evil Lessers.
BTW, I feel so, so horrible, and this is from 5,000 miles away and a much smaller degree of involvement. I can’t imagine how you must feel, but thank you so much for everything you and the entire FDL crew have done here.
Exactly. Look at how Clinton “reformed” away welfare while getting all the goodies the GOP wanted like NAFTA, GATT, WTO, erosion of fourth amendment rights, extension of the death penalty for more federal crimes.
An African-American Democratic president? Bye, bye working and middle class entitlements.
“The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.”
Kucinich is finished, you all realize that, don’t you?
He has betrayed EVERYTHING he has so doggedly stood for. And doggedly standing for it was really all he had going for him. It was the one thing that stopped them from defeating him all this time. It was the one thing that kept his voice alive.
And I, for one, DO truly HOPE the Republic Congress DOES overturn this crappy Bill in January 2011.
We go to war with the army we have not the army we wish we had.
What happens in those countries where the workers call up a general strike? Is that tactic an effective one?
We have to stop thinking of these Pols as people. They’re political franchises for sale to the highest bidder. If I give them a million dollars and u give them $10 who do u think they’re going to listen to? They only react to the size of the contribution. Give then 100 mil. and you get a HCR bill that reflects your contribution give them $10 and you get nothing. Thats why we get nothing and the Health mafia gets a bill that lines they’re bottom line. What these franchises say to get our vote is just PR not anything more and shouldn’t ever be taken @ face value. I think were the ones that don’t seem to understand the real rules of this game , not the pols. They know they’re all professional liars. They know they’re word is worthless. It’s all of us that seem to think political promises and political actions should somehow jibe. The Pols know better and will tell you that to your face is you ever actually get to speak to them. They have a hundred stock answers why they are so fucking disingenuous and basically they’re attitude is take us or leave us but please don’t be so naive as to believe anything we say.
Are any Civil Rights groups looking at fighting this bill based on it being unconstitutional? The mandate is illegal, isn’t it? You can’t force a private citizen to fork over there money to a private company, can you? Fuck, I guess we’ll find out.
Jane,
One can organize and pressure state legislatures which renew corporate charters……It might be the time to challenge the specifics found in corporate charters…..done at the state levels.
Historically, I don’t think so. Revolution is only possible through violence. And I’m not going to call for that. I don’t condone it. But I fear it’s what we’re coming to.
Thanks for your support. Weirdly, I feel pretty good. We did the right thing, even when it was hard — not a lot of people can say that today. And the work we’ve done means that everyone gets to see a more true picture of what we’re up against, which would not have happened if the bill had just passed quickly without fanfare like they planned.
But it does call for serious re-evaluation of both the political landscape and strategy going forward. Something that many have been contemplating for a while, but at least now we will be working with a more accurate picture of where things stand.
We played out a basic assumption: progressives in the House working together can influence the course of legislation. In truth, they will not and can not. It’s too easy to align both the noise machine and the Democratic infrastructure to disempower and marginalize them. Working within that framework is impossible. But before you could dismiss that fundamental article of faith about the Democratic process, it had to be disproved. I think it’s safe to say that’s done.
yeah, I had such hope for change.
Nope, the Obama White House has successfully co-opted even the most radical of civil rights groups……
It would take another economic crash before people would see this Obama for the fraud he is.
Fuck the House progressives, every last one of them. What a bunch of useless wankers.
With this piece of legislation I think we’re headed there.
98% of the american public is being handed a pink slip.
Blue and Red, the purple you get is the color of a beaten down american public.
We have an existential common interest across both parties, inequality perpetrated by fraud of the Investor Class is what can unite us and help us win. Baring that we’re just not going to get there.
Very close, but this needs an important tweak:
Revolution is only possible through the willingness to use violence.
Violence itself isn’t strictly necessary, but the willingness to meet and resist the opposing force is.
The oppression will just get worse and worse until we do.
It’s life’s way of teaching us to be able to wield that power.
[Modnote; talk of violence is not appropriate on this blog, thank you.]
I am sick to my stomach. I still think Kucinich is an honorable public servant and perhaps the only one in Congress who does really have integrity and speaks for the common citizen. I’m sick at the arrogant bullying of DK that the president did up in Cleveland. That was sickening! Obviously, DK decided that to withhold his vote on this disaster of a bill would mean the muzzling of the voice he now has, and that, if nothing else, was worth preserving. I watched DK’s press conference. He DID NOT withdraw his criticisms of the bill. President Obama tried to humiliate DK during the Cleveland visit – tried to make a fool of an honest, decent man who stood up for what he believes. I can forgive a lot of things, but this I cannot forgive. I will never vote for Obama again. I will always see him as a politician without honor. It’s my belief that this HC bill will prove to be the democrats’ Waterloo.
Jane,
Thanks for all you have done and continue to do. Your work is refreshing and necessary. I support you 100%!!!! Thanks again!
I heard that Nancy Pelosi was calling a meeting today of all the women in the party.
Perhaps for two reasons:
1. talking points regarding abortion
2. warning them about such and such – more strong arm tactics at work
well spoken Jane, although the proof has been there since Clinton started herding the left onto the Titanic.
bygones be, – what now?
I hope someday you and I can speak candidly to one another in a forum less disjointed.
How about those “feminists” in the Democratic Party who continue to sellout choice and a woman’s right to privacy with their doctor?
I hope NOW and other women’s groups do not support this awful HCR bill, but me thinks they might be.
Well, I think the public option split single payer supporters. PO advocates went along with the notion that Democrats with a new Democratic President and huge majorities in Congress should have a national debate on health care reform and implement a new federal policy without even acknowledging the elephant in the room which, you know, really is opening up Medicare to all takers or passing Medicare for All. My first clue that Obama and Congress were not serious about health care was when it was decided and the progressive caucus, Obama, Nancy Pelosi, made it clear that single payer or universal Medicare was off the table. To me, this was a cue. If they were starting with a new, undefined program, the public option, this could easily be used as a chip later down the road to give away during negotiations. I really think if people who support public insurance had agitated from the outside for including universal Medicare (which is a behemoth program all Americans know and most love) in the discussion, we would have had more influence on what happened within the system. As it is, the narrative, particularly as the MoveOn’s, the Unions, the popular bloggers have pealed off in support of the bill, has become that this is a liberal policy because the only people who visibly oppose it are conservatives. I frankly hope going forward people don’t necessarily jump ship the the green Party or whatever, but rather that activists push for issues over particular politicians, or rather than working within the confines of the debate as the politicians define them.
Agreed. Well said, as always.
While I’ve known for years the lesson you’ve been learning today, it’s been hard having to watch you learn it, too. Like watching a headstrong and precocious child learn to walk – there’s still a lot of painful falling down.
But your willingness and ability to awaken has me feel inspired for the future.
It’s only with the acceptance of one’s true diagnosis that real healing can begin.
That starts now.
Jane, this is an outstanding article, and echos what I’ve been saying for well on 2 years now. My goal now is simply to use the electoral process to make the jobs of elected officials as insecure as they’ve made our jobs. I plan to adopt a “rotating-vote” scheme whereby I vote out all incumbents every chance I get until we get some people with sense in there, or everybody has had their turn. I hope someone with your rhetorical authority will adopt this approach or at least promote it, because it is going to take all of the citizens fighting or a few of the citizens will end up taking up violence. I am quite sure of that.
I agree. Thank you for your leadership, Jane.
Again, I’m forced to agree. Several have suggested switching from carrots to sticks. There is still the Uygur Doctrine, though I remain concerned about it alienating FDL and being ineffective in 2010.
What do you have in mind? Who might the new partners be?
Kucinich caves in the end too …
Very disappointing that not one of the progressive house members … there were over 60 of them … kept their word to vote no for any health care bill that did not have a public option in it. I’m also disappointed that it appears that Kucinich was participating in the kabuki theatre for his vote using obama’s pressure when he was with obama in public appearances this week as cover to break his word. Maybe I am being too cynical, but this is american politics and it’s hard not to notice that Kucinich started getting coy about his vote just as he was accompanying obama to obama’s faux populist rallies in Ohio.
Is it too much to expect that at least one progressive politician would keep his word and stick to his principles? No wonder they never get their way and are constantly ignored and ridiculed when they make noise about holding out on their votes unless progressive concerns are addressed.
I’ve lost a lot of respect for Kucinich … I have zero respect for the progressive caucus in congress … they have earned none … and I am absolutely disgusted with the democratic party, their leadership and much of their grassroots support like the unions and groups like moveon. It’s party above principle above all in american politics … the public be damned.
I honestly hope that the republicans win big in November partly so that the democratic party will no longer be able to credibly claim that serving corporate interests is in their party’s best interests … that the campaign cash they get as a result can’t be deployed to delude enough voters to vote for them. Primarily though, I am of the opinion that the quicker things get worse the greater chance for civil disobedience to build on a large enough scale to actually change things. Also, the quicker these oscillations of power between these two corrupt corporate parties, the greater the chance that the people will come to the conclusion that neither of these parties represent them and the sooner the hard work of building a viable third party will commence. It’s about time the people faced the fact that with only two parties, it was just a matter of time that each of them became hopelessly corrupt.
Z
Same here.
Been reading for a long time, but just recently registered; FDL seems to be the last true progressive site that won’t capitulate and that offers us some, dare I say, ‘hope’?
