The more I look at the merged Senate bill, the more I’m afraid that Harry Reid might have been laying the ground work to betray progressives on the issue of the public option, and gain the support of Olympia Snowe. Many of Snowe’s top demands managed to make their way into the bill.
Harry Reid decided to take the terrible “free rider” provision championed by Snowe from the Senate Finance committee bill instead of the employer mandate from the HELP bill. Reid went with a very much weaker individual mandate more in keeping with the wishes of Snowe. He also kept the terrible “nationwide plans” from the SFC bill. Snowe strongly backs the nationwide plans and claimed it was one of the reason she voted for the bill in committee.
Reid did not just go with the provisions from the SFC bill strongly favored by Snowe. He took the unusual step of even further watering down provisions that Snowe wanted changed. He dramatically reduced the minimum requirement for what qualifies as insurance. He reduced the actuarial value of bronze level plans to 60%. That is even lower than it was in either of the committee bills. The merged bill would also allow people up to the age of 29 to buy extremely low value catastrophic plans. The SFC bill would only let people 25 and younger buy these low value plans. Both changes were championed by Snowe.
The other issue of concern is the design of the public option’s opt-out provision. It does not seem well thought out. There is no restriction on when states can start opting out. At the very least there should have been a clause, so that people currently on the public option would get to remain on it, at minimum, until the next open enrollment period if their state opts out. Reid may not have put a lot of work into designing the opt out provision because he did not plan for it to remain.
Tom Carper has recently been working with Snowe to bring back a new, re-designed trigger. Reid is aware of these efforts. Even if Reid has not directly endorsed Carper’s plan, he doesn’t seem to be trying to put a stop to it either. Just today, Reid took the very strange step of taking reconciliation off the table.
It is possible I’m just being paranoid and reading too much into these changes. They may have nothing to do with Snowe. It could also be that Reid has made these changes in the hope of convincing her to at least not filibuster a bill with a public option. He might think that by giving her 90% of what she wants, she will be willing to accept the opt-out public option.
Either way, this is something I plan to keep a very close eye on. If progressives find out that Reid’s support of the public option was purely for show, while at the same time he secretly worked with Snowe to kill it with a trigger, that would not go over well with the base. Reid does have the power to get a public option passed, there is no good excuse for failure.




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Something to keep an eye on. Thanks for the heads-up!
at the moment i could give a shit about the po — about which robert reich says:
as it is, how many people will this po affect?
one of the things i care far more about is from your previous diary: At The Request of AHIP, Senate Bill Guts State Health Insurance Regulations
and how many people will this affect? this is a very very big deal and must be stopped.
Meanwhile, Harry Reid is saying don’t worry about Liarman who continues to rachet up his right wing threats every day.
Thank you, Citizens of CT.
What are you talking about? Reid is taking care of his base and his base is securely behind him 100%
You’re just jealous that you can’t be in Reid’s base because you don’t happen to be a corporation!
I am going to believe this because that free rider provision has been criticized by every health care wonk in creation and Reid is smart enough to know it.
can’t wait to see the final version of this watered down champagne.
If I may channel Gomer Pyle for a moment – “Surprise, surprise!”
Got a letter back from Cornyn (Asshole-Texas) re: my letter to him re: healthcare reform.
And I quote:
“Moreover, I oppose the creation of a Washington-run ‘public’ health insurance plan, which I believe is unequivocally a gateway to a single-payer system. I believe that a Washington-run, public plan “option” will devastate private insurance markets by acting as a competitor, regulator, and funder. Independent estimates have found that such a plan could result in 118 million Americans losing their current health benefits, and 130 million Americans left to rely on a government-run health care plan.”
Of course he doesn’t give a cite for those “independent estimates.” Wonder why? I’m also about to write him back wondering how “gubmint-run” wars are supposed to make us safer, since he has a problem with anything “gubmint-run”. Hey, doesn’t he work for some kind of “gubmint run” something or other?
Shocking! I could have sworn many on the left were hailing Reid as a hero just a couple of weeks ago?
There will be a health care bill that passes but one won’t- in all honesty- be able to call it a reform bill.
Further evidence that Obama is greasing his own skids to be a discredited one-term President. (See skyrocketing unemployment numbers for more evidence).
Thank you to all of the dems in the senate
How would states opt out the Governor says so the state legislature takes a vote, a popular vote what?
