Yes. Kucinich is so damn consistent.

Went onto a shit load of Ohio blogs yesterday afternoon announcing this contest along with quite a few other blogs.

Dennis and Grijalva deserve to be recognized for having consistent progressive values and voting records

I think the AIPAC e-mails have gone out as well. Prepare for a Weiner comeback.

I had voted for Grayson first, Kucinich second and Wiener third. But reading this, I feel bad that Kucinich blew past Grayson because of sending something to his various lists. Dennis has been around for a long time and has run a number of times and accumulated a long progressive track record and a big list. Certainly that is worth honoring. But I almost think that Grayson, who is a first term Congressman, should get the top spot because his votes were obviously generated spontaneously by the most ardent progressives who read your blog and have been impressed with his accomplishments over the past year. Had Kucinich not sent out that email, Grayson would still be in the top spot. I doubt he has accumulated a list to rival Dennis’s. It is almost like he has gamed the system. And that’s what we don’t want in Congress, right?

It is well within the means of online progressive communities to support that kind of independence in our representatives.

I suppose the question that time will answer is how many can be supported at once. There’s no doubt that individuals congresspeople can be largely supported by this route. But can we support enough to get the 100-plus progressives we’d need in the House to be the majority in the Democratic Caucus?

To me, that’s the challenge.

Kucinich deserve our thanks, but he doesn’t need our help at all. Weiner shouldn’t be in the top three at all and he doesn’t need our help. Honestly, I’m thinking that opening this process up to the public was a mistake. Firedoglake should be offering leadership, not popularity contests.

Hall, Massa and Shea-Porter should be made 2010 Fire Dogs in addition to whoever wins this contest. They deserve recognition for being progressives who win elections in Republican-leaning districts, and they could use our help because they’re vulnerable in 2010 because they are progressives in Republican-leaning districts.

I like this contest, I think the results show the wisdom of the Firedog masses. Although personally I’d rank Grijalva higher, hope he at least wins next time.

Don’t let Barney Frank make the top 3! He’s better than most in Congress, but he’s still in the pocket of Wall Street wrt a lot of things he’s done.

How many Dems are so far Right they got no votes? Those Reps should be called Rahm’s pets we should track how they are doing in the polls.
Lets see how Rahm’s Pets stack up against our choices.

Go, Dennis! He’s always there for us.

Both should be in the top two positions. We need to send a clear message that while many of us respect and support Grayson, Weiner and Massa on many issues. That their extremely hawkish votes on other critical issues need to be examined, discussed and considered in regard to how we vote.

We need Reps to represent all of our progressive values both nationally and internationally.

We need to send a message that how they vote on these other critical issues matter.

Consistently. Spread the word anyway you can. Let’s keep Kucinich in the lead where he belongs. A big push for Grijalva too. Progressive values across the board

That’s certainly a rare and exemplary category of progressive congressperson. It would be good for progressives generally to know that they can succeed in such circumstances, and that someone will have their backs if they do.

How the hell did Barney Frank bump Grijalva.

Barney Frank (D-Wall Street) ahead of Raul Grijalva – wtf?!

Do we need a few perfect progressives, or as many progressives representing as many districts as possible?

What’s the point of supporting progressives in D+8 districts while we stand around and watch progressives in R+5 and R+3 districts lose?

Well, I disagree, every single Democrat is going to need our help this fall. The base is disaffected and demoralized, and the path Rahm and Obama are on can’t help that. Every Democrat will need help. Don’t you think the GOP would love to have Dennis out of office? And now that corporations can practically seek office themselves, don’t you think they just might find some sports star or radio jock to run against him? I do.

Right now, the FDL community is rewarding those ‘critters who deserve our help. As we get into subsequent rounds, I’m sure many more community members will craft Seminal diaries in support of and in opposition to their favorites.

And with any smarts, the ‘critters themselves will come on and argue their case.

(btw, I also really disagree with you about John Hall, but I will leave that for another time. He’s been a great disappointment to those who put him in office.)

I may be alone here but, I think Kucinch is kind of an odd ball. He might be consistant but, he doesn’t really have any power. He’s an island unto himself.

Maybe we can have Progressive Reps come once a week and talk with us make it a regular feature. We can ask questions they can answer them I suggest they have their fastest staffer type their answers for them for them.
The Dems do need to start inspiring the Left.

Well, Hall, Shea-Porter and Massa aren’t going to see that Firedoglake has their backs as a result of this contest.

But, no worries. Kucinich decided yesterday that he couldn’t win in a D+8 district without FDL support, so he sent an email out to his list asking supporters to vote for him. Just fucking great.

Hall in a R+3, Massa in a R+5, and Shea-Porter in an EVEN are just shit out of luck. Does Dennis really think that he needs this support more than they do?

Dennis has been around for a long time and has run a number of times and accumulated a long progressive track record and a big list

I agree with you on this. It seems to me that if this is about fund-raising, Kucinich has the ability to fund-raise. I thought we were using this contest to bring along other, new “talent.” It doesn’t seem fair to me for Dennis to hog the top spot and push someone promising off the list.

And what Knoxville said above @ 19.