Many of the other blogs have been a disappointment, to put it mildly.
Thank you, Jane and everyone at FDL!
Keep on keepin’on. Please.
We need you now more than ever!
Sorry, but Ron Paul is a fool.
And Obama will get his wish: he will have a Republic Congress to *work* with to his heart’s content in January 2011.
But, oh, dear, oh dear, how will Obama creat bipartisanshit then????
I think that there might actually be a lesson here for us, however painful. It’s a lesson taught to us, ironically, by Republicans and their “party of no.”
It’s also a lesson that the HCR battle has demonstrated. Simply put, it’s far easier to muck up the process than to proactively get “good” legislation passed. In other words, progressives may *never* get to the point where we can actually pass GOOD legislation — actual reform. However, as the “squeaky wheel” that is willing to gum up the works, maybe we can get more attention by preventing BAD bills from passing.
In fact, if you look at it, progressive *opposition* to the insurance industry bailout masquerading as “reform” had as much to do with delaying the bill as our desire to add a public option did. In other words, we were *much more effective* at blocking the bad bill than we were at getting the good bill under consideration.
I think that there is a very important lesson here, about political guerilla warfare (and make no mistake, that is where we are today — we are a tiny force opposing a huge, entrenched corporate-controlled government; the best we can attempt to do are lightning strikes where things are most vulnerable).
Who ever said Obama was a “Democrat?”
Obama has no shame…..It was Obama who refused to allow former President Carter to speak at the Democratic National Convention due to pressure from AIPAC and Alan Dershowitz. Obama caved in to that pressure and did not allow Carter to speak…..
I hope for that transgreesion and disrespect alone, that Obama is VOTED OUT!!!! Obama DOES NOT DESERVE to be re-elected.
It might be time to work against these Dems including Obama to ensure their defeats and run ads about their deceit from an independent perspective. Run some Internet ads about Dennis Kucinich’s betrayal and deceit…..Play hardball right back at them. Expose the media gatekeepers of Mr Obama and the Democratic Party from Ed Schultz to Rachel Maddow to Keith Olbermann to Bill Press to Stephanie Miller to Randi Rhodes to Al Sharpton to Tom Joiner to Joe Madison to Chris Matthews, etc, and anyone else.
It is time to expose and list the Obama Gatekeepers and chronicle their ass kissing in such Bush era style.
Not all is lost here folks….Don’t give up the ship just yet!!!
Yup, Jane. This is your true genius, if I may say. Using action to disprove these articles of faith, to bring evidence to bear on the way that traditional ways of thinking and acting have us blinded. You don’t just sit there and intellectualize or yap about it all, you show what’s really happening. I have learned so much here at fdl about politics AND about being real and honest about life and society. I am better for it and I know you are making a major contribution to American politics and social dynamics. You are creating a record of evidence and knowledge on which to base a path to a new future.
All you saying is true and I hate that Obama abandoned the public option. However, if we don’t pass this flawed bill now after 15 years we’ll be at square one and everything will be repeated. Instead of just having one fight and one fight only left, a fight for a single-payer health care and hoping /hate this word already/ at the end to have a robust Public Option. If this passes now then the next Dem Prez won’t need to make a deal with BigPharma and we’ll have better chances of passing a bill that will allow the importation of drugs. So let’s keep the flame burning and sharp our “swords” for the next battle. And check this out – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIfDc8pIJ54
http://www.trueleftistvoicesagainsttheDemocraticPartyinNameOnlyShillsandinsiderhacks/
Well, not a real site yet, but could it be?
“If this passes now then the next Dem Prez won’t need to make a deal with BigPharma and we’ll have better chances of passing a bill that will allow the importation of drugs.”
snark or stupid?
The closest thing I have to representation is Minnick (i.e. none at all). I have to hope folks like Kucinich and Grayson will come through. I may be more used to the disappointment but it doesn’t go down any easier.
Is it too much to ask for both?
Dare to dream, man. Dare to dream.
Are they different people? If they are, then they’re just as useless. Frankly, the “pro business” Dems don’t have a whole lot to crow about, either. They just sold out most of the nation’s employers in return for giving a few a special break.
I think the Corporate Democrats are going DOWN to defeat. I, for one, am ecstatic. The Left will be celebrating the bill’s demise. Yippee! We can all take a bow, folks!
My Response is that I have about $10 a month available for an organization or group that will educate the U.S.electorate of the aspects of our political system that limit their political power relative to historical or international standards.
I also have an additional requirement.The organization or group must be primarily targeted at groups other than college students, knowledge workers, or the upper middle class.
IMO: These are the last groups requiring this information. Non profits constantly target these groups because they tend to have the disposable income available to donate. These non-profits tend to use highly technical language, and also go into far to much detail to interest the average person.
My Fantasy is that I will find such a group.
The lack of will to do simply what is right, under this corporatist President, has left me exhausted. By abandoning the public option, the President has revealed his vanity. I wish Kucinich had remained steadfast.
Jane should say “I told you so”…
Key Anti-Abortion Dem: Passing Senate Bill Would Be “Pro Life”
Rep Dale Kildee, a key pro-life Dem who was thought to be part of the Stupak bloc, released a statement today confirming that he will vote for the Senate bill.
Keeping our swords sheathed and passing this bill … is the same argument as “keeping our powder dry” was during the FISA fight. And the Alito fight.
Jane has already debunked that strategy. It gets us nowhere. It plays ONLY to our enemies’ benefit.
These arguments and strategies are very 2004. They are very Kerry.
Get with the program. It’s 2010!
And one last thought. So Obama needs a win, does he? Well I guess the king must have his.
What about the people? What about the people’s “win?”
*crickets*
Unfortunately, I think pretty clearly stupid.
This is exactly what I intend to do and everyone else should too.
Jane: once again you have succinctly articulated what a lot of us were just starting to conclude. We are not disagreeing with elected fellow citizens any more. We are fighting a coup by utterly unscrupulous, mercenary henchmen who no longer have the slightest loyalty to the people or the Constitution.
Maybe it is time for formal mass resignations from the “Democratic” Party? Just before the election? I’m seriously considering it.
On the other hand, the caucus results here in Colorado offer a ray of hope. Sen. Michael Bennet, the Obama- and Party-blessed, appointed replacement for Ken “Nightcrawler” Salazar lost to Andrew Romanoff 42% to 51%, even though Romanoff has almost no money and Bennet has corporate cash oozing from his nose. On the “Republican” side, the awful Jane Norton of Interior Scandal fame is in a dead heat with an unknown DA from a farm county.
Maybe the electorate is at last ready to give the Old Boys in DC a little shock. Doing so may not achieve much at this late date. But, regardless of the odds against you, I have always felt that you fight better if you believe that fighting is not really about winning: fighting is about REALLY HURTING the other guy. I still believe this at least.
So which will hurt more? Insurgent Senate candidates? Or resignations?
I will vote for any third party candidate at this point. Really, what can you lose? Right now neither party give’s a rat’s ass about helping rebuild America for the average guy. If Repubs take over, good. Send us to the Dark Ages and maybe we will smarten up. Much of this has to do with the astounding ignorance of the American populace. We have some of the dumbest people on earth and it’s getting worse as our educational system descends into chaos. I lived in Spain for awhile and , you know what, the Spaniards know more about America and it’s government than my next-door neighbor. Overwhelmingly sad.
Yes, we elected representatives and even at the executive branch….
The presidency has taken on the life of a King in America and it’s time that position get rolled back to where it’s but 1/3 of the entire government and not the top dog….
It is time that the congress act as representatives and not as court jesters for the King in the White House…..
The media is very complicit in this too in the reverence they give to the president, as if he was “king.”
I wonder how many members of congress actually know the constitution as well. I am not even convinced that trained lawyers always know a lot about the U.S. Constitution and the proper role of government in matters of public policy and similar issues.
All I see here is nihilism and conspiracy theories. You people are really lost.
Jane,
The Constitution gives citizens a couple ways to directly check the government, one being the vote, another being juries. Over on Daily Kos I’ve been commenting on jury nullification for a while — once you see its absence, you see it everywhere, the dog that never barks anymore. A 5-4 1895 Supreme Court decision said that juries shall not be told of their power, and that has devolved today to where you will be screened out of jury service if you can’t answer yes to question “Are you able to convict someone of a law you don’t agree with?” Even after 1895, jury nullification helped end Prohibition, it could help end the insane War on Drugs, and I’m trying to imagine healthcare court cases where it would come into play, if people only knew not only their power but their duty to judge the law as well as the facts of a case. Maybe this is how the dog learns to bark again.
“I have no mouth and I must scream” –Harlan Ellison
Another pro-life Democrat SPEAKS, ladies and gentlemen!
It sucks that something so important had to be the proof case.
I also thank you for allt he work Jane. When do we start breaking out the sticks?
and you are blind and deaf!!!!
Another anti-choice, pro-corporate Democrat speaks.
So, everyone’s willing to throw away a Democratic majority in Congress and let the Republicans take over? Amazing.
Vote all the ins out thru 3 cycles and this shit will stop or start a third party.