Since when did Harry Reid need an excuse for failure? Some just do it naturally.
This sausage-making is awfully painful, especially when we are the ingredients. I’m feeling physically ill from just reading this, and I can’t afford to be sick…kind of ironic.
No your not paranoid if their really are people out to get you. Taking Reconciliation off the table is not a tell its a neon sign saying Harry is messing with us.
And why did Harry Reid throw the possibility of reconcilliation under the bus.
Does that mean you aren’t cynical if everything really does suck?
Owe you a beverage
Reid is acting like a little time and maybe some flowers after we get a chance to cool off will fix things in time for his reelection. Right now I don’t think that even the most pro Dem unity person at the Lake would pee on him if he were on fire.
Also thanks to computer book marks we can remember quite quickly everything we have said about Harry when he runs for reelection.
I’m guessing Harry and his aides don’t use their computers much.
But why not strip the states of all capability to oversee the health vulture industry.
More and more, I’m convinced all the insurance company whining about reform is just theater. Sort of, “whatever you do, don’t throw us in that briar patch.”
Got an email this morning, my local library manager is leaving for a new job. She has been here six months and really fixed up the library, bringing it from the 1960s to the present in very short order. She is leaving because health insurance rates for the library district are going up 30 precent and she has to pay for her husband’s medical insurance. Money was already tight and this would be a significant net loss in income.
Someone else was mentioned her health insurance costs (she is self-insured) will go up 17 percent. My husband’s business won’t have employees next year, but we would have had no choice but to drop health insurance, because of the rate increase.
I’ve emailed my two senators Murray and Cantwell and my no-chance-in-hell will she vote for health insurance reform rep McMorris-Rodgers about this.
This is so frustrating.
Sure everything sucks but we are not cynical we are trying to make it better the day we stop trying we are cynical that day we become the Media!
However complaining about all the amounts of work we have to do…in my family thats normal.
Abe Lincoln said “My Father taught me how to work he never taught me to like it.”
Grape Soda:)
AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
Citizen Jon Walker and the Firepup Freedom Fighters:
I think you may be doin’ a little “Chicken Little” here Brother Jon. The way this old leftie sees it, the “progressives” can block any amendment to what hits the floor since it will require 60 votes to get attached (of course the same is true for “progressive” amendments) and unless the “progressives” have already caved in in caucus, what we see today will be what goes to conference. The only way this bill gets wrecked is if the progressives hold up and Joe Likuderman joins the other fascists and kills the bill and One Hung Harry Reid refuses to take it to reconcilliation. And Reid will allow it to die only if he has been given instructions from the White House.
If this bill fails it will be entirely on the White House…ObamaRahma can only hold his cards for so long. This bill and whatever happens to it now belongs to the President and I don’t think he’s stupid but he might be another Clinton and think he can triangulate with fascists…in which case he IS stupid.
KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE AMMUNITION, THE STRUGGLE GOES ON AND ON AND…
Only have the fermented kind.
Dry red wine?
I suppose the weak mandate is the blessing in all this? Ever since the majority of the public was (with Pelosi) excluded from the public option, the choice has been between various versions of “less bad.”
Cabernet
No, of course you aren’t cynical if you think everything sucks. But you have to look at how the problems have been compounded over the years, with the growth of capital, the financial sector, the military-industrial complex. History shows how the present is made possible.
NorskeFlamethrower:
Why shouldn’t Obama triangulate with “fascists” (who, btw, would have created a lot stiffer mandate if they really were fascists)? There’s no need to triangulate with progressives: progressives think of this as baby steps toward health care reform.
This bill represents Harry Reids Insurance Industry Revenue Enhancement Act
Congress GOP and Us have been pushing to get Geithner and Summers fired they were picks to appease the Moderates not us the GOP I’m sure wanted ” Laffer Curve” Laffer as Treasury Secretary.
I’m thinking triangulation itself is in danger.
The Public Option is more Popular than Harry or any Blue Dog. I think times are changing ideas matter more than personalty or party label.
In other words its our time.
Not sure what that means exactly I know its wine but heck I’ll try it.
Oh, plenty of progressive people are hopping mad at what is going down — it’s just that so very few of them are 1) in Congress and 2) willing to do something about it.
Citizen cassiodorus:
The only thing history shows us is what isn’t possible anymore…or another way of sayin’ that is that history shows us how we fucked up yesterday. At some point it is a complete waste of time and energy to “look at how the problems have been compounded over the years”, becasue at some point we hafta take what truth we have learned from the past and change the present.