Yes, I don’t understand the presence of Barney Frank on a progressive list. This does attract attention to those few progressives in Congress or rather shows how few there are. I still think the progressive movement lost a major opportunity not primarying every Democrat in sight with populist progressive candidates. A platform of Jobs, Jobs, Jobs, Medicare for All, Stop the Wars and bring our troops home, and Main Street not Wall Street would have resonated with voters.

Additionally, FDL is trying to help ‘critters understand how the internets work. By surging ahead, Dennis is providing an example — just like Alan Grayson did last quarter — of how to use your list, your supporters, your contacts across the country. By helping staffers and campaign staffers to see the value of national efforts, the FDL community grows in stature too.

It’s tough to get them to see outside the confines of their own district and their DCCC-provided large donor call lists. We are showing them another way to succeed, and Grayson and Kucinich get it. By getting it, they set the example for the others.

Subsequent rounds will see others learn from their example. But we simply cannot decide, somewhere at FDL World Headquarters, that so-and-so “should also be” a Fire Dog. It defeats the whole purpose of community participation.

So why did you folks change the date and time now?

“We had announced that we would close the voting at midnight tonight, but we’re going to keep it open until tomorrow morning and close it at 10am ET. The winner will still be announced at 3pm tomorrow.”

Kucinich won based on the stated time and date. Why did you folks change it now? Seems like and odd decision…changing the rules midstream

Noooooo! Grijalva is off the list?!?

but why change the date and time hours before the announced date and time that the contest was supposed to end. Bullshit

Has Hall not been strong enough of gay rights? He’s been far more progressive a politician in a R+3 district than anyone can be.

We shouldn’t be working to congratulate the courage of a progressive in a D+8 district who doesn’t need our support. We’re talking support here. We need numbers in Congress. Send Kucinich a thank you note if you want to thank him.

There are others who need our help, and we need them to not lose their seats in Congress.

Note to editor re title: His name is spelt KUCINICH. Many thanks.

Yes, I don’t understand the presence of Barney Frank on a progressive list.

If you notice, there are a number of names of folks far less progressive than Frank on the list. And if you recall, there were no criteria for nominations other than that the person submitting the nomination of the critter had to live in the district.

Even Heath Shuler has folks who think he’s worthy of FDL support with his 42 votes.

Dennis should have recognized that he and other progressives can’t influence policy without getting more progressives in office and keeping them in office. That’s called leadership. Ensuring that he would blow away all his progressive colleagues was a dick move.

‘Critters were nominated from their own districts. This isn’t a list of “progressive” candidates; it’s a list of candidates nominated by their own constituents. If those who vote believe that a ‘critter deserves support (and money) they will float up to the top of the list.

Whatever anyone thinks about Barney Frank’s leadership on the Financial Services Committee, he has long been a pioneer progressive. As a gay man, I admire and respect his leadership. I would vastly prefer him to any opponent the GOP would proffer.

Because Dennis has stood for and voted in a consistently progressive manner for a very long time. He deserves recognition for this.

Yeah, imagine a politician wanting to win a contest. What a dick.

We seem to have two competing ideas going on at once. One help Progressive Dems who need help.
The second give cash to Progressive Dems who don’t need help but can then give our cash to Dems they like in return those Dems support them for a position in the House Leadership.

Kind of a disappointment to see Kucinich supporters “freeping” the results, seeing as how Dennis is already a known commodity in progressive circles, and shouldn’t have any trouble fundraising. I can’t blame them, since DK saw an opportunity, and did some outreach to capitalize on it, but still…

Come one pups, let’s keep Grijalva’s name in the running.

Exactly. What a dick. He really should have thought more about winning for progressive causes in Congress than about winning a contest at a blog. If I were him, I’d be happier helping progressives in Congress who need support win contests like these.

“This does attract attention to those few progressives in Congress or rather shows how few there are.”

Yeah.

“A platform of Jobs, Jobs, Jobs, Medicare for All, Stop the Wars and bring our troops home, and Main Street not Wall Street would have resonated with voters.”

That’s why the people voted for them, responding to campaign ads which promised as much, which were funded by interests who extracted promises that this platform would never happen.

We’ve been actively encouraging members of Congress to go to their lists. The more people we can bring in to help GOTV efforts in their districts, the more everyone on the ticket benefits.

Particularly in Ohio, where there are huge top-of-ticket problems, being able to get people phone banking and turning out Democratic voters is going to be important for every single race. Wish EVERYONE would do what Dennis did.

Dennis did what politicians do – he went out and got votes. Nothing wrong with that. Seems smart to me.

It’s called setting an example and showing the way to win. People on Capitol Hill and in incumbent campaigns barely even understand what this contest is and how it works. They are only now starting to pay attention to outside-district fundraising that isn’t provided via DCCC big-donor call-lists.

The kind of surge Kucinich displayed, running away from the big-money man Alan Grayson, is exactly the kind of example we want incumbents to see: this is how this game is played.

Giving others a chance to try their hand in the final day by extending the time slightly, especially given the internet’s weather wonkiness the past few days and power outages all over the DC area, seems perfectly fair. Let’s see who can make anything happen given a little more time.

I see this contest more of a way to tell progressives in congress what kind of behavior we expect from them, not as a strategy for getting an edge on close races. There isn’t enough money involved to be effective in that way, IMO.