Jane,
Tom Tomorrow’s cartoon “If we can’t get single-payer…” over at Salon yesterday was excellent. I hope you use frame 2 someplace in the future:
http://www.salon.com/entertainment/comics/this_modern_world/2010/03/15/this_modern_world
This bill will be repealed like the Catastrophic Health Care Plan Reagan tried to shove down the throats of the elderly. The mandates will do it in and rightly so. I shouldn’t have to buy a defective toaster and pay a penalty if I don’t, just because I happen to like unburnt toast. When the truth about this bill hits daylight, the courts will be clogged with lawsuits. I can see it now–endless loops on TV of Obama’s debates with HRC deriding mandates as “unfair” or his famous televised promise about not giving away the government’s power to negotiate drug prices as Bush had done. Obama is a liar-plain and simple. I don’t want to hear another word out of the Democrats mouths about principles, American values, fairness, kitchen table issues, changing the status quo, etc, etc. The Democrat plank has become one giant BOSU ball. Never, never again.
Dear Jane Hamshire,
Your efforts have made the U.S. a better place, these days it is impossible to hide the truth. Don’t despair over the “sin city”-ness of those whom would sell everyone out, stay on the path of truth, it ain’t over yet.
God Bless You – Lady Jane Hamshire
ajmc
It is worse. I never expected Obama to actually champion progressive policies and I don’t expect him to in the future. Obama is a Clinton acolyte and always has been. My orientation toward Obama has always been to try and prevent him from doing more harm than good. Dennis Kucinich, on the other hand, is someone I actually expect to vote on principle that further progressive ideas. For him to justify his vote because his core political principle boils down to the all important ideology that the President must always be supported is pathetic. Yeah absolutely, it’s worse than Obama’s lies. As far as I’m concerned, Kucinich is another John Edwards.
what’s your position on SS, – do you think it should be put on a path to privatization? (a very republican position)
how about public education? – privatize?
how do you like our financial system? – regulate or pass anything?
are you a Republican?
Long time reader first time poster.
Jane, youve done a wonderful job.
However Kucinich changed his vote because he saw the POption was not going to happen.
Jane, If you could sketch out a scenario where the current HCR bill(s) fail and we get to a more progressive/better bill than this – that would be great. It would allow something other than NO (albeit the other side of the NO coin).
Also, though the current HCR is crappy, what would happen if it was fixed over time (and it will be) would a vote NO now allow this.
I get your points but I dont see any strategy going forward beyond NO.
Frankly the best of all possible worlds would be if this passes, reconciliation passes then Graysons bill passes.
Then everything is moot.
Isn’t politics great!
No, I’m a Democrat.
I just think that this whole rigamarole is a good reason why the filibuster should be reformed.
Think this through. If you want a public option, single payer, whatever, then get the filibuster reformed so the Republicans can’t abuse it. Don’t be angry at the president, be angry at the Republicans who obstruct everything.
No, it just demonstrates how far to the right the country has gone. Obama and co are now to the right of where Nixon was when he was president.
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/03052010/transcript3.html
1. Obama is in the process of throwing away a “Democratic” majority, as he throws away liberal policies. Let’s get the causality straight.
2. The Democratic party has not been fighting for the types of things liberals have want, as this post points out, they’re fighting against those things.
3. It’s not that getting Republicans in is a good thing, in itself; it most surely is not. Rather, incumbency being what it is, there’s no way to get more liberal Dems in without getting these Dems out.
4. Unfortunately, the difference between these Ds and the Rs is really small. That’s the whole crux of the problem.
And it is a *problem*. None of the solutions are easy; and it would appear that the pendulum is still swinging right.
I think you’re being a bit dramatic. Kucinich wasn’t single-handedly going to save universal HC. I deeply respect him for speaking out against the bill, and I understand why he’s voting for it anyway.
He’s still an important voice on the horrors and unconstitutional abuses resulting from our never-ending wars, and for that and so many other things, I — and most of his constituents — will always support him.
Oh ferchrisakes! Did you read Jane’s post? you know, the one at the top of this very page?
The filibuster is *not* an issue in this particular round and yet the PO is still not in the bill.
That tells you a lot. It tells you BHO, Reid and Pelosi do not want it in there. Despite the fact that they have sufficient votes.
This will not be popular, but I have to say it anyway.
1) It is much different to be outside the government and hold to your ideals than to be inside government. They have 435 – 535 people to deal with and it is hard to order out with 8 people than to reform the HC system in a country of 300 million.
2) No one wants the progressives to cave, but they were given the short end treatment from the start. If it is true that the POTUS made a firm deal with Hospitals to not have any public option in the final bill, then that should be the avenue of pursuit. We need to extract the “pound of flesh” in other legislation for that.
3) We can be disappointed with Kucinich, but he was singled out by the POTUS, House Speaker, and left wing blogs for 7-10 days. Conservadems do not get that treatment, hence Blanche Lincoln, who was not even called about her wanting to filibuster a bill with a public option.
4) I just want to be sure that we do not turn into the Jacobin Club from the French Revolution. The litmus tests will get smaller and smaller until we turn on each other. I was extremely reluctant to support this bill, since it is minimally incremental. Most benefits do not take place for years so as a party we would lose many seats based on that. I am all for primarying (sic?) Democrats who consistently do not live up to the standards we want. There will be a breaking point when and if they fail us on Cap & Trade, Financial Regulation Reform, Job improvement, Education, etc.
I just think at this point we have to regroup and continuously push for better and better reform of the Health Insurance industry until the private for-profit companies are out of the business (maybe for certain elective procedures – plastic surgery).
Movements take a long time (women’s rights, civil rights, and gay rights, etc.). Maybe we have to support efforts of states who want to adopt single payer and amend the rule about companies suing states that do. There are a lot of things we can do before we resort to potential unholy alliances with populists groups that do not have our best interest at heart. I am not willing to get the FED abolished and become a theocracy, as an example.
Right on. The reaction you must get from some “liberals” must be pretty harsh, but you’re completely right. Hatred of the other is what primarily drives most people’s political thinking. It applies to both wings of the US Corporate party.
I guess I just don’t get it. Am I disappointed in DK, yes, but no more so than any of the other prgressives that signed the letter last year. They all caved for reasons of their own perceived survival. DK fought longer and harder than most. Let’s put the blame where it belongs. Obama sold us out early on and only gave tepid lip service to his previous promised goals. Obama is the traitor, aided by Pelosi who could send a PO to the Senate, but will not.
fwiw,
going forward, I don’t see sufficient benefit in third party building. A third party strategy may be tempting to many, but has enough drawbacks that I don’t think it is the way to go.
Better to set a course with a strategy that is not based within any party.
do you have any positions on SS, Education – anything?
Great article, Jane. The extent of corporate control of the government has been evident to those of us long fighting the military-industrial complex, out of which grew the torture program, for instance, and still protects it.
I like your speaking the truth. My only cavil was with your link on the “textbook” definition of fascism. The fascists did not rein in the capitalists, but were the creation of them. They were not socialists in any way, fashion or form. The article wrongly says that communism was the main competitor of fascism, but fails to note the presence of a mass social democratic party in Germany that was also murderously suppressed. I would look to historians and not economists to understand the fascist phenomenon as it developed.
A nice piece of contemporary history was published in the UK Guardian a few years back, and is worth perusing. While headlined to get readers via pushing links to the Bush family to Nazis (all true, by the way), the article demonstrates quite well the links between big business and corporations and the nurturing of the Nazi monster. See http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar
Dennis Kucinich was the last honest guy in Congress. He’s caved. What a waste. All those years to lose your integrity when it really counted.. Thank you Jane Hamsher & firedoglake for continuing to tell the truth about this awful bill.
This immoral mandate with no cost control is a disasterous sell-out to the insurance companies by Obama. The regulations on premiums will NOT work. Any regulations will be quickly eroded by the insurance companies, and we’ll all be trapped in a system with uncontrollable costs.
This is exactly what the insurance companies want — to force 30 million new helpless clients into their arms, trapped by a Obama’s mandate.
Kucinich should maybe return the money with interest — for wasting all our time supporting him, just so he could be dazzled by an air force one ride.
Wow.
imo that is a bit harsh, he didn’t ask for the fundraising effort here, and he is returning the money to the donors.
If it takes Dennis Kucinich caving on health care to get us to wake up and accept the truth the entire system is already dead and we need to start a new one…his loss will have been worth it.
Better to live free in the pain of the real world than trapped in the safety of one’s idealism.
Everything now depends on us.
Maybe it’s time for Kucinich and the rest of the House Progressives to declare their independence, split from Rahm’s corporate “New” Dems and either start a stand-alone Progressive party or join forces with the Green Party.
There’s little point in scraping barnacles off the hull of the Democratic party barge when the superstructure’s infested with marine worms.
Late to this thread but GREAT overview Mz. Hamsher of what happened and how it impacted you along the way.
As cynical, jaded and so called hip to corporate evil as I thought I was lo all these decades, I have to admit that the past 8 years of Bush and now Obama’s FIRST year have really shell shocked me.
I’m as naive now as I was at 16 I guess . . . . like you:
” . . . The thing I have learned above all else in this campaign is that the corporate control of government is much more extensive than I ever imagined, and the tools we have to fight its influence are ineffective.”
Like you Mz. Hamsher, more extensive than I ever imagined. Full blown facism at hand and operating freely.
And it will be the death of our country as we know it, sooner than later.
Thanks again for a GREAT overview/history of it all . . . that’s a keeper in bookmarks.
