A big part of the final push for this health care reform effort is focused on how terrible the private insurance companies are. On the White House blog, communications director Dan Pfeiffer is attacking the huge premium increases and monopoly power of some private insurers. HCAN is doing a “mass citizens’ arrest of the insurance companies.” On the stump, President Obama is hitting the terrible practices of the private insurance corporations hard. From Washington Post:
Obama and his health secretary staged a two-pronged attack Monday in a stern letter to health insurance chief executives and a speech in which the president castigated insurance companies 22 times. “How much higher do premiums have to rise,” he demanded, “before we do something about it?”
The messages are part of a strategy that Obama and those around him have begun to employ lately, to ratchet up the pace and the populist appeal of their rhetoric against the health insurance industry. The barbed tone moves far beyond that of the 2008 presidential campaign, when Obama began to say that medical coverage should be accessible and affordable for more Americans.
I agree with the message. I can’t decide if I dislike the industry more for its morally reprehensible practices or its bloated, inefficient, and completely unnecessary nature. Attacking the private insurers is smart politics and should have been done months ago.
The big problem is that the messaging is incompatible with pushing for Obama’s official health care proposal. That program will use the IRS to force Americans to buy insurance from the same, terrible, private insurance industry everyone is now rallying against.
If the private insurance industry is so evil, why would you ever possibly force me to be their customer?
The messaging would make sense of Obama were pushing for a Medicare-for-all system that would completely marginalize or eliminate the private insurers. It would make sense even if the bill only had a simple public alternative, like a public option or Medicare buy-in. I could understand the message even if the bill had a broad state waiver provision that would allow for states to possibly create single payer plans. I might even except the messaging if Obama was pushing for what Switzerland did by forcing all private health insurance companies to become highly regulated non-profits. It might even be accepting if there were only the new consumer protections but no individual mandate.
The issue is that Obama’s health care proposals don’t do any of those things. It places a few good, new regulations on the private insurance companies (which will probably see a very spotty record of enforcement because that function is left up to the states), but it will now force you to buy insurance from these same, terrible, private insurance companies Obama is now attacking, or you face a fine.
To me, this sounds like pushing for a bill that would force factory farmers and slaughter houses to treat livestock 15% more humanely, but in exchange, the laws would require every American to buy triple the amount of meat.
If everyone pushing for health care reform is pointing out how awful the private insurance companies are, why is Firedoglake the bad guy for saying it is therefore immoral to force people to be customers of these admittedly terrible companies (especially when health care reform could be done without an IRS-enforced individual mandate to buy private–and only private–insurance)?


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Jon, one of your better posts, MHO. Spot on.
Being from Germany I know how universal healthcare works. The Germans have a good system, not the best though, but a good one. Public, non-profit providers compete with private insurers, helping lower premiums. If you are “publicly” insured, your family automatically is covered as well. The coverage is very good and all procedures and drugs are paid for with little to none copay. If you want to increase your level of care, e.g. have a single room in a hospital or visits from the chief physician, you can buy private luxury insurance on top of the public plan. German health care is first-rate and the doctor’s offices are full of high-tech. There is very little wait time for anything. So it is possible to create a working system with both public and private elements that provides wide and superior coverage for the people. A single-payer system could be run with overall less cost, but it would impede the quality over time, IMHO.
Oh, I wanted to add that I really like FDL and your passion. I’m always amazed, being from Europe, that your point of view here in the US is regarded so ultra-left…in Geemany it would be very centrist!
Well, first there’s this terrible rec’d diary over at Daily Kos that blames this on Jane and Dennis and Mike Moore and I say to hell with that. Firedoglake has done an excellent job at covering this issue and being honest about it. A health care plan that mandates that you buy insurance, without almost any meaningful price controls…
–(By the way, you might not know this Jon because you’re young people, state regulatory agencies aren’t worth zip, for the utilities or for insurance regulation…that’s what the Obama administration wanted.–
…will doom the democratic party for a generation. It will make “liberalism” equivalent to making you buy a product that you can’t afford, enforced by the IRS, not a popular governmental body. Its a Republican wetdream, if they’re capable of running an anti corporatist/fascist attack…I’m doubtful that they can or that they would ever want to. They’ll just use this evil precedent to figure out other things you have to buy with IRS enforcement. Horrific.
To sum up, Firedoglake is not the bad guy. You should be proud of the work you’ve done. The choice here, and on a lot of these issues, is do you believe in progressive policies or do you believe in the Democratic Party, even when they show outright hostility to progressive policies. I’m the former and so are you. Open Left, not so much….
Philip Shropshire
http://www.examiner.com/x-10379-Pittsburgh-Progressive-Examiner
PS: I might also note that progressives need to start supporting Third Parties and Third Party efforts. I’ll say it again. It’s called the 5/25 plan. That’s 5 senate seats and 25 house seats. Don’t have them sign a “pledge”. Have them sign a legally enforceable contract that includes no lobbying gigs for themselves or family after leaving office, introduce and vote on bills turning loans into grants and forgiving student debt and demand smart strategic lobbying (Stupak vs. Woolsey). You need people who aren’t beholden to the Democratic Party or Rahm and generally people who aren’t corrupt. I should note that you could support decent democratic party candidates and the 5/25 plan at the same time. You could do both. You can start as soon as 2010 and after Bunning its clear that you only need one senator. That’s why if Nader runs in Connecticut, and he commits to raising at least 2 million dollars for a viable senate campaign, and signs the “contract”, he should get progressive backing.