Because if Obama does kill this his poll numbers will drop.
Harry Reid is probably doing this more for Mary Landrieu, Ben Nelson, Evan Bayh, Joe Lieberman, Blanche Lincoln, and above all others Barack Obama. This was and is so predictable.
What is so frustrating to me is not that Reid is doing this. Like I said it was completely foreseeable. My question is why are progressives continuing to waste their time fighting for a joke public option (that still may not even survive)? Why are buying into the responsibility and blame for this disaster rather than opposing it and exposing it for what it is: a betrayal and a sellout? This idea that Obama, Rahm, Baucus, Pelosi, House Democrats, House progressives, all have sold out on healthcare and yet some progressives are saying we should still support the process is incomprehensible to me. We have been sold out, yes, even betrayed, but what does this say about us, that this has happened not just once but multiple times on the same bill, yet like some punch drunk sailor we come back for more?
This healthcare bill/sellout to drug and insurance companies is a monstrosity. Before we lose all our credibility, we really need to just say no to it once and for all.
Hold out your glass it’s enroute.
I heard Landrieu was getting a dedicated $100,000,000 off the top for La.
Can that be true?
Harry wants to run again. Harry also has a son who wants to run for office. Harry despite being Senate Leader is the third most likely Senate seat to switch parties the other two seats are open seats no incumbent running according to the Fivethirtyeight polling blog.
Since healthcare has been the only issue in the news for months at least since August we can assume that Harry’s waffling on Healthcare is killing his poll numbers.
Harry kills this bill his and his son’s career as elected officials are over.
I strenuously disagree. History shows us what is, as well as what isn’t, possible, and how to, as well as how not to, do it.
If you look at progressive ideology through the years you can see that the progressives who back these bills under conditions of the most rabid conformism are following a pattern.
The CBO scoring of the Senate’s Health Care Bill comes in at $849 Billion over a 10 yr. period that reduces the deficit by over $130 Billion and is paid for.In honor of Veteran’s Day. According to a study released by the Harvard Medical School, 2,266 veterans under the age of 65 died last year as a result of not having health insurance. Researchers emphasize that “that figure is more than 14 times the number of deaths (155) suffered by U.S. troops in Afghanistan in 2008, and more than twice as many as have died (911 as of Oct. 31) since the war began in 2001.”It’s time for American Women to Stand-up/Speak-up for your full medical rights. Stop the rabid right-wing from restricting American womens medical choices. Call Congress and demand the “stupak-pitts amendment” be stripped from Health Care Reform. Also, demand that liebermann be stripped of his chairmanship of HSC and kicked out of the Caucus.Criminally corrupt politicians are the reason the U.S. is ranked near the bottom of every catagory when ranked next to other modern, industrialized nations. Time for publically funded elections. lieberman $12.6M, mcconnell $7.8M, baucus $7.7M, cornyn $6.7M, kyl $5.6M, grassley $5.4M, ensign $5.2M, conrad $5.1M, cantor $4.9M, nelson $4.9M, burr $4.8M, boehner $4.4M, hatch $4.4M, lincoln $4.1M, vitter $3.9M, carper $3.6M were paid by the Medical Industrial Complex to kill Health Care Reform. (Source: OpenSecrets.org, Aug. 09)Follow the Money: LinkCall Congress and demand, Single-Payer Health Care for All!(Toll Free # House and Senate)1-866-338-1015 _____ 1-866-220-0044 1-866-311-3405Sign Single-Payer, Public Option and Health Care as a Civil Rights Petitions: Link Link Link kucinichpetition Don’t let the Medical Industrial Complex steal your Health Care from you and your family by donating huge sums of money to Crooked Politicians in order to maintain the Status Quo. Keep up the good fight.SEMPER FI!
Reid has received $1,451,521 in PAC money this election cycle, the highest of any senator.
Who’s he working for?
I am not at all opposed to reducing the deficit but lets recognize what it means when Reid says we are going to be reducing the deficit by $100+ billion. A new revenue stream is being added in the name of healthcare and $100+ billion will be directed to the deficit. If in two years something additional needs to be added additional revenues will have to be found to make it deficit neutral.
I am open to that idea. We can pass a real bill with reconciliation. And if Harry and Obama kill the bill we will pass a better one next time. Only Harry will not be Senate leader remember no money for healthcare no money for war!