This is a problem with Internet polls. They can be gamed, even when registration is required to vote. PZ Myers (of Pharyngula) breaks these things all the time with the help of his readers. I bet if PZ decided to make Jim Langevin the winner, he’d probably manage.

And yes, I’m rather disappointed with Kucinich for doing this, but it’s not up to him who Blue America supports. It’s up to us, and to the Blue America “board” (in quotes because I don’t know what they call themselves).

/s

[wish I didn't have to use them, but some folks seem to need a snark tag]

Without support to go along with those expectations, the expectations themselves don’t mean much of anything.

Exactly.

He’s shown others how to win. How to beat the giant-killer Grayson, in fact. House members are in awe of Grayson’s efforts last quarter; every single one of them knows about it, even if they can’t read about it anywhere in the newspaper.

Knocking Grayson off the top spot by working his national list lets Dennis show the others exactly how to do it. It’s mentoring, politician-style: sure, someone is going to get knocked out of contention if Dennis stays atop this contest, but that makes Round Two all the more fun, real, and worthwhile.

I wish Grijalva would use his list. He really deserves to be near the top.

I couldn’t be more pleased to hear that DK is in the top slot. I, too, am disappointed that Grijalva isn’t ranked higher. I think he deserves it.

Didn’t Grayson say way back that he was going to vote for the POS HCR legislation?

Sarcasm’s much easier to recognize in person, because there’s that tone of voice thing. In this particular case, I had no trouble recognizing it, but I’ve found it’s best to be safe.

Have you contacted his campaign office to suggest that? There’s still time.

No, but I will.

Or written a Seminal diary on his behalf, advocating for votes?

“We are the ones we’re waiting for,” remember….

New Reps can’t be expected to mobilize the number of voters someone like Dennis can. Maybe next time we can weigh the results or have a separate contest for new Reps.

Keep pushing for DK and Grijalva. Contact your email list, go on to other sites and announce this contest. Keep pushing for DK now that the date and time has changed.

Can anyone explain why the contest holders changed this just hours before the contest was supposed to end? Who and why was this decision made?

Do you have any idea how and why the time that was announced that the contest was supposed to end changed? What is up with that?

There is a reward. It’s just not going to swing a close race. More importantly, it tells the winner that there is money to be raised from DFH bloggy types.

Grayson is brand new, none newer but that Owens fellah in upstate New York.

But you are correct that Dennis has built his list off longtime progressive opinions, actions, and Presidential campaigns. Sets a good example all around.

I wouldn’t mind seeing a few progressive ‘critters do some serious list-building in 2012 with a primary challenge to the incumbent. Might actually move Obama left, too.

They have Palin we have Kucinich

I was going to write in a comment to your post last Friday a commitment to contributing to each of the three winners and all I can say now is that I’m now glad I didn’t. If you aren’t aware, I’ve contributed to Prop 8 coverage, to Marcy, to Derrick Crowe, to FDL Action and to several progressives in office or running who have been discussed here at FDL in the last couple of months. I’m not complaining about what has happened in this contest because I’m a sore loser. The causes and candidates I support usually lose despite being right. But I’d rather give support to candidates who really need it.

Dennis in his safe district can send out emails telling people in his distict to come on over to a progressive blog to vote.

Can Massa in NY29? Can Hall in NY19?

How about Rob Miller in SC02? Can he risk sending out emails tying him to a progressive blog and expect to win in Nov?

Btw, Dennis also has the advantage of sending out emails to supporters across the country from his presidential run.

EVERYONE can’t do what Dennis did.

I realize that this approach is great for Firedoglake, but the results of contests set up like this one are sorely lacking.

Great! Please let us know what they have to say.

Grijalva has done a terrific job for progressives, and for the Progressive Caucus, this year. If I’d had four votes this round, he would have gotten one.

And what will it tell progressives if one who’s in a right-leaning district loses because he or she was progressive? We need to help progressives like Mass and Hall win! Big mistake to think that even our little bit of help can’t make a difference.

If I could have given Grijalva all three of my votes, I would have.

Dennis didn’t need this support. He needs more progressives in Congress. He needs us to give others this support.

Yeah Dennis never gets called a left wing whackadoo like those other guys might, especially for associating with the likes of us at FDL.

/s

riiiiiight, b/c there is an apt comparison…

“we” phhpt… don’t include me with you.

*smacks head in annoyance*

Token’s adorable.

E-mails out of district not allowed so will have to call.

According to the data supplied here about + or – R & D’s per district, Kucinich and Grijalva don’t need this because they’re in relatively safe districts. (Kucinich must want this bad for some reason.) Grayson needs it because the Republicans are coming after his swing district big-time. I voted for Grayson, Betsy Markey, and Gabrielle Giffords because they’re good Democrats in big, bad Republican nutcase districts.

Well, most likely it will tell progressives that the Obama administration has frittered away all the goodwill of the voting public with his faux progressivism and that most people want to throw the incumbents out.

I am beyond the “better than any opponent in the GOP” trope. Frank is godawful. We are in the worst economic crisis in the living memory of most Americans and Frank sold us out to the corporations, repeatedly.

safe?

if memory serves the dem estab ran someone against him in a primary in ’08… hardly seems safe to moi. both the GOP and the dem estab would love it if he just went away.