PPS: We also need to get used to that the president is against us. He was better than Hillary and Edwards and the usual Republican idiots, but he’s turning out to be a very very bad president, at least if you like progressive issues. We need to start thinking about primary challenges.
And if one doesn’t pay the fines– will they go to jail?
Could this whole ‘impression’ scheme end up before the Supreme Court on the theory that forced mandates are unconstitutional? See, e.g., http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/21/AR2009082103033.html
Keith Olbermann would get arrested. We’ll see, possibly:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yl2q-2CJLYc
Steelydan3: Thanks for the reminder.
Can’t wait for KO’s return…
This is exactly right. How can you possibly be touting your reform program as a solution when you have done so little to ensure that these evil companies get some real competition? The hypocrisy is sickening. And yet, the talking heads on TV just don’t get it. Go figure.
Jon, Nice Diary as usual, but not the only reasons to kill this bill, as you know. See here, and here.
As attributed to both Abraham Lincoln and P T Barnum:
“You can fool some of the people all of the time, all of the people some of the time, but you can’t fool all of the people all of the time.”
The only people who still come out to listen to the president on the hustings are those who swallowed–hook, line and sinker–his hope and change campaign nonsense. They’re so gullible, it doesn’t matter what sort of illogical bullshit he throws at them. He pauses, they applaud, and everyone goes home stupified.
I’m sure Obama would appreciate the linkage to Lincoln, but I think Barnum is more appropriate. Henceforth, to me, it is President Obarnum.
Jon, if anyone asked Obama “If the private insurance industry is so evil, why would you ever possibly force me to be their customer?” they would be forever denied ‘access’.
And that goes back to the editors who would never stand up and allow headlines about being denied access because of a question one of their reporters asked.
We are being to generous calling them PRIVATE HEALTH INSURANCE COMPANIES is to nice.
Dennis K says it best these so call PRIVATE HEALTH INSURANCE companies make money DENYING PEOPLE HEALTH CARE.
We need to start calling them what they are DEATH MERCHANTS, AMERICAN TERROR ORGANIZATION, etc. because they can care less about HUMAN HEALTH, HEALTH CARE, THE USA, etc.
Certainly the vast inconsistency between the message (“Arrest the health insurance companies!”) and the proposed “solution” (“You must buy products of the health care companies!”) points to an attempt by the Democrats and their allies to appear angry about the health insurance cartel while quietly pushing the cartel’s proposed legislation.
As far as HCAN is concerned, I haven’t been able to get a straight answer from Jason Rosenbaum about this inconsistency, either. On the one hand he wants to “arrest the health insurance corporations!” and on the other hand he wants us to “pay the health insurance corporations!”.
I can’t help but wonder if the protests are being astro-turfed from Rahm’s office …
I left a similar comment on Huff Post today because Sam Stein had been on TV saying what a great messaging strategy this is. How on earth could anyone think that it is great to say that insurance companies keep raising your premiums so let’s mandate that everyone pay their premiums? The only thing I can figure out is that they are all assuming that people are not paying attention and will assume that the bill contains premium controls. When it turns out that it actually increases premiums after you can’t escape there will be hell to pay. And that damned Dennis Nader Kucinich will be to blame for ruining the Democratic party!
I love the logic that liberals are cry babies when we make a stand but consevatives are strong when they won’t buckle. My heros are Jane Hamsher and Jon Walker for never wavering. Keep fighting FDL to stop this insane mish-mash mucked up insurance written bill.
Totalitarian capitalism and social justice are incompatible if not antithetical. Yet congressional Democrats have now embraced totalitarian capitalism as heartily and openly as Republicans.
What is the Democratic party offering that the Republican party isn’t, – lip service?
Great post, thanks Jon.
You are a Samurai of Logic!
Ed Shultz was whining about liberals opposed to Obama’s much needed HCR today. Going to take them on in his teevee show. (Thinking he has Jane in mind.) So now latest iteration is Obama’s presidency hangs in the balance if the Dems don’t get SOMETHING passed.
Guess he got his marching orders.
I’m beginning to think the only solution is to let the boil fester until it bursts, and start over. The health insurance industry is going to collapse within half a dozen years because people will go off the rolls and survive as best they can, or emigrate permanently to Canada.
QUESTION FOR OBAMA:
If the private insurance industry is so evil, why would you ever possibly force me to be their customer?
HONEST ANSWER FROM OBAMA:
Cause they write really big checks.
And if you’re still around Jon, I’ve tried to find out on the tubes but can’t find it, and I recall you were on top of it.
Please, can you tell me if the “fraud loophole” is STILL in the Senate Bill regarding pre-existing conditions??? Because if it is, someone needs to do a better job of getting the message out there of what that really means.
within that time the american economy will have pretty much ceased to exist as we know it. If one looks at it from this, highly likely angle, then HCR is just a ruse to keep us distracted from the real, ongoing problems with Wall Street.