It’s a new day, again, and on we go . . . jaded, bitter, cynical but SO much more well informed than we all were a year or more ago. That counts for SOMETHING!!
It’s a marathon, not a sprint.
Go Mz. Hamsher, Go FDL, Go Pups.
Dr. Margaret Flowers, congressional fellow for Physicians for a National Health Program Interview on Democracy Now! With Amy Goodman from February 26, 2010:
DR. MARGARET FLOWERS: You know, we could only imagine that it affects it pretty strongly. And we saw that through the year, is that the members of Congress need to get reelected, and if they speak out against the interests who are funding their campaigns, they’re not going to get that funding. So we continue to see these machinations around the dysfunctional situation that we have and tiny efforts to try to patch it together, and we’re missing the bigger picture entirely, which actually the majority of Americans understand and the majority of physicians understand, that we are very different from other industrialized nations because we do not have a health system, we do not take care of everybody in our country…….And we actually could do that. We have a program that’s been working very well for forty-four years now in this country. It’s a model, a model where people can choose which doctor they want to go to. Doctors can choose the treatment for their patients without insurance companies interfering. And it’s also the model that will control healthcare costs and be much more efficient in our healthcare financing. Because we have this system of multiple private, for-profit—or profit-driven, really—insurance companies—their bottom line is not health; it’s profit—we’re wasting a third of our healthcare dollars, over $400 billion a year at this time.
AMY GOODMAN: And you’re talking—of course, you’re talking about Medicare and just dropping the age of eligibility to include everyone. But what about now? Even the public option is off the table. How do you feel about that?
DR. MARGARET FLOWERS: Well, the public option was a very vague concept, to begin with, and so many people didn’t really understand what it was or didn’t have faith that a public option could keep a giant insurance company honest. We have seen evidence over and over at the state level that you can’t keep these insurance companies honest by having a public program. What happens with a public program is that that’s where all of the people who actually need healthcare end up, and the insurance companies continue to avoid the sick, and deny and restrict care, and make huge profits, so that it wasn’t a concept that people could really understand….But a national improved Medicare-for-All system is very simple to understand, because we’ve seen it working here in this country. It’s familiar. And so, by excluding, I think—by excluding that viewpoint, we really missed an opportunity to push for real reform, because the people do understand national Medicare for All.
http://www.democracynow.org/2010/2/26/healthcare_summit_ends_in_deadlock_single
The Democraps do not “understand” and they have been useless in this entire “debate.”
I’ve got three shovels, and a trowel.
And a Coleman white gas lantern.
*G*
One of YOUR best evah comments hoss, nicely crafted!!!
Keep these scumbag and faux “progressives” in the Democratic Party away from the Green Party…..These scumbags in the Dem party whom say they are “progressives” are a freakin joke to no end…..
These jerks in the Democratic Party have sold out teachers, choice advocates, laborers, elderly, the poor, disabled, and all for their new role as corporate whores!!!!!
Let these scumbags on the so-called “progressive” side in the Democratic Party go and have a naked sauna with Obama and Emanuel and let them frack each other.
In my opinion, there are nothing but phony-ass progressives in the Democratic Party. I hope they all lose in their next elections for being the true scumbags they and their suck-up sycophants truly are!
great read, we are kind of toast it seems
You got no money, and you, you got no home
Spinning wheel all alone
Talking about your troubles and you, you never learn
Ride a painted pony
let the spinning wheel turn
THIS is how they will take out the internet/blogging progs . . . brutal. And KBR will run the imprisoned encampments.
I figured out it would come to this kind of suppression, but as with much that’s happened since 2000, I never dreamt it would come so soon, or in my lifetime.
Wow.
What a bunch of crap. It appears that you want to buy votes yourself. “Give me the money back if you don’t vote for this particular bill”, hmmmmmmm, are you any better than the big corporations that buy votes. NO! You are much worse. You are asking working people to give their hard earned money to you so you can buy votes that coincide with your narrow agenda. You aren’t progressive, that type of a tactic isn’t progressive or liberal, it’s holding a gun to people’s heads and trying to force your will on them. If your ideas are so great, than it seems like you would have convinced the democratic party to go along with you. Your post was a ramble, a rant, it made no sense except to all your brainwashed followers who are no smarter than Sarah Palin and her gang. You are trying to kill the most progressive reform of health care EVER. That doesn’t make any sense.
Quite the contrary – the Democrats have been very useful to those who pay them.
The false premise in the logical fallacy is that D’s or R’s ever did work for us.
D’s and R’s work to care for us the way Tyson and Perdue work to care for the chickens.
What makes you think I was addressing you in particular? I wasn’t replying to anything you wrote, as should be obvious. This is a case of “if the shoe fits”. If you didn’t believe there would be single-payer or a public option in the bill, then you were just as astute as I and many others who have opposed this legislation since Baucus dumped his load of crap on the Senate. So I don’t understand the personal attack – please explain, if possible.
The REAL heartbreak here is the royal screwing we the people have been getting, are getting and will continue to get at the hands of the present system.
I have no crocodile tears to shed for Kuch.
He made his bed.
I weep for the people, not the pols.
Nobody was ever really talking about “healthcare reform.”
This bill was cooked up long ago….the Dems did use an incremental approach but it was how to best weasle the bill through without getting any stains on anyone’s shirts or skirts.
The fix was in last March, 2009. The Democraps simply needed to slick its way through and hope not too many would oppose it. Thanks to the morons and lemmings who watch idiots like Ed Schultz and Rachel Maddow–both poor excuses for being on liberal side, many bought this sham……Ed Schultz is a phony who was a Reagan Bootlicker and so did Randi Rhodes VOYE TWICE for Reagan…..
There was no “debate” and no real inclusion regarding this bill. All the talk about this or that were lies and a smokesscreen from the beginning.
Again, I implore you all to get the book written by Rahm Emanuel’s brother Ezekiel Emanuel about HCR…
Healthcare, Guaranteed: A Simple, Secure Solution for America (Paperback)
By Ezekiel J. Emanuel
Victor Fuchs (Foreword)
PublicAffairs; 1 edition (May 26, 2008)
Ezra Klein, American Prospect, August 12, 2008
“Healthcare, Guaranteed is beautifully written. It describes many flaws of American healthcare with maddening clarity. Some of its building blocks should be included in anyone’s health plan”
New York Times, 33: Zeke and book featured in piece about Obama’s health policy team
“Another influential voice at the White House is that of Dr. Ezekiel J. Emanuel, an oncologist and medical ethicist. Dr. Emanuel, a brother of Rahm Emanuel, the White House chief of staff, is working for Mr. Orszag and is sometimes described as the kibitzer-in-chief on health policy….In a book published last year, for example, Dr. Emanuel proposed “a guaranteed health care access plan,” under which all Americans would receive vouchers to enroll in health plans offering a standard package of benefits like those available to members of Congress. The program would be administered by a National Health Board, modeled on the Federal Reserve Board….”
New England Journal of Medicine, August 21, 2008
“Healthcare, Guaranteed is a broad discussion of pervasive problems in our health care system, and it lays out a comprehensive plan to remedy them…Policymakers and all Americans troubled by [the system's] injustices will find Healthcare, Guaranteed a valuable resource for considering solutions to our health care dilemmas.”
Perhaps you should be clear about whom you address then…..
You’ve been fed the replies to the lies you continue to feed here, and you just won’t listen to the truth about what the bill as is will do as written.
You really need to find either better talking points Rahm, or go over to Marcos’ Place where your spin is better swallowed in the veal pen.
Do they understand?
Have they been helpful to the concerns of Americans?
I know what you are driving at regarding their political interests and who funds them, etc., but that does not automatically translate into understanding and being useful to all except in the case of narrow interests…..
Narrow interests of big money versus popular interests of the masses at-large….
I am quite aware of what you say but I cannot let them off the hook by simply excusing their actions, either, even knowing that.
And Medicare, Medicaid, Public Education, and then all the other services provided by the feds.
Gonna be a long, hard ride, hoss . . . here’s to ya, I cracked the Merlot a bit early today, while reading the insanity below. I left two lengthy replies at the end for both of them. Honest, measured thoghtful replies, I think you’d like them.
I know I did! *G*
Frankly my dear, I find Naderite Apologists (such as the view you espouse) as fully repulsive as HRC’s Puma’s.
And about as useful to progressive ideals and idealism, too.
But hey, that’s just my reply to the message yer pushing.
Thank you, OFG. I’d like to affirm both of these points.
1) It was amazing to me as well that when OFA, DNC and their ilk talked about the bill, it was all done in vague cliches — “hope” I guess you could call it. “If we don’t pass this now, we’ll never get another chance.” “Dems [and Obama] can’t afford to lose this or they’ll never be able to get anything through.” And on and on. What ever happened to using FACTS in an argument?
2) Yes, definitely make every one of these weasely cowards who vote for this bill OWN it. Name names. Hall of Shame.
But this second point leads to a proposal of mine: create a “we told you so [but you wouldn't listen]” document right now. [Marcy's work linked above -- Health Care and the Road to Neofeudalism -- is a good start.]
Make a list of all of the claims made about this bill — the numbers to be covered, the “costs” to be held down, the “pre-existing conditions” no longer a basis for exclusion, and on and on.