Finally an idea that makes sense. We need to help progressives to prove to them that we will back them up. This hang back and threaten them if they don’t do what we say is nothing more than babble when the corporate interests are waiting with their check books wide open.

We should be working harder than we did last year. Obviously, we didn’t do enough to get the congress we need, so we need to buckle down and hit it harder. Just pouting and bad mouthing our own leaders when they are unable to accomplish what we like is defeatist. Does anyone seriously believe we wouldn’t have health care, the kind we want, if the President had a solid 60 votes? Do you think he would have vetoed a bill that had single payer in it?

One election does not make a dynasty. We have to take our country back from the idiots, and it will take years of continual work.

If 1 million progressives donated $100 each to a clearing house and it was divided amongst 100 congressmen, that would be a million each. Something that would get their attention. 10 million at $10 each is the same result. There are that many of us, we just have to get organized better. Keep it up Jane.

You’ll do better finding his campaign office. This kind of fundraising campaign effort can’t really be organized out of his Capitol Hill congrssional office, but they might tell you over the phone how to reach his campaign headquarters.

No. I have no input into that decision, nor any special sources of information. Ignore anything I wrote that might have led you to that conclusion.

It also tells them they can’t rely on it, because a politician with a bigger list can game that contest to his advantage. Blue Dogs and DLCers can expect big campaign contributions from the corporations as long as they play ball. That’s what we’re competing against.

Ask for his ‘new media’ person.

good idea. thanks

Putting someone like Dennis in a House Leadership position is important Knox. Helping new Progressives is also important I think we are trying to do both. Grayson as Teddy points out however is new so how would you suggest we help newer and less famous Dems?

Per wiki, which has some detail about exactly the challenge you describe:

Kucinich won the primary, receiving 68,156 votes out of a total of 135,589 cast to beat Cimperman 52% to 33%.[85]

Kucinich defeated former State Representative Jim Trakas in the November 4, 2008 general election with 153,357 votes, 56.8% of those cast.

Anyone may characterize these numbers however they like, but ‘safe’ is not a word that springs to mind.

Yes, the Dem establishment in ’08 wanted Dennis off the presidential stage and ran a primary challenger. He won that primary, right? He’s in a safe district. He’s going to be in Congress come Feb 2011. He doesn’t need our help.

My argument on this thread has been simple:

Progressives have limited resources, and this contest has helped distribute those resources badly.

Can Dennis win this contest and show leadership by giving the money and other support to progressive candidates of his choosing?

You can

OMG, SAVE DENNIS.

Seriously?

Best of luck, and please document your success in a Seminal diary, so others can skip the potential dead-ends in making this work. We can all learn from one another as we figure out how to build a progressive majority.

Such a cute doggie, Suzanne! (nuzzles the cute doggie)

It would seem that some have forgotten that every name on that list was put there by somebody here. Jane didn’t make the list up. DeVeria didn’t make the list up. People who are registered at the Lake put those names on the list. The question was who would “you” like the Lake to support. I guess Jane and whoever else was working this could have ignored those most of us feel are not progressives, eg, Stupak, and left their names off the list. To their credit they didn’t. Personally, I’d rather Kucinich and Grayson hadn’t encouraged voting by their emails or blog posts. Without those “pushed” votes we would have had a better idea of the range of political thought by Firepups.

Nooooo! Seriously? How did I miss that?!?

I just don’t think you are being constructive. I get your argument, clearly you get mine. I’m trying to encourage the few remaining folks on this thread to make efforts on behalf of the candidates they support. What are your comments designed to do except cast aspersions on the entire enterprise?

So let me get this straight. This isn’t about supporting progressive candidates, but mobilizing support for Democratic candidates in general. Why? I could care less about 95% of House Democrats, 100% of Senate ones, and especially the one in the Oval Office. They have far more in common, as every issue in the last year has shown, with Republicans than with progressives. Why support people who don’t support us and our agenda?

Can Dennis win this contest and show leadership by giving the money and other support to progressive candidates of his choosing

Yes thats how politicians become Speaker of the House or get the other House leader jobs they contribute money to other Reps campaigns. Those with no interest in the job hire relatives for cushy campaign jobs with their excess campaign cash.
If we give to any Dem from a safe seat we are hoping ambition trumps greed we can’t force them to give the money to other Reps.

Dennis also gave a very good interview on Democracy Now where he talked about the illegality of Obama’s assasination program.

That got him a lot of support from this progressive site I am sure.

Now, my question is this; What the hell is Barney Frank’s name doing on this list?

fair enough

i have a different impression about his relative safety (when your own party doesn’t want you), but i understand what you’re saying.

I take it your not from Chicago vote early and often:)

What are your comments designed to do except cast aspersions on the entire enterprise?

That’s exactly my goal. The enterprise was designed poorly and should not be repeated.

If progressives are going to win in Congress, we have to be far smarter about how resources are allocated.

What I’m saying is meant to be entirely constructive.

But ‘pushed’ votes shows how it’s done. There’s nothing invalid about those votes, or voters. In fact, going-to-your-list is how to win.