OT: Jane was on Dylan Ratigan, OTT OT: looked good with that dash of red.
About Jane and FDL being cast as “bad guys”, I noticed on another site in comments that we are cast as “Firebaggers”.Pissed me off quite a bit,though I did’nt engage in the comments to hit back.
Interesting how those who really try to fight for a common good are always treated like pariah.
Since the Libby trial I’ve always enjoyed the high level of discourse on this site and hope to continue to do so for some time to come.
Nice post, Jon
FDL is not the bad guy…The establishment in the halls of government is the bad guy.
Keep up the good work!!!
The party establishment all want this pass so they can feel accomplished and what they’re doing matters, despite all the evidence to the contrary… They’re throwing us crumbs and saying its better than nothing. This post is dead-on. But obviously, there’s been an overall inconsistency in message since the beginning, this bill is damaged goods, and we’ve been lied to / pandered to. Everyone knows that.
Politically, democrats have to pass this bill. Politically, I don’t care, I was naive to believe that solving the nations problems and doing it as efficiently as possible was the goal. The government is incapable of dealing with the very serious problems facing not just our own country, but the world. Once Health Care passes… what’s next? I’m not expecting any real change. Obama has been a failure and is a failure.
I’m continuously flabbergasted by the number of “dittoheads” on the left. I really NEVER thought that was possible after making fun of those on the right.
But this health insurance bill is really no different than Medicare Part D by the Republicans. They let the PHARMA industry basically write that one to ensure huge profits, and here the D’s let the insurance industry basically write this one, to ensure huge profits.
Yet when W did it, the left protested (at least I did, I wasn’t on the toobz then to know if it was widespread protest from the left). But now, not only are they not protesting it, they’re demanding we get smartly in line and follow the party lead. Not only hypocritical, but fairly stupid if you stop to think that following a party no matter what they do will always lead them to doing shit they shouldn’t.
Still can’t believe what’s happening. I’m in the middle of it, observing it, and still this WHOLE FIASCO just seems surreal.
FWIW, moveon is sending out a poll asking people whether moveon should support or oppose the bill if it “looks like the plan recently proposed by President Obama”. Apparently they’re willing to at least give the appearance of listening to those of us who are opposed.
JW asks the laser beam question. Like your thinking and logic lines JW.
The cynic could conclude its just more staged kabuki on part of Obama WH and AHIP to sell the craptastic Obama HCR Plan. Too cynical? Naaahhh….
The long range view taker could suggest the stress cracks of the craptastic Obama pro Super AHIP reform are revealed here already.
Sadly both cynic and long range view taker quite likely get to be right.
Stay with it JW and thanks for the good point outs about flawed logic line here regarding what Obama WH wants to do about HCR and letting AHIP be the doing agent of Obama WH chosen HCR.
Red lights flashing already.
Citizen Steelydan3:
The 5/25 plan has already started, there are 25-30 solid right now in the House who know that their seats are safe as long as they stay in front of their constituents and there are a bunch more freshmen who are lookin’ hard at runnin’ against their leadership this November. The physics of politics and the collapse of capitalism is gunna open a lot of space for many who are already in solid seats. And in the Senate, the 6 year thing makes it possible to get a working 20-25 Senators at any one time to run against the leadership on ANYthing…why do ya think it’s so easy ta tie up the Senate.
Yeah, 5/25 go for it but don’t forget to leverage off of what’s already there…in the end these people just wanna get re-elected and most of ‘em ain’t stupid.
So how can the public be duped by Obama’s rants against insurance companies when voters ought to know what a windfall big insurance is getting with this bill.
I’m worried that too many Americans fall for the sound bytes, and Obama’s masterful/deceitful oratory. Now the unions are acting in tandem..
I hope that Kucinich is the one vote that kills the bill..
Because they’re about to lose a butt load of customers do to the boomers retiring and heading to medicare. Which is also why they’re looking at ways to do away the medicare. The insurance companies don’t want to put all there eggs in one basket.
Good Lawrd. DKos sure has it in for Dennis, even calling him a prick!! How dare Dennis actually have the audacity to stand up for what the left, including DKos originally wanted in healthcare! Man oh man. Is there any wonder that some blogs are being painted as identical to the old proBushie blogs?
Well I’m not buying from them. Put me in jail, take away my birthday, whatever. I’m not going to be part of the public insurance company welfare program. Single payer or nothing.
Yeah, they are partisan Democrats over there. If they truly want “better” Democrats, maybe badmouthing the few better Democrats we have isn’t the best idea in the world.
Clintonistas for the most part.
Jon, I appreciate the sentiment but the reality is if this fails we are probably looking at President Palin in 2012. Are you sure you want that?
Yep. That’s why I’ve never been a Democrat. That party will have to move awfully far left for me to officially join it. I was allied with the Dems to oppose the Bushies, that’s all.