Then enter for each a “prediction” of what the landscape will look like in 2012, 2014 or whenever.
Just for fun, include on the list some of the “bad” stuff that they won’t acknowledge, like throwing women under the bus. Also add a list of all the stuff that’s going to get “fixed later.”
I want this sucker RIGHT NOW. I want their claims documented, I want their names attached, and then I want to see what they’ve got to say when things happen just as we predicted, as the basis for our opposition.
There are a few courageous folks who voted against the Vietnam war, against the Iraq & Afghanistan madness. I think this will be looked back up as one of those “where were you” votes. Too bad DK is going to be on the wrong side.
Oh, and like the Obama White House did not cook this bill up with their own pay for play players in Big Pharma and Big Insurance?
Save your nonsense already dude…..The Democrats are worthless and scumbags and they lack integrity…..
Jane and FDL are not like the scumbags in the corporations who have bought out the Congress and that Obama’s entire campaign was funded by big banks and the nuclear industry…..
Jane has integrity and high standards. The Dems/Obama administration lack both…..
Give it a rest dude and realize that you “liberals” bend over and take it well for Obama and Rahm Emanuel….You “liberals” in the Dem Party are also worthless….and do nothing but show how weak you are as well…..
Obama will be a one-term president……The Dems will lose the House and Senate in the next two election cycles as well….
I refuse to think like that, Perry. Many posters have commented that this confirms or acknowledges their suspicions regarding how deep corporations maintain control over American policy and this process has done a great job of exposing it, even those in our own party or with our own ideology. Besides, once they called out Dennis K., you knew it was designed to take the progressives out of play, as if we merely have figureheads and don’t speak for the people. I like seeker561′s idea to localize the battles in state elections. Plus, it allows us Californians to carry on the fight to SB 810 single payer full steam ahead. And isn’t that the real reason they want to pass this…so the average American will think reform has passed and the battle is over?
I think people who find this insane rant compelling need to read this: The Paranoid Style of American Politics.
Are you kidding me? The new partners Jane is talking about are Republicans. Does anyone doubt that?
Expect the next pairing-up with Grover Norquist within the month. Joint campaigns with Redstate and HotAir soon after that. And by this time next year, Jane will be comfortably ensconced in her new gig as a pet “progressive” at Fox News while doing advance promos for her tell-all book from Regnery, “How Obama Sold Our Country Down the Tubes.”
If Ralph Nader lost it for Gore in 2000, did Ross Perot win it for Bill Clinton?
I never hear the Dem party liberals ever say that without Perot, Clinton might not have won either…..
Chew on that one….
Nader did not lose it for Gore…
Gore ran an awful campaign and was running to the middle and I remember how he and Bush agreed on lots of things…..and sounded very much like one another……Lieberman and Cheney had a lovefest in their VP debate as well….Go back and reread the debate transcripts and stop your lies that Nader lost it for Gore….
Gore needs to take respsonbility for losing—he lost his home state for God’s sake—you cannot even win your home state, maybe, then you don’t deserve to win……
That was the time Tipper Gore and Joe Lieberman went on their censorship tour and blamed rap music for all the problems in America…..
oh please.
There’s that old advice from law school: when you don’t have the facts on your side, pound the table.
But even more deeply, facts – and thinking – have little to do with this.
This is Obama’s Iraq War, and the “left” is doing to the country exactly what the right did in 2002-2003.
“Support the Preznit in a time of
warhealth reform, you traitors!”Thanks for stopping by.
My questions were intended for Jane and for those of us who understand better what Jane is doing and what FDL is all about.
great post Jane. I could not respect you more, you truly have the courage of your convictions.
I know FDL does not have much use for we moderate ‘DLC’ type Democrats, but we are the blue collar workers that have been the backbone of the party for many many years.
Many many many of us are attending Tea Parties and we come from very diverse cultural and religious backgrounds (but interestingly the Upper Echelons of class difference is there as I havent seen many Needless Markup shoppers hanging with us…yet)
Obama was IMO always the candidate of TPTB. I am of course a Hillary supporter who was first disillusioned when the DNC kept ignoring us and changing roolz as needed to give Obama the nod.
Now they have expanded this M.O. to legislating.
I have come to the conclusion that this crew we have in leadership now is devoid of ANY core Dem values
Dems will be in the wilderness for GENERATIONS if they ram it down.
whatever they have to do to get what they need for the big money to fund them is all they want, and I am done with them.
November will be epic, million of lifetime Dems like me who have been disillusioned by the 08 primary or by the way Team Obama.Pelosi has governed since, will vote GOP.
HAH!!!
Where’s Suz!!!!
I got the 400 mark!!!
lol more at myself than anything . . . *G*
Hey hoss, that’s some scary shit, ain’t it . . . dovetails with what Mz. Hamsher was saying, and what I’ve felt.
I got shellshocked from 8 years of BushCo, despite my conditioning and past, and even more so so quickly in just one year of Obama . . . you explain very well WHY I feel the way I do . . . it happened in ONE FUCKING YEAR!
We lost it all!!!!
And there will be hundreds of other ‘legalities’ the corporate lawyers will invent to either price out of range or break and deny care to anyone who files a claim.
I agree, but as things erode and worsen for us all, the will to put boots out will increase.
History proves it.
I’d have to quibble that verbing nouns is kewl now, like rhyming the dozens was kewl.
Fuckin up:
they’re/there/their
to/too/two
Or any other such fuckups of simple Engrish is still inexcusable and a sign of ignorance.
Harumph.
*G*
Hey, no problem.
Earlier this year Jane was “all about” making common cause with Norquist. My comments about Fox News may be pure snark (I hope, anyway), but it’s obvious that the new FDL partnerships will be with right-wingers. “You are witnesses at the new birth of FDL Mark II, hope you enjoy our new direction…”
Glad to see folks beating down on this one, it was tiresome below, it’s still tiresome and it’s begging for the beatdown.
People suffer under incredible stress who have no health insurance. The uninsured or underinsured who are ill suffer even more. You elect people to represent you, from your district to the Presidency. You get perpetual war and soulless financiers. And at every level, and at every decision point it is always about money. Money first. Every time. And we call ourselves a Christian nation.
“What thou doest unto the least of my brethren, though doest unto me.”
WTF
You can elect to NOT DRIVE, and not own a car, ergo not buy the coverage.
Not the same with healthcare in our system.
The point that this mandate is likely unconstitutional is a huge one yet to be tested in the courts.
Course, ya gotta consider who our Supreme’s are, and Citizen United . . . sigh.
We fight on, though, yes?
I hope so, as of now we’re ALL in the same foxholes, regardless of any small differences in our beliefs.
United, thru adversity, as never before.
The Status Quo hath NO idea what hell it has spawned.
And that I can be smug about, I think.
;-)
I contributed money to DK yesterday to support him because he would be targeted for voting No. I really don’t understand why I keep doing these things–I should know better. I gave through Act Blue, so I won’t even be able to get a tax deduction.
That’s some A Game Stuff Mauimom . . . a keeper start to finish, and kudo’s to OFG, too.
I guess this thread’s played out, no point in me tiltin at the troll no mo . . .
See Pups above . . .
As I chanced to mention a comment or two above, we’re united as never before, petty differences evaporating (mine, anyway) and the Status Quo has NO idea what it’s spawned.
Push too far, get too greedy, take too much from the masses, it will collapse, it WILL collapse.
We won’t have to do much but suffer and die in the meantime . . . ;-)
And in the meantime, we can prod, prick, and push all we can to further the fail.
Then, we or our next gen can work on improving things.
but he is returning the money.
Old Nikata, I can see him at he UN, his shoe pounding the desk . . . “We will bury you!”
*G*
Nice hit, EV . . . .
Yes, let us remember his words and the cheers he received.
- Tom
It’s pretty clear now the right thing to do was break HCR into small Bills, each one designed to bring REAL quality benefits & real savings to a majority of Americans without adding costs to our healthCare. Should’ve started with Dorgan’s Amendment, by itself. Who could’ve objected to it? Then, followed that piece by piece, every time raising awareness & support for bigger gains. Instead, this thing was deliberately made huge to hide its nefariousness.
Sorry, no one looks good in this cesspool. Jane & team may look better than most, but nobody looks good. It was just terrible from start to finish, just terrible!
Personally, I contributed to & really hoped Coakley’s defeat would wake up Dem. leadership. But, small hopes pale when compared to big money & poor oppositional leadership.
The Democratic Party has been a combination death trap and grave yard for the left ever since Clinton abandoned the working class. I hope that finally, finally, finally the left will abandon the Democratic Party like it abandoned them. We need a Labor Party Jane. The Oligarchs are laughing at educated middle class liberals who thought they could wiggle out from under their boot by talking and reasoning. You guys need an army. You need the working class and the working class needs leaders. Forget about the Democratic Party. It is a tool of our oppressors. Organize and mobilize the workers Jane. It’s the ONLY way to restore the country to the people.
It was easy to see that Obama’s election meant – and means – the end of principled, intelligent, and effective liberal politics in this country for generations. I didn’t vote for him, and it was stupid to vote for him.
But the loss of Dennis Kucinich is just plain cruel. He was literally the only one we had: a true defender of right, a person who was uncompromising.
He is no longer the Dennis Kuncinich whom I have supported for nearly forty years.