Seeing the win-place-show finishers be colleagues who went to their lists won’t discourage the others — it will get them to put together their own lists! We’ll see real progressive action on the floor of the House — remember how Grayson made his name? ‘Don’t get sick, and if you do get sick, die quickly.’ That’s how Grayson built his national list.

Dennis built his national list on two issues, I imagine: single payer and impeachment of Bush/Cheney. I want to see more ‘critters take on real progressive issues like those, build their lists, and use them to raise money. And win Round Two!

Disparaging the winners for winning fair and square seems, well, not quite fair, especially when they have set the example for the others next time.

And there’s still time to contact your favorite’s campaign office and get the ‘new media’ person to make an appeal to their list!

I hate to say it, but Grayson fits that description. He talks some good smack, but doesn’t have the progressive credentials to back it up. Still, he got my vote, right or wrong.

I got the early part right, anyway…

Repeating: the nominees were put on the list by their own constituents. They are being voted on by the entire community. Congresspersons’ campaigns are going to their email lists for support on this contest.

No one has made any judgment about who belongs on this list (except I presume they must be Democrats).

Then design something better for the less famous Reps. Right now this contest does quite well in giving us a vote for our choice for House Speaker.

I’m sure there will be another vote.:)

here’s the thing about this “poorly designed enterprise”… it is helping introduce a lot of people to lesser known progressives that they might not have been familiar with before this contest got underway. which has value.

i am not a regular here, i come from another blogland, but i heard about this contest and decided to check it out. now that i am here, reading thru the posts, i will make it a point to donate/support the other progressives singled out (esp the lesser known progs) that i wasn’t familiar with previously–whether or not they ‘win’

Welcome, and thank you! Pull up a chair, it’s quite a lot of fun around here.

Token is the cutest pup, nine-pound category. Really a sweetie in person too, I miss him since he moved to Oregon!

:)

thanks!

me likey FDL

So Kucinich and Grayson using their lists to get people to come here, register and vote in this poll shows who the Lake supports? All of a sudden a few thousand Firepups woke up yesterday and decided to vote for Dennis or Grayson? Sorry, that doesn’t validate shit for me.

Grayson is great but Dennis has been in the trenches a lot longer. He has consistently voted progressive; whereas Grayson chooses. Grayson voted in favor of Israel’s attack on the Gaza Strip. He later condemned the Goldstone Report.

Teddy beat me to the “welcome” comment! Please don’t take my comments on this thread as anything but my effort to participate constructively at a great blog. Firedoglake rocks. Jane is great and because she is I know I can disagree with her from time to time – publicly and strongly. I know she appreciates it when it’s meant to be constructive.

And you’re definitely right about giving us all an opportunity to learn about lesser-known candidates. In that respect, this has been a great experience.

I voted on day 1, and I voted for Kucinich, Massa and Weiner.

That being said, I don’t think it’s cool that Kucinich sent out a request to his E-mail list to vote here, not at all.

This was supposed to be for the FDL community, not for Kucinich’s mailing list to vote on. This SEVERELY tampers with the vote. if it were my call I would invalidate this day of voting.

How are we supposed to get an accurate measure of the community when we have people getting others from outside FDL to come and vote. It’s liek when someone puts a thing on Reddit saying “vote no because this guy’s a tool” and then all of a sudden a million no votes show up.

Dirty play Kucinich, dirty play indeed.

“Can Dennis win this contest and show leadership by giving the money and other support to progressive candidates of his choosing?”

That is a great idea.

Although I am still confused by this decision
Jane Hamsher “We had announced that we would close the voting at midnight tonight, but we’re going to keep it open until tomorrow morning and close it at 10am ET ”

Some of us were up late last night going onto blogs and Dem sites last night pushing for Dennis. I have played sports all my life and been involved with Dem campaigns since I was 16. I have never seen rules changed when a game, election, contest is taking place unless the numbers are really close. This is not the case in this contest.

So while I deeply admire Jane and the FDL team and am so appreciative for what thedy do. I am really wondering and concerned about how this decision to extend this contest was decided. By whom and what the reasons were?

We will continue to push hard for Dennis at other places in the blog world tonight. But I am trying to explain why this contest was extended to others that were pushing hard last evening for Dennis. The contest is not even close and we are just hours away from when the contest was originally announced it would be closed.

I think this decision deserves an explanation.

Many of the concerns Knoxville is bringing up are the reasons I don’t contribute to funds like this anymore. With individual candidates, I have a chance of knowing what I’m giving my money to. With these, I don’t. Sorry you don’t think that’s constructive. Would silence be better?

Now, my question is this; What the hell is Barney Frank’s name doing on this list?

Exactly! My sentiments also.

good points

With Kucinich, Grayson and, by your own admission, apparently some commenters here encouraging people outside of the Lake community to come here and vote how are the results representative of the Lake community? I may be wrong but my impression of the purpose of the poll was to get a feel from Firepups for who the Lake should support. What would we be saying if Stupak or Frank had used their lists to get people to come here and vote for them?

One explanation is that thousands of supporters of whichever members are being driven to FDL (or could be) and thats good for FDL and good for the contest in terms of fundraising. I feel your pain but it seems good to me to extend.

Point #1 — the list has remained pretty static since before anybody pushed anything to anyone, so it still very much reflects who the community supports.