We voted for the carrot, now we’ll get the stick.
Citizen ThingsComeUndone:
I have warned about the great coalition with Ron Paul and the fascists against the banksters…I am happy that the GOPers can be used to advance transparency at the Federal Reserve and give Congress more oversight. But politically this is very dangerous and at some point all the banksters hafta do is pay off the fascists in the coalition and you will see ‘em crackin’ “progressive” heads in the street. Take a quick look at the last few years of the Weimar Republic…there’s also the fable of the scorpion and the turtle (or whatever critter can swim). The point is that any coalition with the fascists gives them legitimacy and their motive is power not justice. Remeber these folks do NOT believe in democracy and could give a shit less about bankin’ regulation and economic recovery.
This is a period of change what once was true is now hazy many things are possible.
Codependency. Last night the Dems in Washington hurt us badly but this morning they were SO sorry and promised never to do it again. I think they really mean it this time…
Why is this any surprise? Multiple senators have already forcefully implied that they will not vote against cloture if the bill has a public option, and one, Lieberman, has promised he will filibuster. Why are you people continuing to act shocked when it becomes more and more obvious the public option is not going to survive?
I really do sound like a broken record, but AFL-CIO has given a definitive big fat No to triggers – so what in the hell is he thinking ?!?! surely not a horse trade of triggers for EFCA – that ain’t happenin’. and it’s not like Reid has any excuse to think Labor will go along as it often has in the past (ok, maybe Stern and Hoffa, but definitely not Trumka, et al)
loves me some ratty
Ratty is definetly Da Dude!
Agreed! Ron wants to ride popular anger at banks at immigrants whoever to power. He wants to replace the corrupt system with himself.
I have no problem going after banks its his problem with immigrants I worry about.
Give me a fucking break. Labor unions represent a miniscule amount of workers in this country, so the notion that he should yell “how high” whenever the uber-corrupt AFL-CIO yells “jump” is fucking laughable. Who gives a damn what the AFL-CIO says?
reid’s bill deep-sixes the extension of COBRA in the House bill.
The HOUSE bill permits anyone on COBRA or state-extension of COBRA to continue on their group-rate insurance plan (of course the individual has to pay the premium) until the exchanges start.
That is a huge benefit that is COST FREE for the government because it allows the unemployed, who include many over 50 who CANNOT get insurance in the marketplace because of pre-existing conditions, to continue coverage.
This is a very important issue. See section 113 of the HOUSE bill.
Okay. Here’s a fucking break. But, I’m not going to suggest where you put it.
:-)
Citizen cassiodorus:
“History shows us what is, as well as what isn’t possible…”
Bless your heart Citizen cassiodorus but that is nonsense. History gives us a glimpse of what happened, a fossilized piece of the experience of folks’ lives in the past but it does not TEACH anything particularly about what is or is not possible at this moment. The best we can do is study history to create or find principles of thought to guide action…and that is it. At some point we take what we are capable of takin from the past and act in the moment to change the present. The answers to your choices today do NOT reside in the past, Citizen.
Hi demi. Just passing through. See ya later.
That’s what scares me. Sure that means it probably won’t get any worse, but it also means this turkey ain’t getting any better.
Scarecrow is hosting the Book Salon that is starting: “FDL Book Salon Welcomes Maggie Mahar, Money-Driven Medicine: The Real Reason Health Care Costs So Much”
What does that do for all of those who already on COBRA let alone uninsured.
As a life long dem I am not ever voting again for any pol who voted for the Stupak admendment and that includes you – life long Rep.- Mr. Kildee.
I will not ever vote for any one who votes or signes a bill (BO included) to force Americans to purchase health care from these criminals.
And I will not ever vote for any one who signs this 2,000 page give away to the health care criminals. Or any 2,000 page bill for that matter. If the bill is too long for me, my Rep or the President to read in a couple hours, then it’s to long. I’m with those who say we only need a 3 page bill including opening up Medicare for all who “CHOOSE” to buy in and making biz like Walmart provide Health care to employees.
I realize shrub and shooter (with Dem help) took 8 yrs to get US in this bad shape but we are still spending money we don’t have on wars we can’t afford. We continue to have high unemployment. Interest rates and fees on Credit cards have sky rocketed. They talk about teachers being paid by performance when we should be talking about making laws to prosecute and imprison those politicians that spent/spend money the USA doesn’t have.