I, a former lawyer, heard it as
*I guess we should add, for the benefit of the DNC, OFA et al. “or send out spam e-mails.”
Hey Wizardleft,
Love you too. Now you may not call yourself a progressive, but the last I knew, Jane does. But I’m beginning to think she’s going tea partying pretty soon, the mentality of those folks fits much better with her warped logic and self agrandizement. I think it’s pretty funny that she is getting shunned by the majority of the progressive community because of her hyperbole, I love it. Go 3rd party folks. Join forces with Sarah Palin and Michelle Bachman, it will be fun, you can all wear tin foil hats together and drool.
Jane, do you like having all these neocons worship you, you are their new hero, you know. You lie with dogs, you get fleas.
I wish you all the best of health, I’m one of those liberals who cares about people and I’m damn proud of it. I truly do wish you the best in life, I hope you benefit from the health care plan if you are one of the many millions who will. I’m glad that you don’t get turned down with a pre-existing condition some day.
Nothing you can type will have any effect on my politics or beliefs, so save your time. Chances are, I won’t be back to read it, I have really good blogs to read like Bob Cesca’s and Booman and Ezra Klein and Daily Kos.
It’s Democracy to the highest bidder. Corporations will be able to out bid the People EVERY time so it doesn’t matter if you vote Democrat, Republican or Green or Purple, the MONEY will win EVERY time. So get over it. The sham is over. See it for what it is: Fascism. Pure, simple, and complete. We can be enslaved by it or eradicate it. Pretty basic stuff to consider. It’s a Liberty or Death moment, folks. All I hear are crickets… yeah, I thought so… arbeit macht frei
Jane, an extremely well written post. I too had the assumption that Obama and his minions would rather hang onto congressional power and pass a modest but good bill. For this bill to devolve into such a blantant fascist bill and the mind numbing hypocrisy of the Democratic Fascist establishment to justify and control the debate is the greatest example of arrogance and hubris I have ever witness in my life. Maybe Carrol Quigley was right in Tragedy and Hope. I discounted it as to conspiratorial but he appears to be correct in his assertion that a secret cabel controlled the power and they switch between the two political parties to keep the masses happy. Well they never counted on the Internet and the jig is up. I’m no motherfucking fascist. The Democrats have destroyed themselves with this bill and its process so the powers to be can’t pull the old switch-a-ro anymore. Yea the rethugs will win this fall but I think near damn every democrat fascist is going to lose. They went a bridge to far this time. Only after this coming November massacre can we start to put the pieces back. And yea they are coming after SS next. 2009 was the first year that SS went into deficit of 29 billion. Now that they can’t raid the SS trust fund anymore they will increase the retirement age and reduce the benefits. At least I’ll be able to see the descrution of one wing of the fascist party in my lifetime. Like I posted earlier their epitaph will read ” Here lays the Democratic Party 2010 ” I ran as a progressive but I ruled as a fascist.” Have fun in hell. Good riddens.
We actually talked about that tonight. We need to get an archive together of all our health care posts.
I was pulling up thing we’d written in June and July of last year that provided a pretty clear roadmap for how things would play out. At each and every turn, the propagandists would say thing like “you have no idea what you are talking about…the President would veto a bill without a public option. He supports it. We should take him at his word.”
It just deteriorated to more and more feeble excuses over time. But the reality of the situation never changed. Just deeper and deeper layers of muck getting dragged to the surface.
Thanks Larue, and to you too!
I am about as big tent as it gets and you are dead wrong. You need to learn the difference between paying premiums and getting coverage. This bill has the former, not the latter.
Jane,
One of the sad lessons that we learned from this is that we cannot really trust anyone who is now in Washington. They have ALL sold out.
We need to replace the whole lot. People like you, with a truly progressive position, who have the image and the clout, need to step forward and run for office. There is no other way short of a revolution in the streets (which will never happen in America again).
Well said my friend. This is a discussion that is evolving here at FDL and I hope other places. I use the word coalition as well, and I like your ‘transpartisan’ idea.
Coalitions were important for most of the important social change movments in our history. I think Jane has done an important job by naming some of the elements– anti-corporate, anti-war, pro-justice….
You can see how scary this notion is to some people by their inability to understand our critique of the HCR— they hear it as ‘republican talking points’ and seem to have no understanding of the deeper values of the progressive movement. And they seem unable to recognize that the Fed and the Treasury are completely captured by Goldman Sachs and Wall Street.
This will be a fascinating process of education and awakening for many–
Carry it forward!
Your effort to turn a tactical alliance into something sinister amounts to nothing more than mighty lame smear.
First, if you’re going to come here and defend a bill that amounts to neoliberal corporatist supremacists’ wet dream, don’t throw around terms like “right-winger” as if you’re a hero of the “left.”
Second, you don’t think that Obama’s engaged in similar tactical alliances for far less worthy reasons?
Lynn Fucking Woolsey, co-chair of the Congressional Faux Progressive Caucus, on Countdown. Now she’s saying that she’s for single payer. What a fraud.
That’s good…serfs…
Plan given to Whitehouse/Congress will pay for public option w/o new taxes or fees; And it cuts the carbon footprint of gov buildings by 50%. An answer from the heartland.
whitecollargreenspace.blogspot.com
This could be Obama’s hail Mary.
Here is a major proposal I just shared with GSA, GAO, EPA, Senator Levin’s office and professors at Georgetown and GWU.
The fact that the federal government uses over a billion square feet of office at an efficiency level of only 30% borders on malfeasance from a budget and environmental viewpoint. Someone needs to let the White House know there is a way to pay for the public option.
This proposal would save the Federal government close to $50 billion per year enough to pay for the public option with only an executive order. We should get more congressman to sign on if we can show it is paid for and requires no new taxes or fees. We can no longer afford to let all white-collar workers that still have jobs work banker’s hours when we can work two shifts per day in government and private industry and cut our overhead costs in half. This simple paradigm shifts solves three problems: It jumpstarts economy and fights poverty, cuts pollution, reduces budget deficits.
Most office space is very expensive yet white collar workers only us it 8 hours a day, 5 days a week. This amounts to only 30% efficiency which is completely unacceptable in today’s economic and ecological environment. As an American, I would like to present my answer the health care mess, global warming which actually should be called over-pollution, unemployment, empty buildings and state budget shortfalls.
And if she was selected as the Progressive Co Chair, what does that tell you?
She is the epitome of wimp. So the real question is who voted her co-chair?
And why? She is clearly no leader….she is more aptly, as easy roll. Why isn’t Anthony Weiner a progressive chair? Of course, Alan Grayson is my cup of tea. He has an amendment to add medicare. And he’ll keep pushing…just see him hearings to know his character. He is a fighter. He has been out in front and is only a freshman…Kucinich had no one in his corner in the end…The real blame should be on the leaders…the Progressive Caucus…Pelosi and Reid…They caved…As for Obama….the Ultimate Wimp corporatist…But Repubicans are even worse….look where Texas is headed. It is all very depressing. No real news these days…just propaganda…But when there is a power vacuum, something does emerge…the question will be though…what?
Sorry, but the PO saves money, it doesn’t need money to pay for it in the way your comment suggests.
ANd this is interesting.
ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS: STOP THE PUSH FOR GLOBAL WARMING LEGISLATION
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-kieschnick/environmental-groups-stop_b_503254.html
By Michael Kieschnick, President of CREDO Mobile
Posted: March 17, 2010 05:50 PM
THIS is what makes FDL stand head and shoulders above all other political blogs: integrity. God bless you, Jane. Never give up.
BTW, four words:
REAL.
CAMPAIGN.
FINANCE.
REFORM.
Her effort to describe what she’s doing as a “tactical alliance” is disingenuous. But let’s see how happy you remain as these alliances multiply. The PUMAs will cheer her on, of course, but I suspect that the remaining progressives will eventually jump ship.
I’m no hero of the left, or anything else for that matter, but I’m no right-winger. And if you think supporting the bill makes one a conservative, you need to figure out why 95% of the people and organizations who comprise the left in this country are in favor of it. Maybe they’ve all been faking it for years. Maybe they’ve all been beaten into submission. But maybe, just maybe, they’re right and you’re wrong.
Since I think Jane does this primarily to remain in the public eye, no.
The money saved by having 2 shifts of white collar workers might allow us to cover the remaining 15 million uninsured or offer a public option. IT also cuts the carbon footprint by 50%. It may take hundreds of years to see if we have caused global warming or cooling but we must reduce pollution to lowest levels possible as it is making us sick. Many chemicals in the environment can alter the functioning of our genes and hormones:
You are correct—I am a Radical Leftist and I confront people face to face. I have confronted right wing Republicans and phony liberals face to face and on the local level I have supported Democratic Party candidates who have been sold out by the local Dem party in my town because they took principled stands against the party machine.
Obama is running the White House like the old political machine from Chicago. Obama is a Republican posing as a Democrat. Obama is politically challenged and its handlers in his camp which run the show contrary to past thinking and the narrative about him. Rahm Emanuel is a thug who threatens people and I believe he did go after Eric Massa in the shower and in the nude. Emanuel is a diabolical individual who is nothing but someone who threatens others and with violent means if they do not do what he wants.
As for Jane and her being a progressive—I respect that not for being a progressive per se but because she has integrity and is always consistent in what she does and says and writes. Unlike the faux “progressives,” Jane has honor and is honorable and trustworthy.