Jon. Excellent observations. I am puzzled by the Obama administration, Congress, the press, etc. Very few point out that it was the WH that cut deals with Pharma, etc. and took single payer off the table. Now the WH is pushing a bill that favors the insurance companies, provides few protections for Americans and they are being praised. Why are people like Kucinich under attack when they are just pointing out the obvious faults in the Senate (and House) bills? Why is honest discussion of these bills criticized so severely? That is worse than hypocrisy. There seems to be a general mood that is hostile to constructive criticism. FDL is a brave site. I am a new reader here and hope that I can comment occasionally.
The “reality” is IF that happens, it will be because of Obama and the Democrats, not because of Jon or anyone else on this site for that matter.
Me too, seein’s how the only socialist in Congress is Bernie Sanders and I’m not real happy with him right now either. Livin’ in FL I couldn’t vote for or against him anyhow.
Welcome to the Lake, and judging by your first comment, you’re gonna fit right in! *g*
Hope to read more of them.
Nonsense.
Wrong wrong wrong wrong and wrong and I wish people on the truly great sites like this one would quit spinning this line of bullshit! Dems will not lose the Congress, or the Whitehouse if this crap isn’t passed. Dems will lose Congress and/or the Whitehouse if they pass crap and that is what this is….crap…sorry with a capital C
There are many reasons for the Dems to be afraid of the upcoming elections as it is, and healthcare isn’t it. If they knew this is the best they’d get, they should have never attempted it if they were worried about votes. That isn’t what this is about and never was. Other than lip service, it’s obvious by actions that the Dems don’t give two sh*ts who does not have health insurance coverage at all. So please people. Quit spouting this claptrap.
We may be looking at President Palin, no matter what happens, and frankly, I’m at the point of saying: what possible difference will it make??? This is said mainly to runfastandwin @36, but I don’t agree that it’s nonsense about Palin.
But really: what has BHO DONE for you and me and any other citizen (other than himself)? What? So, if we get a Pres Palin, as horrid as that thought is, seriously, what’s going to be different?
At this point, I don’t think it will be much. Clearly Palin is in “college” right now; Bill O’Reilly admitted it right out. They are schooling her to be Pres. Palin, but you and I know that she won’t be running anything except the Sister Sarah “show.”
BHO is a Republican in disguise. He’s done nothing but lie to us and certainly has broken nearly every campaign “promise” that he made.
That said, whether this craptastic pos health care leg. gets passed, or something even more venal, won’t make all that much difference come 2012. I’ll be seriously surprised if BHO wins, no matter what.
So gird your loins and prepare for Palin the POTUS anyway.
That’s absolutely the worst possible reason to support this junk leg… just to avoid Palin.
One thing you can bank on is that if the white house passes a bill with a mandate in it and no government run health care option to choose from, they will lose congress…
Deservedly so, if I may add.
cate, what he said
I am convinced Obama is double minded. It doesn’t matter what it is, he is for it and against it at the same time. Your question is spot on, if the insurance companies are so evil then why in the fuck is he trying to force us to buy their services!!!!! It is so frustrating, and then you get people like Ed Schultz who has clearly swallowed the koolaid badgering people for not supporting this disaster called health insurance reform. I wish we had one main street journalist who wld ask Obama this question.
My guess is that they Obama Administration is just trying to baffle enough folks about what they’re doing so that the Democrats won’t lose the House in November. Right now, that strikes me as a real possibility. The individual mandate is dreadfully unpopular. A little rhetorical slight of hand might be just the thing.
UPDATE: I wrote this without checking what others had written. Not surprisingly, I’m not the first to write this.
cate, what both said.
‘brave’, hardly.
I’d be a fool to make decisions over the next 2 years on the basis of the possibility of Palin becoming president. I’m going to be working between now and 2012 to get some folks into Congress who are at a minimum left of center, with a proven track record on their stance(s).
then they are just cloistered free market ideologues, without a clue of the dark mood churning on Main Street.
Great point:
30 million, perhaps? Sweet deal– replace them w/ 30 million new,much younger customers, many of whom will be subsidized by the taxpayer.
DK on Ed just now described this whole scheme as a $70b bailout for the insurance industry, a way of insuring the privatization of health care for decades to come.
BTW, like your name. I’m a big Attanasio fan.
Yeah, but the Boomers are prime meat for Medicare Advantage. Talk about a scam.
Sebelius is planning to do some triple back flips for the american public at a meeting of AHIP tomorrow, afterwards she’s planing to give all of them blowjobs and something x-tra special for Karen Ignani.
If by “they”, you’re referring to the Obama Administration and many of the leaders in Congress, then yes, I agree with that characterization. It can also be applied to many folks on the progressive side who are advocating that we, to use the expression of one of them, “pass the damn [HCR] bill”.
First this is not a DEM health Care Plan, this is a NEO-Liberal Scam.
Second the Party of FDR has been hijack, by corporate Dems, No real Dem would touch this HCR scam.
Obama is a Trojan Horse, created by the elite for the elite, to keep Progressives out of the white house.
Just reveiw the OBAMA track Record, does anything he do make you think of FDR?
Public Option Obama says no
Excise tax on Unions Obama says yes
Drug Importation for the american people Obama says no
Abortion Rules that hurt Roe vs Wade Obama says yes
Individual Mandate Obama says yes
More Wars Obama says yes
Busting up teacher Unions Obama says Yes
What on the list above makes you want to call OBAMA FDR?