There is road construction near me with Mexican’s who can barely speak English doing the work. WHY? Probably the same ones that were here a couple yrs ago cleaning up after a tornado.
We should be talking abt dismanteling and breaking up the numerous monopolies and international corps. Why isn’t any one?
Geithner should have been fired when he was working for the NY Feds and all this crazy derivitives/ financial melt down / fraud crap came to light last fall, yet there he sits. WHY?
I will never cross over to the repub pukes, I’ll find a 3rd party to vote for. And if they don’t hold my interest I’ll sit it out. I’ve found that those who said there all from the same cloth, servants to the corps and rich, are right, IMO.
I don’t come around much any more. Not since I realized the repubs was still running the show. I really thought I’d be happy after getting a Dem in but…
Thanks for having a place I can come and say what I feel.
Hugs. Gotta work later. Maybe tomorrow?
Well, I’ve never been able to afford Cobra, but I understand for some people with pre-existing conditions, it’s essential.
Small minded men and women of no vision. I had the audacity to hope.
It’s incredibly frustrating. I know. Good to see you here.
I agree, Norske. The times we are living right now are so radically different than anything before. Never has our country been so out of control ….. I don’t know any other way to say that. We can use the past as a light but it surely isn’t a beacon.
Don’t kid yourself, it will get worse. They’ll probably stick in the worst parts right before the vote so we don’t have time to make a fuss. What Obama signs will be a sham fulfillment of an insincere campaign promise.
Medicare Part D was the rehearsal, this is the full production of “Watch Us Serve Our Corporate Masters While The Public Gets It Up The Donut Hole.
Because to do so would be to give up hope. Besides when the Tea Baggers said no healthcare at Town Halls we started going to Town Halls and the Town hall riots got much fewer and far between.
When the Press said loudly and quite often over the last few months the Public Option was dead we said otherwise and now the Public Option is more popular in the polls than all the Blue Dogs who bragged in September they had killed Healthcare.
We Lefties have not yet realized we Beat the GOP Astro turf Tea Baggers and the Main Stream Media on this issue. Now sure they can still screw us but that would only add fuel to our fire.
We can target every Blue Dog. We can cost Harry and his son their jobs. We are the only thing keeping the Dems a majority party. If healthcare fails many of us will stay home on election day and the press and the Dems will know why they lost.
Okey-doke, have a marvelous day.
According to Bernie Sanders the current Senate bill offers a public option for 2% of the population and does nothing to contain rising healthcare costs. WOW!!! The stage is being set for even greater failure in the future.
Harry Reid no Union support well then he can’t win.
Citizen Twain:
That isn’t quite what I meant but I agree with what you said. The “light” that shines from the past comes through our own eyes and the answers to our actions at any moment in history do NOT reside in the past.
Good post. They win if they convince us there is no hope.
NorskeFlamethrower –
I am certainly not suggesting we repeat the past. Nor does the idea that “these times are unlike any previous ones” invalidate the idea of studying where we’ve been to find out where we are and where we’re going.
If Barack Obama has to grovel this much for a single Republican vote – and fails to appreciate that one or two such votes will mean nothing in terms of Republican cooperation or support with any of his purported agenda – he will end up doing more harm to average Americans than George W. Bush. Howzat for a legacy, Mr. President?
For the first time I don’t think we know where we’re going and “now” is so different from “then” I’m not sure it can be a guide. We were at one time a UNITED country. Now we seem to have broken into small pieces because of politics – everything is political now.
It is distressing to watch and I haven’t any idea how to put it back together. That’s just how I feel and I do think the country is out of control.
Citizen cassiodorus:
Peace Brother, but history has no meaning other than what we create from it and history certainly does not contain the answers to the choices we make at every moment of the present and that is why your statement that “History shows us what is as well as what isn’t possible…” is comeplete nonsense. And furthermore that idea is dangerous because if you believe that history is some immutable repository of truth for the present then you believe that life and your experience in it are simply a Sisyphian faggot hassle, predetermined and that has no resolution and certainly no future and therefore no meaning.
More and more one is left to wonder what was point of doing anything here in 2009 to reform American healthcare in WashingtonDC?
A so called reform which likely will not come into place until 2014. Five years from now.