Sister Jane,
If we get more people like you involved in politics and framing of policies this world would become a fair place and a paradise for all to enjoy life, liberty and pursuit of happiness.
What we have right now in congress is people getting promoted to upper echelons of power based on being best actors & actresses (literally looks) which explains $400 hair-cuts with our hard earned money on campaign trials and willingness to compromise with corporate lobbyists to the bottom most level. Thats why all that we are getting from congress for last three decades is scams labelled reforms to siphon middle class dollars either directly or indirectly.
These totally compromised people in congress and senate will never agree to CAMPAIGN REFORM. Corporate Lobbyists will never let them vote that way even if they get a moment of reflection and feel guilty.
Realistic track is find a party which does not accept a dime of corporate donations like GREEN party in targeted deep blue districts to get 5 representatives and 1 senator from a small deep blue state elected. This is a realistic achievable goal since they can do door to door campaigning explaining how their elections will change the behavior of congress for good. They will bring out the muck from the congress with 5 representatives becoming the swing vote till bill becomes public friendly and 1 senator holding the bills and appointments till the bill becomes good.
This is the way to make things better in America for our next generation.
Dear Jane,
I found this article by Chris Floyd at his site on Dennis Kucinich. Here are some excerpts I thought you may like. Here it is:
Pressure Drop: Brave Sir Dennis Ran Away
Written By Chris Floyd
Wednesday, 17 March 2010 23:44
“….Kucinich drops opposition to health-care bill (Washington Post)….Well, so much for conscience. The other day here, we had kind words for the stand taken by Dennis Kucinich against the boardroom-backroom boondoggle known as the health care bill. The main thrust of that post was not meant to be the innate wonderfulness of St. Dennis but the hypocrisy of the “Fightin’ Progressives,” such as Commander Kos and Alex Koppelman, who had launched a vituperative attack on Kucinich for daring to oppose the bill — a measure which not only represents a complete and craven surrender of even the smallest crumbs of the progressives’ original hopes for health care reform, but was also fatally tainted by the brazen bribe Obama took from the gorging, gouging drug and insurance cartels to make sure their destructive sway over American health care remains unbroken.…Still, I admit I was pleasantly surprised to see Kucinich stand up against the health care bill, apparently on principle, especially as he was also sponsoring a bill to end the Afghanistan War at the same time. (I realize the latter was a wholly symbolic act — then again, all acts are symbolic to one degree or another; that is, they symbolize the moral stance behind the act, whether it is effective or not. Thus, “savvy” compromises on, say, appropriations for the Terror War or detainee policy or illegal surveillance symbolize an underlying acceptance of atrocity, tyranny and war crime.)…. But I suspected the fix was in when I saw reports that Kucinich was flying with Obama for a presidential appearance in Ohio. There was little or no chance that Kucinich would have been engaged in such high-profile hitchhiking if he was not already in the bag for Barack….And so it proved. Kucinich’s cave-in did win him a respectful nod from the New York Times, which featured his turn-around in a front-page web story that had none of the usual snide asides about his “kooky” ideas that normally accompany any mainstream mention of him….”
Read the rest @:
http://www.chris-floyd.com/
Commander Kos also known as Markos Moulitsas….Yeah that guy…what a troublemaker and agent of the government to undermine American citizens who choose not to be thugs like the DailyKos people led by Markos.
Siberian Khatru: On Being Banned by Daily Kos
Written by Chris Floyd
Tuesday, 30 May 2006 09:07
Last week, I was banned from contributing to Daily Kos, apparently for criticizing the Democratic cave-in on Peeper Hayden’s CIA nomination a bit too forcefully. At least I think that was the reason; maybe they just didn’t like the cut of my jib, I don’t know. This banishment to Kossack Siberia is a matter of no great importance, of course, neither to the wider world nor to me, but as the shunning was accompanied by several ugly and false personal accusations against me (and our webmaster here, Richard Kastelein, who was also banned), I thought I would take this opportunity to respond. I wouldn’t want to let swift-boatian slanders enter the public record unchallenged. (Although I suppose I could emulate the exquisite timing of John Kerry, and make a bold stand in my own defense – two years from now.)….Anyway, for anyone interested in this admittedly esoteric subject, the response can be found after the jump….”
After the banning, I asked DK if I could respond to the lies and insults of some of the site’s commenters. This request wasn’t granted, but below is the reply I would have posted.
Correcting Some Misapprehensions
“….As a very occasional diarist on Daily Kos, I seem to have stepped into a controversy that has left me puzzled. I honestly could not figure out why such an uproar had arisen over a short diary that I posted following the overwhelming Senate vote to confirm Gen. Michael Hayden, the operator of the Bush Administration’s covert campaign against the privacy of American citizens, as CIA director. Having thought a bit about the situation, I decided that it sprang largely misapprehensions by some Kos readers — and on my part as well. This is an attempt to correct some of those misapprehensions….First, I’d like to address the accusation that I’m some kind of “troll,” that I “love being derogatory to Democrats,” etc. This charge is incomprehensible to me. I don’t feel I have to prove my bona fides to anybody in this regard, but perhaps in these overheated days, I do. I published my first piece attacking right-wing Republicans in 1978 — before many of commenters here were even born, I’m sure. I first attacked, in print, the rise of the fanatical, politicized “Christian Right” and its growing symbiosis with the Republican Party in 1982. For almost 30 years, I have been denouncing, in print, in public, this nightmare hard-right movement that has slowly consumed our Republic and now reached its apotheosis in the Bush II administration. To those readers who accuse me of being a troll, of “loving to be derogatory to Democrats,” I can only say: what have you been doing to combat the right-wing for the past 30 years? When did you start speaking out against it, putting your neck on the line in public? Or do you confine yourself only to snarky web comments, under pseudonyms, against anyone who offends your refined sensibilities?….And one more word to those accusers: I support the constitutional Republic of the United States before any political party. And although I have never voted for any candidate who wasn’t a Democrat — and this will be my 30th* year of voting — when I see the leadership of the Democratic Party acting in ways that aid and abet the destruction of the Republic, then by God, I will denounce them for it, and make no apologies for doing so….”
Read the rest @:
http://www.chris-floyd.com/component/content/article/3-articles/673-siberian-khatru-on-being-banned-by-daily-kos.html
If the Senate Health Insurance Bailout Bill is passed and signed into law (and I hope it isn’t), the only remaining hope is for the Supreme Court under Roberts to finally make itself useful to the country by striking the mandate down as unconstitutional. There will be lawsuits GUARANTEED…
Surprised it took so long to catch up with that NYT report from Aug 2009 about Obama’s treachery in his deal with Pharma and AHIP to kill the PO while he kept on repeatedly speechifying about it as the best thing since sliced bread. The corruption and hypocrisy of that episide were breathtaking! Good thing Miles Mogulescu at Huffpo brought the Times article forth where I stumbled across it a few days ago totally by accident and Ed Schultz had NYT’s Kirkpatrick on his show this last Mon March 15 (which I missed but Miles helpfully reported on it).
There’s something wrong with journalism and our newsmedia in general when a smoking gun like ObamaRahm’s dirty deal to never let the PO see the light of day has been floating around unnoticed — but in broad daylight on the front page of the Times last August — when this feature of the HCR was so popular with the public and Obama was raising money on it and moving along this corporate HCR boondoggle with the help of the PO we all thought was contained within it — but it wasn’t! No wonder he could repeatedly say out loud (in the earshot of his financial sponsors in Pharma and AHIP) that we need the PO to “keep the insurers honest,” a massive insult. What do they care? They knew the PO was already guaranteed dead, the fix was in and it was a sham and, as reported by the Times, they “trusted the White House,” Mr. Kahn (the lobbyist) said.
Jane, your I like your analysis here, altho I don’t see Kucinich as a “defector.” I’m not fond of his vote but I respect his right to cast it the way he felt he had to. I’m not a hot K fan (he doesn’t have an ideal personality for a pol, too brittle, an ascetic type) but he didn’t abandon his values. He’s still a progressive, I believe, not a defector. He did what he felt was the right thing to remain effective in his own skin. I doubt he voted yes for corrupt reasons, to take corporate money, whereas other Dems might have. His vote would probably not have made the difference (who knows?) but that “closeness” factor or “ball over the goal line” factor doesn’t strike me as an authentic consideration, morally or practically. He has a right to cast his vote how he sees fit without intimidation. We have a right to work even harder to get our whole effort closer to the goal line before a guy like K is standing there close enough for people to pin the whole game on him. The whole game is on us. That was the way I finally viewed the 2000 Nader role. We should have — as a whole team — moved Gore much closer to the goal (and Gore should have moved himself closer and taken better advantage of his record and been a better candidate, picked a better VP candidate than Lieberman, and K shares that kind of responsibility, too, and so do his constituents who elected him. It’s easier to accept the outcome by viewing K and Nader as scapegoats but it wasn’t only Nader’s fault that he made the difference he did that allowed Bush to (steal) the election via the Supremes. The same with K. It was all of us and next time we can all do better.