Point #2 — There is value in having as many people participate as possible so that they can help GOTV efforts in these districts. Bart Stupak ain’t gonna win, nor will he inspire anyone to donate to him or phone bank for him on a progressive blog, so the ability of somone to “game” the system is inherently limited by the process.

We very much tried to think this through before we started the contest.

I thought the contest was about how the Progressive community feels. As far as I know it was not stated that we should not encourage others to come here and vote. So I went forth and spread the word far and wide. Still doing it

Besides the lake community has a great deal of Pep’s (progressive except for Palestine) I want to see someone like DK or Grijalva win. They both stand for progressive values across the issues

We did a huge push last night. I just have never participated in a campaign,contest or any sports where the game,campaign or contest was extended when the numbers were so far apart. Changing the rules mid game is something I am not used to.

Would still like to know how and who made this decision. If the numbers were close would understand.
Feel like we were handed a kind of Supreme court decision. Instead of stop the count. They said we are going to add time to the voting but the numbers are not close

No, it is NOT a dirty play. In fact, it’s an example of what every one of them can, and should do — go to their lists to win. That is exactly the point. Building national lists, outside of their districts, is how progressives can free themselves from the predatory DCCC big-donor call-lists, all of which come with strings attached.

Grayson, and now Kucinich, have set an EXAMPLE. Others should follow their EXAMPLE.

Today I saw Rep.Grayson on the Dylan Ratigan Show, along with a Republican Representative and both got ambushed by Ratigan for playing politics and not working on real health care reform, such as a Public Option or Single Payer…

Many people in Congress are just finding out about the contest so we decided to extend it. That is due to our staff limitations, and the snow. We lost a day of outreach because of it.

It’s important that members of Congress know the contest is happening because it has allowed us to make our case that we can support them if they support us. I’ve already had several offices asking me how their Reps can come on and talk about the issues they are advancing so that the community can be knowledgeable about what they’re doing.

Jim Himes calls his buddies at Goldman Sachs before he takes his votes. We want progressive Reps to think about the FDL community as their financial constituencies, the people they can rely on for support and thus the people whose opinions they should care about. So making them aware of what we do and giving them a chance to participate actively in the process are important part of the plan.

I wouldn’t worry about Dennis. You did a great job supporting him, thank you very much. Nobody is going to do anything after midnight tonight that can make up 11,000 votes. Trust me on that. People just do not open their email between midnight and 10am in that volume.

Oh, please. Comparing a ten hour extension on an online contest with 65,000 votes to Bush v Gore really, really damages your credibility. No one will die based on this decision, no WMDs will be lied about, no mushroom cloud will be predicted, no PDBs overlooked.

Try to keep some perspective please.

Force majeure. It’s a common contract clause.

Went back and looked through the announcement and rules. Did not see anything about not alerting people far and wide. Will continue to do so even though the time the contest was announced it would end has been changed.

Still wondering why. The numbers were not close

Thanks for the explanation. Understand wanting to make it clear to Reps we are a force to be reckoned with.

Jane “and the snow. We lost a day of outreach because of it.” Although not sure how the snow effects the on line process.

Jane is it in anyway against the rules to go out and spread this contest far and wide? Because as I said that is what I have been doing. Is this against the rules?

Will continue to spread the word..if this is not against some rules I have not read.

Jane thanks for what you folks are doing

Consistent progressive values across the board that is what I want as a voter

It snowed, okay? We’re all in DC. It isn’t easy. We’re doing our best.

Just not used to rules changing mid game when numbers are not close. Will drop it

is what I am doing against the rules? If it is not I am going to keep spreading far and wide

Agree.

I can’t disagree with any of your rationale, agree as a matter of fact. When the poll was first posted I didn’t see it with that perspective, hence my comments about externals.

i want kucinich and grijalva to win because they did not vote todefund ACORN, and did not vote to condemn the Goldstone report. the others voted yes on both

good point.

And it was a bit of an extreme comparison. Again just not used to stated rules in games, campaigns, contests changing when numbers are even close. I also had a solid point. I have quite a few groups that include thousands of people that we contacted yesterday that asked me why the stated rules changed

But am accepting the decision and Jane’s explanation. What choice do I have.

one more time (asked three times above) Are we breaking any of the stated rules in the contest by spreading far and wide as Southern Dragon has suggessted?

” SouthernDragon February 9th, 2010 at 2:01 pm
111
In response to Leen @ 107 (show text)

With Kucinich, Grayson and, by your own admission, apparently some commenters here encouraging people outside of the Lake community to come here and vote how are the results representative of the Lake community? I may be wrong but my impression of the purpose of the poll was to get a feel from Firepups for who the Lake should support. What would we be saying if Stupak or Frank had used their lists to get people to come here and vote for them?

Why would Kucinich need any help? Is this a poll for helping those who are helping us in Congress who will need us this fall? If thats the case Kucinich, Weiner, and the rest in the top 20 on the list have or will have money and a safe district. Put our support and cash in districts where it is needed to hold the House. Dennis has a great progressive record although he could never win elected national office but support, money for his Ohio district, whatever for? He and a lot of those on the list need to be honored for there service but most if not all are in districts that are in need of our help. Grayson may be the exception in Orlando. Democrats have to decide what is important to them congratulating the long serving progressives or supporting new ones in Congress who have real fights and supporting challengers to Blue Dogs in primaries.