Obama is a TROJAN HORSE.
The current Health Care Bill was written by Max Baucus friends in the Insurance Industry, Obama plans is a carbon copy of Max Baucus Plan.
Don’t be a FOOL Obama Bill is a Republican Bill
What is scaring the DC elite now is the Tea Party, the Tea Party insane ideas may keep the Dems in control of congress, the elite may be force to deal with the LEFT, because the RIGHT wants to kill the ELITE.
The left will hang the Individual Mandate around Obama neck, along with the RIGHT, no one can DEFEND the INDIVIDUAL mandate.
No congress person Dem or GOP can respond to He or She is going to make you buy Blue Cross Health Insurance.
The AMERICAN people will hang any body that makes them BUY insurance in the middle of a Depression.
The DEM base will hang this Health Care BILL around Blue Dog, Spine Less Dems in congress.
“Why is honest discussion of these bills criticized so severely?”
Everyone has bought into that “don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good” crap. This half a loaf gives us something we can build on nonsense is the ultimate denial. Anything and everything better could have been in the bill in the first place if the president and congress wanted it there.
We entered the “mediocre is the enemy of the truely awful” stage months ago.
you could run up the score some more, but if that doesn’t sway the Obamabots into some modicum of reflection, they deserve our contempt.
thnx, jedimsnbcko19
Your right! I just saw Dennis Kucinich tell Ed to his face this bill is BS on toast and he’s not buying any. ed said he was wrong and we have to knuckle under and give the health pirates what they want on some smarmy promise someday the Dems. will acquire testicles. BS is right. The President is creating severe cognitive dissonance out here among some of us, by telling people on one hand how bad these companies are and @ the same time trying to FORCE them to buy their policies. The funny thing is I know more then a few people that don’t connect the two things! Why, because they want to believe the part that he’s against the health care companies but don’t believe the bill FORCES US ALL to buy their shitty products! This is not an accident. I think they’ve tested this and they understand that most of his supporters are compartmentalizing this thing in their brains. oOr as I’ve had it told to me by people who want this bill, people have to be forced other wise the Ins. pools won’t be big enough. The other thing I keep hearing is that making people buy is just like car Ins. But its not the same, why can’t they see this? Why can’t they see that without a real PO choice were in for a screwing from Corps. that are monopolies. I think its just because the Dems. are owned lock stock and barrel by these companies , Big Pharma and the Docs. Its over NO PO and buy or else. Its authoritarian capitalism in the Chinese model and its awful.
It may be instructive to find out the reason that Europeans are able to require their government to be responsive in meeting their needs.
In this country the main obstacle to a responsive government is that private corporations have through their economic power usurped the reins of government and in so doing have been able to transfer the public’s wealth onto themselves. In this effort corporations here count on a mass media which functions to justify the imposed state of afairs.
Is there in Europe the dominance of the government by private corporations which then are free to pillage the public purse? Is there also a compliant media which functions mainly to protect these corporations to stay in their position of dominance?
There has to be an obvious explanation as to why the US public has become this pathetic doormat upon which corporations disdainfully wipe the mud off thier feet.
I heard the Ins. Commissioner from Mass. on the radio a few months ago defending the Mass. Forced mandate and its very revealing what this putz said. He took the position that the people being forced to buy were in fact “Free riders” on the system and this made them pay up. In other words he was trying to say these folks as a group mind u were stealing or getting free ride on everyone else and it wasn’t fair. Really? I believe this is exactly what the Ins. companies are selling the Dems. in Congress. Its interesting though even they realize to actually try and sell the Forced mandate with this kind of logic is political suicide. The commissioner didn’t care he loved the idea.
Ah yes we must be turned into a nation of corporate serfs owing our paychecks to PhRMA and the insurance companies in order to avert partisan fearmongering. Clearly your use of partisan fearmongering to get legislation passed shows how terrible a bill this is.
Thanks
Your right. Its obvious that cost was NEVER a concern and still isn’t a concern for the Dems. or Obama. All they seem to care about is trying to get away with equating the Forced Mandate as coverage. Its an interesting calculation on their part that the majority of us won’t understand that forcing everyone to buy Private Monopoly health Ins. is somehow covering them? If they wanted it NOTHING is stopping them from buying it, but they’ve chose not to. It seems to me thats the essence of the free market all these hypocrites always bark about. But, this isn’tt about free anything, instead its about FORCING people to purchase a defective over priced product or fucking face the IRS. The Dems. and the pundits even the ones on the left like ED are actually swallowing this BS for some reason or another? Have things slid so far in this country that we don’t even know anymore the definition of what freedom is? FREEDOM is the freedom to say NO. Funny the Gopers get it because they are the elite and they get to say NO to everybody. NO you can’t have a job, NO you can’t have Unemployment either, NO you can’t have peace because we want War and lots of it and so on and so forth. The truth is they must be cheering off screen that the stupid fucking Dems. are willing to carry the ball for them here and do the political dirty work of FORCING people to buy their pals crappy garbage policies. They ( the Gopers) get to win this one both ways, no actually all ways. Its pathetic to watch the Dems. basically destroy themselves in this ways. Why did these people ( the Dems.) even bother to run? It seems just so they could get their corrupt snouts into the Corp. feeding trough is why!