Clearly the $$ trees were being shaked and K Street,Capitol Hill and the WH have been open for business throughout this so called reform and tens (hundreds?) of millions of $$ have been put in motion. Hopefully all the Ds and Rs have happily banked big campaign funds by now and will mercifully put this fake reform effort to rest soon. The process has become so corrupted by entrenched interests and the money they shovel around. A genuine waste of past several months time,manpower and energy expended to do little or nothing when all is said and done.
But it is not done. Several more election cycles,years and possible big changes to endure in each statehouse before this POS reform sees any light of day.
So what are the Ds so happy about again? I hope they all get voted out by 2013. Watching last couple nights worth of cable news shows where these Ds come on and crow about how good this POS reform is leaves one feeling ill and fully betrayed.
What a waste of time.
I sincerely hope Barack Obama and the Ds in Washington get wiped out by the Rs. The Rs are crazy as hell to be sure but the more they are let to run Washington into the ground the sooner this whole current money politics regime in WashingtonDC gets toppled.
The CrazyTown Rs will keep cutting taxes,borrowing more from whoever they can and leave more poop piles laying about they will accept no real world responsibility for. Let them run WashingtonDC into the ground. Better than this fake D Barack Obama BS and the Ds trying to appease the crazy Rs and fake Ds who seem to be running Washington anyway.
Just ask Barack Obama. Mister Bipartisanship. He has ruined for another 10-15 years any true reform of American healthcare. Just remember this when you get your jacked up health insurance premium bills and are forced to pay or face penalties. Barack Obama let this happen. Better if he had never even started this fake,corrupted reform.
But that was not the point was it? This is/was all about shaking the $$ trees. That surely was the real point and we know the $$ were falling from the $$ trees. This bunch of charlatans now have the gall to tell us how wonderful they were in giving us this bastardized healthcare reform. They can go to hell.
I know that Chicago is as flat as a pancake, and Hawaii hasn’t seen snow for a few million years, so here’ the thing, Mr. President. Snowe balls get bigger as they roll down hill. The faster you chase them, the faster they go and the bigger they get. Before you know it, they’ve swallowed you at the bottom of the hill.
But I think the smartest president in the room knows that. He just doesn’t want health care reform if the price is lower profits for his corporate supporters, no matter the continued harm to the people he grew up with and organized on the streets of Chicago, no matter the harm to middle America and to any business that competes with a foreign one from a civilized country with universal health care.
Mr. Obama isn’t a magic anything. I’m beginning to think he’s not even a Democrat, at least not one a Democrat from before Geo. Bush would recognize.
Twain — “Now” is not significantly different from “then,” because “now” is the result of what happened “then,” and “then” was the result of what happened before “then.” And what happened then and what’s happening now will have a good deal to say about what will happen in the future. If anything, people repeat the mistakes of the past because they are ignorant of history, not because they’ve studied it too much.
The great downturn of 2008 was the result of thirty-five years of neoliberal political economy. From the 1970s onward, the great surplus of capital in the global capitalist system meant that the most powerful of capitalists could continually rent out the Federal government, and get it to change the rules of the existing capitalist system to benefit them. This continues to happen to this day.
Back to our topic here: given this historical background, should it be a great surprise to anyone here that our “health care reform” should be continually rewritten by the powerful insurance lobbies?
No, NorskeFlamethrower, you can repeat “complete nonsense” all you want, but all you are doing is recycling Henry Ford’s “History is bunk” maxim. And no, your rhetorical dance about “Sisyphean faggot hassle” is just the erection of another straw man, as you have equated the study of history with the drawing of wrong lessons from it.
Please don’t misunderstand. I am not saying we shouldn’t look at the past. It tells us a great deal but I don’t think the experience of the past relates to all things in the present. The past 50 years have seen advances in every possible arena that could not have been foreseen before that. And the last 20 years are simply astounding. We can do things today that could never have been imagined in the past – military applications, science, entertainment, etc. The past simply could not have prepared us for the harm we can do with our “toys” of today. I love history and see the comparisons but they apply only in a general way.
There are so many issues packed into this one phrase.
First, which process? Too many folks of all stripes consider the legislative process to be the be-all and end-all of getting reform done. It is just a part of the process. If the legislative process fails, you are back to the political persuasion proces. If that fails, you are back to the electoral process. If that fails, you are back to the grassroots organizing process. So which processes should progressives not be supporting.