How the hell did Barney Frank get in the top five in the first place?
Talk about a career politician! He’s been there long enough. Time to say goodbye to another banker boy. The guy is so loaded down with Wall St money, not to mention he’s always full of bogus excuses for why he can’t do the right thing. The perfect example of an establishment Dem who deserves the boot.

And Weiner, sheesh! Yadd, yadda, yadda, gotta have the public option.
Oh, well, it’s a good bill anyway. Another failure who just strings people along by standing on the soapbox, then stabs you in the back.
No principles, just bullshit.

I don’t get it. If these people are acceptable to Progressives, it’s no wonder Congress treats us like shit. They know they don’t have to do a damn thing we want and we’ll still support them. No worries, no repercussions. Pathetic.

OH, I just read some of the post …its a beauty contest and popularity contest. Sorry, I thought it was relative to support in the fall of this year to hold the House and elect new progressives, support progressives in difficult districts, support those progressives in Blue Dog district primaries…sorry my bad, this is a who can send out list to get the top spot thing. I had no idea it was not a serious exercise.

Just got my letter from Grayson, that make both of them! Oh well Too Late I had already voted!!

Hey Suz That is a great mug shot of Token!!! Tucker says Woof woof woof

token says woof (which is either thank you for selecting him or give me another puperoni)

Judging from Jane’s responses I’d have to say you can continue to do what you’ve been doing.

I’m going with the latter.

Will be curious to see if FDL starts getting some hits from Colorado and the Green Fest crowd. Just put out the word about the contest in both of those places. Again hoping this is not against any rules. Did not get an answer to the question that I have asked several times.

I imagine that if Jane disapproved of what you’re doing she’d have said so by now.

I couldn’t agree more with your post.

Pelosi is doing ok. That’s patently impossible in the Lake community, isn’t it? Weiner has people, he can’t be doing this good without go-vote troops. Republicans are a fully co-compatable and integrated bunch, there really are no unconnected gaps among their “various” organs. Their troops are always at the ready to slam a fist down on the scales with swamping waves of killer votes. They don’t hide it. They snigger and brag.

Right before polls close, Max Baucus is going to appear in the #1 position, courtesy of those guys. BOOGA BOOGA. It could happen.

If you notice, the poll is strictly for Representatives, not Senators

Oh, oops.

Who’s a Baucus-like congerman?

I think that’s great. I urge everyone to get involved. Building an online fundraising base for incumbents is extremely important. Lobby, email, get the word out however you want. It’s all good.

Thanks. That is what I have been doing all week. Hoping I was not breaking some rule I had not read

The story Grayson does not want told
http://mondoweiss.net/2009/12/gutsy-progressive-congressman-alan-grayson-leads-a-double-life.html

“Grayson’s January 8th statement explaining his vote in favor of Israel’s assault on the Gaza Strip read like a mimeograph of those released by other AIPAC-friendly members of Congress. However, its introductory line stood out: “Congressman Alan Grayson, one of three incoming Jewish members of Congress, issued the following statement on the situation in Gaza.”

Grayson’s voting record
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billsearch.xpd?sponsor=412276

Go check out the five (or the one you are thinking about voting for) top candidates voting records for this contest here

http://www.votesmart.org/voting_category.php?can_id=318

Here
http://www.govtrack.us/

his first chioce for vice president–RON PAUL

ha ha Suz… one puperoni come Tokens way..

Leen,

Here’s the deal. Please feel free to affirmatively support any candidate in the contest who you think is deserving of our support.

But…you get two comments per thread about whether you agree with the candidate’s position on the I/P issue.

After that, the mods will remove comments from the threads.

Capiche?

One way to help progressives is by exposing Non-progressives. We need to make sure every voter in the districs where non-progressives reside know how much bribe money they accepted from corporations. My senator is not up this go-round (Binghamin) but I intent to raise hell when he is and I don’t care if that helps the Republican oposing him. Its a matter of principle.

Got one from my own state. Mike Ross. Except he’s improved a tad, is no longer 100% Baucus-like.

Come on, suggestions. I could have used the edit button. The “if you’ll notice” pointer came that fast, micro-seconds, and is one of the few “replies” I’ve ever had in the Lake community. The other one I had began with “Oh please,” which translates as “Ignore this, I’m an ass you should have ignored to begin with.” It was about the Fort Hood shooting (can’t say murder) victims being little Eichmans.

Goodnight, darlings.

What the hell are Barney Frank and Barbara Lee doing on this list when Grijalva, Massa and DeFazio belong there at the top? Barney and Babara have flashes of progressive liberalism, but have compromised themselves in many other ways…

THEY DO NOT BELONG ON THIS LIST DAMMIT!

Have you written a Seminal diary supporting your candidates? Have you written a diary criticizing those you think don’t belong near the top? Have you contacted the campaigns of those you’d like to see win, and asked them to make an effort with their email lists? Have you contacted your own networks on behalf of the candidates you favor?

Or are you simply having fun with the BOLD buttons and your CAPS LOCK key?

This site is about constructive engagement and citizen action. Got any?