To answer the question posed bluntly, one only needs to ask why Obama consistently shuns the passionate ideas of the Left yet embraces the selfish natures of the Right. (That ‘love your enemy’ crap is from the pre-tea bagging era.)
The answer, I think, lies again with the handiwork of Rahm and the nature of Chicago politics – a style of politic perfectly suited to Obama more than we thought. And it’s pretty simple really. To retain power, you must keep the most powerful among us happy and keep trickle-down economics alive. Because as Bill Clinton and all those trying to force feed the Senate bill down our throats like to say: “Take it -it’s better than nothing.”
Obama is a man of the moment. This moment, he needs votes in Congress, so his message is one that will scare up a few. By the time the general public realizes how screwed they are with the mandate, this election cycle, and maybe the next as well, will be over.
He really can play 11 dimension chess, but he plays it against everybody, including us, and excepting the corporate masters who hold the ultimate leash on him and this whole damn country.
All one really needs to remember is: PEOPLE vs. BIG CORPORATIONS.
All the rest is bullshit and misdirection. By folks who are very good at it and have no moral compass to restrain them.
freedom is the certainty that 2+2=4
You’ve got it exactly right, IMO, including your Comments #60 and 62.
I’ll just add that, while the definition of Freedom may be the right to say no, the definition of Fascism is the opposite. And that’s where we are.
Remember ever wondering how the Germans allowed the Nazi takeover and did nothing about it?
Reportedly our President raised $750 million for the Presidental election and you wonder how much of that was due to wonderboy Rahm, who had been the leading fund raiser in Bill Clinton’s initial campaign.
Now he’s stuck with Rahm and certainly they both know from the Scott Brown election in Massachussetts that theeir policies are destroying the Democratic Party. Of course the spin is to blame lossses on liberals and extremissts who alienate mainstream voters.
AAAhhhh, luxury. It’s great to be a haughty self-banned ex “member” of that whatchacallit, the daily kos blog thingie. Especially today.
Was there ever a more silly-looking little fella hopping up and down knowin’ lotsa real smort stuff for others to accept and applaud or else they SUCK than “Marco Mulletzeez?” I’m sorry. But silly-looking really does all too often go hand-in-hand with silly-period.
Have we just about cleared the stage now? Ignore those protests in DC, sign up all the “stalwart progressive mouths on TV” to sell us out without blushing, designate “rammed through” as republican terminology, and get this great big monstrous gift to the medical industry profit rats who control our lives and government PASSED? So Obama will look great and be re-elected, while you and I take the full rap for this “health care reform” becoming the Law of the Land?
Well, it’s about fuckin time! What took so long?
This issue is a red herring.
I toast ya with a bottle of Guinness.
Any legislation containing a federal mandate compelling United States citizens to buy any product from a cabal of private middlemen is antithetical to the letter and spirit of my contract with the state as a citizen of this country.
That the ‘product’ in question is my own personal health, adds an
intolerable trash flourish of grotesque poetry to the spectacle.
That so many of my fellow citizens are apparently fine with this, is only the latest of so many signs that collectively, we richly deserve our ongoing conversion into a vast bovine serf class.
Well it didn’t take long for Kucicnich to be attacked by the “liberal” media in full force as being some leftist fringe spoil sport who would deny Obama his presidency. This is to be expected and it should be met with redoubled effort on our part to support Kucinich. The absurd Lawrence O’Donell even suggested that because of his treachery Kucinich should be primaried.
Well this assault was predictable and helps to shake out who lies where in the HCR debate. Clearly MSNBC will toe the line for Obama and Kucinich and the left will oppose them. This is where the fault line ought to be. Also the majority of the people and the rabid right will oppose them. It is clear that Obama is mounting an all out effort to make people believe that throwing the public into the tender clutches of private health insurance raketeers is for their own good. These scabs have no qualms in villifying the lone person on the left that shows spine and convictions.
We should confront these assholes head on and show that Kucinich has the left as his base and that we will together act to defeat this sham bill. Then we will act to defeat Obama. We should start to support Kucinich for president and start to raise the needed funds now.
If these so called centrist pragmatist “liberals” for whom capitulation is inbedded in their make up mean to have a war with Kucinich and his base well let’s have it out. We like Kucinich can stand on principle while these Obama worshipers can stand on their own soiled ground.
I can’t get a handle on the protests. There’s been very little coverage on the bube tube, and that usually means they’re legit. But they ring unemotional somehow. Where’d this rally come from? Who are those guys? What did Howard Dean say to the crowd? All I’ve seen is his mouth moving at a mike and his arm gesticulating. Is Rahmobama actually doing like the repugs do, arranging PROTESTS of the very thing THEY are guilty of so it looks like what they’re doing is anything but what it is, despite their flagrantly evident guilt? I gotta work at this keyboard, all I have while my work is heavy is my TV that I can see/hear through the living room doorway. I’m with OldFatGuy. My mental state of WTF is just about complete and irreconcilable.