Second, who is it that says “No” to the legislation? Like it or not, it is the current members of Congress, not us. We can beg, plead, cajoled, pressure, harass, whatever. But they still have the power regardless of w we advocate or oppose. Which is to say, we finally do not control what will come out of Congress and passes Obama’s desk. Nor actually does anyone in the political process–not Pelosi, not Reid, not Obama, not even Rahm Emmanuel. The process will produce (or not produce) what the process produces. There is no way that these folks are going to back up and start over with a single-payer solution.
Third, it is helpful to look on the timing specified in the resulting bill not as good or bad, but as something that we can use to push real healthcare reform down the road. It might turn out to be a good thing that some of the watered-down items do not go into effect until 2014. They are watered down because they are controversial enough to require more political agreement from the public. And our winning that argument depends on how we frame the product that comes out of Congress and what we do the next minute after Obama signs it.
Instead of having tunnel vision about the endgame of this legislative action, we need to start thinking about how to keep this issue alive legislatively and use it as a winning issue in the 2010 elections. And that means making the selling out of Congress (Democrats and especially Republicans) and the White House to the healthcare industry a huge issue in the 2010 election, one which will be as everyone says about whose base has the most energy and numbers.
And I predict that if we look longterm, we will win this fight before 2014. And that win might even be a single-payer system.
To advocate that progressives not support the process looks very much like sucking all of the energy out of what we need to be doing. A good deal of progressive energy and effort and persistence went into reversing the trend that we were on in 2005. When history’s judgment of the Bush administration finally came down (more swiftly than we expected, I would add) there were enough sufficiently progressive candidates and a sufficient campaign organization and progressive blog infrastructure in place that the Obama campaign and the Democratic Party could leverage into a presidency and two so-so majorities in Congress. That infrastructure is the key to the second part of the struggle–numbers.
Which brings us to the math. It takes convincing roughly 175,000 people to vote for a candidate for them to win a seat in Congress. If you want to take down Mike Ross, you must convince 175,000 people in his district to vote for your candidate. Which means you have to have some effective personal networks in his district and enough progressive volunteers to turn out that vote. Oh, and a credible candidate. You don’t get these by bailing out of the process.
It took movement conservatives 16 years to go from the disaster of 1964 to power in 1980 and they had to get past Nixon, the triangulator. It took movement conservatives another 20 years to get to the sort of triumphal power in which they potentially could have fulfilled their entire agenda. It took them two years to blow it, two more years before the public noticed, and two more to lose power and implode. By contrast, the power that FDR put in place for liberal Democratic ideas did not get blown until 1965 (32 years) and took an additional 15 years to completely unwind. And another 22 years to reach the state that the Republican Party is in right now. And there many multiple betrayals of ideals of liberalism that occurred during that time. But many more significant accomplishments, some of which are unfinished (like healthcare).
If progressives in Congress have sold out, it is because progressives in their districts are so relieved to have a “progressive” representing them that they have not continued the hard work of keeping progressives in Congress progressive. Sorta sat back with the excuse that now that these folks are in Congress, they need to show leadership. Well, let me tell you about how showing leadership happens; the base keeps a persistent communication with the leaders that betrayal will be punished. And the base has the farm club of candidates to make good on that threat. What one does not do is leave and let the the gains made slip away. (I remember a moment in 2003 in which there were serious economic arguments being made by conservatives in support of slavery; if being and employee is like indentured servitude, the making that contract for life is like slavery–that was the line of argument).
So what we are in need of are more progressives in almost every Congressional District. To do that, more red-state progressives need to come out of the closet. And more blue-state progressives need to shake off their complacency and their cynicism.
It says that we will not stop, we will not politely go away, and we will be on guard for future betrayal, not knowing from what quarter it will come. It also says that we can push on the legislative process and backstop what real reform we can, but do not yet have the power to drive it.
The past is relevant to the present. Obama is trying to relive the Clinton Presidency and continuing the worst of both Clinton and Bush policies. Obama is an out of touch, status quo, corporatist, Imperial President. He is business as usual, more of the same, same old, same old. There is no change in any of that to believe in. Progressives simply delude themselves thinking there is anyone or anything there to work with. We need to move into clear opposition and start running our own candidates and primary Democrats wherever we can.