We need stronger candidates and stronger constituents and a better educated electorate. I’m looking for a place to put my vote and am very sorry indeed I’m too old at this stage (65) to run for office myself. So instead, I (and many others) might sponsor and promote new candidates. You, Jane, might consider developing “candidate sponsors” and starting a School for Progressive Leaders to train up effective candidates, and perhaps form not a “party” per se but a movement with a name (to get on ballots), a union of progressive interests including progressive Democrats and independents and Greens; work with the Green values and add to them; let “consensus” reign in wisdom councils but not when we have to take action (I was a Green for years in CA). Mix and match, whatever.
I’m going to continue working on the PA state single payer campaign (where I live now), even if we have to fight uphill against a 2017 waiver barrier. We view SP as not just a healthcare plan but an economic plan and states need good economics to help them with their no-deficit budgets these days. Eventually SP will win the day on its economic merits.
Your strategic and political action instincts are wonderful, Jane, your insight so astute you nearly make me cry with amazement, and your grasp of policy is superb. Give this concept of a “union of progressives” and a “school for leaders” some thought way beyond my poor power to add or detract.
Why did they sell their support so cheaply?
As if we would be able to get the independents to all vote on the same page.
What I want to ask Wizard is can he imagine that the Dems have a plan to push hard for the public option or expansion of the medicare? Why does he/she think that the push for reform is all over? That is absurd. Our job now is to keep pushing as hard as we can for the PO or expansion of medicare to be pushed through via reconciliation.
Anyone else still amazed by the air time that the MSM cameras will spend on those opposed to this legislation as those who want this to pass so more reform can continue like Health Care For America Now. So many clips on MSNBC of those who oppose. Did not see any covrage of those who support rallying in D>C. and across the country.
Hey Wizard are you planning to run for office so that you too can know what our Reps (Kucinich) are really up against?
I beg to differ. I think you’re talking about socialized insurance, not socialized medicine. That’s not socialism. It’s a mixed health care system. Insurance is public. Health care services are private.
They’re not going to do that. If there’s massive disobedience of the mandate, they just won’t enforce it.
My position is that it’s none of your fucking business.
But seriously, you want to throw away the Democratic majority in Congress and let the Republicans take over? So you can get health insurance reform?
Good luck on that!
You guys have made the public option a litmus test…but the public option is a bogus piece of politically engineered policy. Kucinich, I believe, understands the actual policy situation better than you folks and realized that falling on his sword for the public option, which in certain designs could make public insurance look worse than it does now to the American people (adverse selection etc.), was not worth it.
You folks should have stood up for single payer. OR German style insurance reform that makes insurance a non-profit business. Instead you chose the public option which is not a particularly bold move. It plays into American’s obsession with superficial choice rather than facing the actual issues that are driving the collapse of the American health care system.
So don’t ding Dennis for a lack of courage. Ding yourselves.
A third party – either a reinvigorated Green party or a new one?
I’ve been amazed somewhat during the last few years to see through the curtain just how much government is controlled by corporations.
Rather than government “bailout” (because in this, as in most cases, the corporations are doing just fine [unlike the banks of course- THAT WAS a bailout], I would say government subsidy or gov’t. welfare or better government giveaways and revenue streams for the fattening of the corporations to the detriment of our economy (99% of us), all or most of our health, safety, environmental health, human rights, peace….evolution, hindering moving to green-sustainable level, and then to an integral care level for/of the planet (if we get there in time).
You’re so right – forgot to mention it in my comment – it does lie at the heart of the problem – plus we need STRONG lobbying reform. A Constitutional amendment mandating publicly financed elections and strong lobbying reform (so SCOTUS [the corporatist majority] can’t scuttle it.)
I find these comments very disheartening. Talk about progressives eating their young! I too am not happy with Dennis’ decision. But he is the best there is – cut him some slack. One of my issues about the health care deform has been alternative health – by requiring people to buy “insurance” many will no longer be able to afford the care they now use from acupuncturists, naturopaths…. there is nothing in this bill about real prevention either. Dennis understands all this and is the ONLY person in congress that I have seen address this. Dennis sees the big picture – health, environment and more – all linked. You want to get rid of someone, dump GW Obama and put in a genuine progressive. Fix the voting machines so you will know you have a legitimate vote. Put Richardson or Dennis or Barbara Boxer in the White House. Don’t turn on Dennis.
“Rather than actually helping the poor, this bill is a dangerous and unprecedented step on the road to domination of government by private corporate players who use it to suppress competition and secure their profits — the textbook definition of fascism”
Actually, the textbook definition of fascism that you link to correctly explains it as government controlling the corporate players and eliminating all but the veneer of private ownership, not, as you claim, private corporate players dominating the government.
why would they overturn the mandate? it was their idea in the first place? no, they will use it to beat up on the Dems, but they won’t overturn it either. remember, they’ve been in the business of corporate prostitution for a lot longer than the DLC has, and they’re not about to go populist now.
How to keep pushing
Clearly, the same approach will not work. For this or to influence any other legislation.
Some thoughts, perhaps difficult to implement, but short of getting people on the streets:
1. The discussion about health care (or anything else, war, jobs …) is entirely fragmented. There are a zillion websites and blogsites. E.g.:
Counterpunch
ZCommunications
Mother Jones
Democracy Now!
Ralph Nader
etc.
each with its own group of followers. Each being relatively small, none gets any visibility on a generic google search. Can we get everyone together and create a single mega publication site? At least, hope to get some visibility that way.
2. The progressive websites discuss several topics. Perhaps there ought to be a CURRENT TOPIC (pick one, healthcare for now) that gets relentlessly beaten on EVERY SINGLE DAY. The organizers of the above-mentioned websites (and others I have missed in my ignorance) get together and provide a plank for such discussion/debate, discuss strategies, how to widen your exposure to the unaware public, etc. E.g., would one of the bigwig progressives (Amy Goodman, Alexander Cockburn…) be able to get on the Comedy Channel and make a laughing stock of the health non-care bill? (It is probably the only channel that might be willing to host some such personality.)
3. Repeat, endlessly, relentlessly, that Congress and others get taxpayer-funded healthcare, but they deny the taxpayers their own money. Ask relentlessly, WHY ARE YOU PAYING TAXES IF NOT FOR SUCH MATTERS?
4. Whenever congress or any “authority” comments on the bill, analyze it on this mega website. If it merits the treatment, make the comment a laughing stock. Ridicule them if that’s merited, but do so with all due rigor. (In any other country on this planet, people would be dying of hysterical laughter at the antics of their government.)
5. Provide a concise description of the provisions of the bill. (Hard to do, given the length of the original! But I am yet to find one that seems reliable. At least, google search didn’t find any other than the official versions.)
6. If Obama could raise millions in campaign money from ordinary people by promising Hope and Change, perhaps the same can be used in this cause. But it all requires putting up a unified front by all progressives, as mentioned in 1 above.
Blogging and small-scale organizing will get beaten down, every time. (This is not to malign this organization as small-scale; just that there are many others out there and unity among everyone could help.)
Sorry for the long post, but I do think that progressives have to pick one cause and fight for it as a whole, in a sustained and relentless fashion, day after day, and always try to find new avenues of getting their arguments heard.
Great post.
One wonders if the DLC’ers in the Obama administration (President Obama, Emanuel, Axelrod) and those running Congress (Reid, Pelosi, Hoyer) specifically chose to push their version of health care “reform” early last year (minus universal single-payer, minus a robust public option, while maintaining industry-friendly provisions) in an attempt to cement corporate backing and funding for President Obama’s re-election campaign in 2012, in the process throwing the rest of the Democratic Party under the bus, but especially members of the liberal progressive wing.
If this “reform” bill passes, the Republicans will use the same strategy they used in Massachusetts, in the Brown versus Coakley contest, with Republicans saying they were against passing it and, if elected or re-elected, will work to repeal it, but especially the provision forcing people to buy health insurance from the private insurers, paid for with taxpayer money if someone can’t afford to, with people being fined (and policed by the IRS) if they choose not to. What a perfect anti-Democratic Party talking point the Republicans can use over and over again before the November elections, and handed to the Republicans by the DLC’ers on a silver platter…on purpose?
If this “reform” bill doesn’t pass, the Republicans will claim credit for its demise.
The DLC’ers who tried to push through this turkey will claim they weren’t at fault, but instead will blame the members of the liberal progressive wing of the Democratic Party, meaning that come election season later this year, the liberal progressive Democrats will face an onslaught from both the DLC’ers (withholding DNC, DSCC funding, etc.) and the Republicans (extensive corporate funding of campaign advertising), because conservative DLC’ers and conservative Republicans share an equal hate for anything liberal, but they do love themselves some corporate money to line their pockets.
In other words, by the DLC’ers choosing last year to push their industry-friendly version of “reform,” they chose to weaken the Democratic Party. If it passes, the Democrats lose. If it doesn’t pass, the Democrats lose. And if it goes either way, President Obama doesn’t get re-elected in 2012 to a second term. Especially since the DLC’ers (in the Obama White House, in both chambers of Congress) have shown that they have no interest in prosecuting the numerous crimes committed under the previous Bush/Cheney administration, holding Republicans and any corporations involved accountable. (Remember the DLC Democrats gaining control of Congress in early 2007, only to immediately give retroactive immunity to the telecom companies involved in the Bush/Cheney domestic spy network, which effectively blocked ongoing court actions?).
The only explanation is that these DLC’ers are more Republican Party-friendly, corporate-friendly than they are overall Democratic Party-friendly…and it shows.