(Except for YOU, Jesse Ventura–and YOU, Dennis Kucinich, who are probably next to be outed as a groper for that time when you were 10 and had on a blindfold at a party, trying to hit the pinata. That’s sick!)
MSNBC’s talking “libs” have gotta be boycotted. Even when Olby gets back, we shouldn’t be there to greet him after his understudy’s unblushing corporate agenda-serving performance. Dylan Ratigan looks to me like the good surprise in this box of MSNBC Cracker Jacks. Go, Ratigan, and thanks!
Agreed 100%
“It is clear that they believe that a nice Barack Obama speech and a lively messaging campaign will do the trick , but they’d better wake up. The trained seals are not responding to that anymore.”
http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2010/03/trained-seals.html
I am convinced Obama is double minded. It doesn’t matter what it is, he is for it and against it at the same time. Your question is spot on, if the insurance companies are so evil then why in the fuck is he trying to force us to buy their services!!!!! It is so frustrating, and then you get people like Ed Schultz who has clearly swallowed the koolaid badgering people for not supporting this disaster called health insurance reform. I wish we had one main street journalist who wld ask Obama this question.
Ed Shults is a center republican, don’t let his bullshit fool you! He is all about making money and he saw an opening as a left wing media talk show host!
The douche bag just bought a lodge in Canada after going on and on about buying american….
Yes, Medicare Advantage is a scam. So why is it used? Many have no choice. They are not ignorant or fools. Many arrive at retirement with little money. Democrats and the Republicans have both gutted Medicare’s very good benefits for years. For people with limited cash and credit, traditional fee for service Medicare is TOO EXPENSIVE and mostly unusable. And they cannot afford good Medigap insurance policies because of the high prices. The Advantage plans were cynically aimed right at this market. Care versus no care. What would you do? Why blame those forced to use these plans? Blame the politicians. In 2009 Obama cut these plans leaving many with expensive and useless policies. He was proud of his action. Why don’t Liberals work to improve Medicare, etc? Include an improved version in a health-care plan? Why do we turn on each other? This is everyone’s problem. We need each other. We will get no help from the WH and most others.
Obama and his pathetic establishment chorus that follows in his wake repeat endlessly that we should bite the bullet and allow the same culrpits to continue to rip off people in need of health care. Otherwise they pout we will either destroy Obama and the Democratic party or allow an unprecedented once in a generation opportunity to fall through our fingers.
Well good luck with these lame attempts to convince anyone that is awake. Firstly given that Obama is a corporatist stooge his failure as a president is already a given at this time when being a corporatist stooge is the kiss of doom. The same for the Democrat lambs who follow his lead over the cliff.
Furthermore the issue HCR is here to stay. If this thoroughly compromised POS Obama sell out attempt at reform fails people next year are not just going to mope and sulk as they have to pay out ever increasing health insurance costs. Rather they will continue to steam with anger at Obama and demand meaningful reform or send him packing.
For those of us on the left who demand such meaningful reform we should do all we can to defeat Obama’s sham bill and not let up or capituale on what we want. Let him deal with his failed mess as the public is not about to let up.
There are articles about deals with more of Pharma and less of AHIP in various magazines middle of last year. In my opinion only reason Mr. Tauzin was forced to retire because he was not a smooth operator and kept telling reporters about the Pharma deals unlike AHIP who dealt this stuff more smoothly and discreetly. I won’t be surprised if the premium increase stuff is staged too since it looks suspicious something happening for a long time getting sudden attention in MSM.
Individual Mandates are an un-American corporate welfare on tax-payers dime. I think if the insurance companies increase premiums a bit more they will bypass middle class affordability, end up with small pool of rich customers and have take home less revenue. Hence this charade of health care reform (Topping of the charade I read a comment recently that the senate bill written probably by AHIP and Pharma and being pushed by executive branch even dis-allows states to have single payer solutions if they want it in future).
Till end of last year I was having the illusion of real reform with Public Option present and now I don’t have anymore. It’s a really bad bill for the Americans, American industries competitiveness, American Economy and is not in line with American Values. So Kill the Bill.
Frankly, the HC crisis points us to ne glaring thing. America is actually a center right and right wing country. And there are deeply misinformed people whose opinions work against their own self interest. The’ve drunk the tea.
What is considered good government in Europe and elsewhere is considered as socialist here. Contradictions abound because of the number of truly ill informed people who want their Medicare, but not “government run insurance”. No one has informed them that Medicare and Medicaid are run by the US government.
The muddled,mangled,mess of a bill that wants actually to throw us into the hands of private insurers and mandate that we do this be fined is reprehensible. Bait and switch, and Obama knows it but talks about the bill as though the Insurance companies are the enemy. If so, why did Obama make his backroom deals with Drug and Insurance lobbies from the get go?
So it’s once again bait and switch and as a loyal democrat this bill should be defeated I say. More than that the anti abortion add ons are disgusting,degrading and reactionary to the nth degree.
Obama is a Conservadem. He will be sent packing. His lack of leadership and devious deals with corporate insurers and PHarma are disgraceful.
Obama wants to be re-elected on your back. Money? Insurance,drug,and Wall St money for re-election.