One of the things I was struck by during the health care battle was how badly we suffered because progressive infrastructure has not developed any reliable way for incumbent members of Congress to finance their races that doesn’t involve crawling to corporate lobbying interests.

The above statement by Jane is reason alone why this is a great contest. However, I think it can be run again at a later time and improved by having a page for each candidate in which someone makes the case for progressive support (with some opportunity for debate). Then, all those voting have the opportunity to make a more informed decision. For example, I find it persuasive that while Kucinich and Grijalva both have excellent progressive voting records, Grijalva seems to have been more effective in influencing legislation, but I would like to see that confirmed or debated. I also find it more impressive when someone from an R-leaning district takses a strong progressive stance than when the same stance is taken by someone from a safer district, but I do not always know when this is the case.
I also do not think it matters that the deadline for voting in this contest has been extended, as it gives more people a chance to vote and may prevent gaming the system.

I feel relieved now…I like Grayson and understand he’s in an R district, but Dennis is a FAR more progressive and influential Rep who represents the best views of FDL and all progressives. He also votes consistently to end the wars and against that silly Gladstone Report affair in congress. So tell me why do we think we should support others ahead of him who vote like their Republican districts on issues that concern us? Progressives except on Wars? Perhaps we should concentrate as well on putting progressives in Democratic districts who will vote our conscience. Thanks for the contest…I now feel better about my donation going to DK. Cheers.

Woolsey, Lee, Waters.

Being right matters.

Word out to Code Pink, Progressive Dems of America, Green Fest and Green America, several other progressive groups.

Hope to heaven DK stays in the lead. Sure wish Grijalva would make it back on the top five list. He deserves it. Like someone’s idea above if Dennis wins maybe he will give it to another truly progressive Dem who needs the help more than he does

I love Dennis I am a 60 year old rn in california. I always thought all you old guys in the midwest would stand up for something? Now all of us out here have Viarogosa standing up for us. My friends I think we are going down. At this point I have no idea how to change it. If you want to reply my name is Maggie I really want to chamge it.

Just got a message back from Medea over at Code Pink. think they are going to put something out for DK. Notice Debbie Wasserman Schultz is inching up. Really like her stance on so many issues, but she also voted to block the G report and voted for the Iran Sanctions Act

You Americans never stop taking my breath away because youre stupidity is stunning. The whole world laughs at you you so stupid. Dennis Kusinich was one of the best politicians you should have had. Now let you get Palin as youre president. She will give you everything you so deserve.
You are idiots the whole world laughs at you. You have seen these republicans destroy youre manufacturing base and yet you still stand by them. Well way to go America I hope you get everything you deserve. Go to youre churches and prey for something you had better prey for food because you had better realise soon you will need to find it in dumpsters. Me a socialist think Dennis Kussinich might be youre one last hope.

When I was small my dad owned a tap and die factory in England. We never made much money.

My dad taught me if it were not for the people who work at our factory we would not live in this house. In fact we would not survive

At 5 years old I learnt the first lesson of cooperation.

At this point I learnt we are all dependant on one another.

Fast forward to now. All of the jobs in America have been shipped out to countries where corporate demons put workers in sweat shops working 18 hours a day so that the Americans can buy stuff that should cost twice as much to greedy consumers.

After England colonized most of the third world we reveled in an abundance of stuff.

We sucked the mineral wealth out of these countries. Left them surrounded by poverty.

We never learnt the first lesson of survival…..

We used the poor Chinese for stuff and we use the pinoy to take care of our old.

When we used organized religion to tell us how to vote somehow we lost our soul.

Now the honeybees are gone and the people of this country realize our almond crop is entirely dependant on them.

We never learnt the first lesson of survival…

Animal species in our oceans are dying fast. Loggerhead turtles are so infected with a virus that causes cauliflower growths on their eyes. Without the ability to see then they die. No way to catch food.

Now the black billed pelicans are found dying, starving along the California coastline.

Pollution maybe but animal species are dying in droves across this planet.

Whales are found beached and dying on the pacific coast. A group of scientist found all those beached whales had nitrogen bubbles in their blubber with eardrums burst. It coincided with American submarines using hi tech sonar across the path 12 hours before these whales were found.

And as for the amphidians they are gone. Pollution from farm waste, insecticides, toxic substances in our groundwater?

Now today I read about the astronomical rise in Autism? Something sure is going wrong out here.

We had better learn the first lesson of survival………

Climate change? I see it. I see it on Google earth the ice caps disappearing. They say global warming does not exist. Who do I believe them or my own lying eyes?

We need to learn the first lesson of survival and that is we are all interconnected. Take any one of those puzzle pieces away from this mix then this house of cards might just collapse.

Wikipedia it it’s called the daisy wheel theory look it up.

Oh golly, you mean I could vote for Anna Eshoo? Let me think…maybe after health care passes…maybe not.

Can you please go hassle some conservatives? Hope to see you at the drudge report and politico. thanks for helping out america.

Grayson increased his votes by 11,ooo

“I wouldn’t worry about Dennis. You did a great job supporting him, thank you very much. Nobody is going to do anything after midnight tonight that can make up 11,000 votes. Trust me on that. People just do not open their email between midnight and 10am in that volume.”