Obama has squandered an opportunity with a hue mandate and political capital now gone. A wasted year in the middle of economic crisis and pain and this tone deaf man mismanaged and sold out. Leadership? None in the vacuum we watched congress until we cringed.
I am still cringing over the lost opportunities and broken promises.
Obama was selling illusion.
I doubt that Obama is better than Hillary but it no longer matters. He’s a terrible president who has left behind any principles if he even had them in the first place.
Obama will sink the Democrats for many years. he’s lied, he’s dealt in the backrooms with the corporate lobbyists, he’s been silent and inarticulate for a year hoping to ram this through without too much explanation.
But without real leadership and courage the Democrats dissolved into chaos and infighting,confusion,bribery, and corruption coupled with no rudimentary sophistaction of mastering parlimentary bargaining produced wht current situation.
Obama tells us how evil the Insurance companies are yet he wants to deliver us right straight to them. People are catching on. go to the Sunlight Foundation on the web for some eye openers the press has not covered. You know, access.
This will be the year rememered as the one that blew the Democrats out of the majority for a long time. The fools cannot govern.
Thank you.
We are gullible and we do not protest meaningfull en masse.
We want it done for us, but we must change it. Either a third party or elect decent dems if there’s anything left of the party after this fiasco and Obama’s defection.
We are living in a hype of illusion and lies and hold these bastards to task at the ballot box. Team Obama is corrupt Chicago politics of yore and seeing it in full bloom is the most desructive imaginable for Dems in the future. People are suffering through this tone deaf administration because there is actually nothing in it for the WHouse.
It’s typical of Obama. He tries to score political points and votes with his rhetoric, but it has no bearing on what he actually does. It’s how he got elected. I don’t understand how he has any credibility by now. 2012 will be interesting.
Keep fighting the good fight Jane. You know your right when Marco’s the insider is fighting for a bad bill. The only problem is that Marco’s and the Washington crew won’t being dealing with the level of hurt that most American’s will. They’re screwing the middle class again for a bad bill that is promised to be made better at a later (it’ll never happen) time.
Thank you. I think the bill is much too flawed and pro-industry to be “fixed.” I admire Dennis Kucinich for his courage and sent him an e-mail yesterday. I do fear for those Americans who are not well off and will suffer from this wasted opportunity re health-care, jobs, etc.
“…will doom the democratic party for a generation. It will make “liberalism” equivalent to making you buy a product that you can’t afford, enforced by the IRS, not a popular governmental body. Its a Republican wetdream, if they’re capable of running an anti corporatist/fascist attack…I’m doubtful that they can or that they would ever want to.”
That’s the beauty of this plan. Republicans do not have to run an anti-corporate campaign vs. the D-Party. They can run an anti-GOVERNMENT campaign.
And, because the government IS the oppressive totalitarian agency enforcing the plan, it will be impossible for D-Party shills to tar everyone with the anti-government “tea bagger” label without looking like oppressive totalitarians themselves.
And is that not, in fact, the way that everyone looking for a BETTER reform experiences the Party shills–and “the government”–right now?
If this Bill goes through, it is going to change the political dynamics and people who look to shelter the population from the pernicious one-party fascist state are going to develop new arguments and alliances.
The old storyline about the nice, pro-publica, good government liberal D-Party is played out.
I say let the Republicans F- ‘em. They earned it.
You need a new party.
“Jon, I appreciate the sentiment but the reality is if this fails we are probably looking at President Palin in 2012. Are you sure you want that?”
ooga booga. More likely it’s His Royal Highness, Permanent Mayor Bloomberg that’s been tapped to front the fascism properly in 2012.
It’s so necessary to pass the Rahmbama Bill because it will virtually guarantee His Royal Highness’s succession.
If you think about it, you’ll see the merits of this theory. You’ll also see where we’re headed.
I hated Nixon, but he said one thing I’ve always honored. In his first Presidential acceptance speech he told us in not so many words to ignore his words and instead watch his actions. I’ve made that a rule every since and not just for pols but for people in general and you’d be astonished at how common place the disconnect between what people say and what they do is. Obama thinks as do many Pols that he can say anything and that noone will then follow up to see if his words are followed by actions that fit them. Unfortunately, for him with modern communications and the Internet this is now possible 24/7. The glaring disconnect of what this man is saying and what he is doing has already destroyed his credibility among many of us. I don’t think he cares nor do I think does the rest of the villagers as we now call them. Why? because these are people who don’t believe as some of us do that a person after all is really ONLY as good as his or her word. The simple truth is Obama and most of the rest of the political class out here today are people without honor or as the Orientals call it FACE. They think politics is a game where if they can fool you and get away with it they win. They also think that they can say anything if it serves their purposes and that after saying it nobody really cares if its even remotely connected to what they actually then do. Obama is a man with no honor and amazingly it appears as much as I hated everything GW BV$H stood for he was a man of honor atleast in that sense as was Hitler. So being a man of honor doesn’t have to mean your a good man or a bad man its just an affirmation that what you say and do jibe for the most part. Whats causing so many of us to drop our support for Obama and his regime is that we realize he in fact is a man with NO honor whats so ever so far. That he has absolutely no problem lying to our faces about what he is really going to do on any subject or policy and this is most disturbing.