An analogy of sorts:
Imagine during the 2008 presidential and Congressional campaigns the issue of government support of and spending for the arts was an important issue for you. During the Democratic primaries both Obama and Clinton promised a significant increase in both. Same with most Democratic Congressional candidates. Obama wins the presidential nomination and along with the successful Congressional candidates again promise to bolster the government effort to broaden deeply the role art plays in the lives of citizens. In contrast to the reactionary Republicans who want to relegate the arts to a teeny tiny office in a teeny tiny corner of some teeny tiny government agency.
The Democrats win the election and now a year later they have come up with an arts agenda that is less teeny tiny than the Republican proposals but not a whole lot less teenier or tinier than Bush and the Republican agenda over the previous 8 years.
They want to expand museum hours and kick in a few million more bucks at PBS while setting up a think tank to study ways to help State and Local governments become more active in the arts community—starting in 2014.
In other words, the emphasis can be placed on how the Democratic health care plans are better than the Republicans. Or it can be placed on how much weaker the Democratic health plans are now compared to what they promised us when they were campaigning for our votes months ago.
Depending then on which approach you take the final package will be more or less a sham.
And why haven’t you made this comment into a diary, pray tell? Seems it would be a good one.
Now there’s a quote I’m going to keep in my pocket for further use!!
Thank you.
What a wonderful defense of inertia! I was talking about the current healthcare debate which you turn into some great wheel of existence. No. It is a lot simpler than that. We stop supporting a steaming pile and we call the steaming pile a steaming pile.
Seeing as the healthcare bill is shaping up pretty much as Obama envisioned it back in March, I would say he has controlled it and the “process” well, not just for us.
If you can’t find the irony in pushing the healthcare debate now because of its urgency with delaying a lot of it until 2013 or now 2014, you really aren’t trying. I would say people who remain fixated on a “public option” no matter how debased and gutted were the ones suffering from tunnel vision. And if the idea is that we can kick things down the road, an iffy proposition in itself, why do we have to accept all the crap now and hope for something better later? That is why I say we should say no now. Under your logic, we should have kept supporting the Iraq and Afghan wars, and hoped for something better later.
As for all the 176,000, again more excuses for doing nothing, changing nothing. There is a lot of populist anger out in the country. The economy is going to get worse with Obama’s team of screwups. So this would be precisely the time to run real progressives against incumbents using the Democrats’ own primary machinery to do it. But we can’t do this effectively if we keep identifying with the same idiots we should be running against.
In sum, why has it become such a controversial idea that progressives should actually stand by their principles? What have we gained by selling them out, or being silent on them? What have we lost?
I’ve come to the conclusion that the only way to keep this issue alive is to “let” the Republicans defeat the bill. See prior diaries by letsgetitdone.
The “reforms” are so weak, the bad things are so bad, and the effective date is so far off, that it just doesn’t seem like a winning formula to me.
Plus, the American public is s-l-o-w-l-y becoming aware of and focusing on the health care issue. Anger at Republicans for stopping reform should help in getting rid of some of them, and might — might — motivate Dems.
Many ConservaDems are already in the situation that their opposition to reform is at odds with what their constituents want and reflects only the wishes of their Corporate Masters. [I'm looking at you, Blanche Lincoln.] We’ve got to build that pressure such that no amount of corporate “support” can overcome the fact that a Congresscritter is screwing constituents for the benefit of the Corporate Overlords.
The rage at and awareness of the Great Corporate Fuck-over is slowly building [see Jane's success with Grayson & Paul], despite a worthless media and even worse congresscritters.
Now all we need is a LEADER to push true reform. Wasn’t that what 2008 was all about?
Love you, Flame.
You and what 174,999 others in what Congressional Districts?
Looks like we “great minds” [unjustifiably complimenting self] think alike.
“betray” is the wrong word here, because it implies harry reid and progressives have had common cause in the past.
but we haven’t. Ever. It’s not so much betrayal as “Harry just doesn’t give a shit about our issues”.
I did not work, support, and contribute to Democratic candidates for the United States Senate in 2006 and 2008 in order to allow Olympia Snowe’s wishes on healthcare to prevail in 2009. Harry Reid needs to understand that catering to her is a recipe for electoral disaster due to a demoralized base: he has reconciliation for a reason, and he must use it to give the American people what they voted for.
Has anyone determined whether the removal of the antitrust exemption is in the Senate bill?
I read somewhere that Harry dropped that.
I just can’t understand the mentality of this line of thinking and the choice to focus the pressure the ‘far left’ has to influence this good-for-nothing, presumptively omnipotent president, not to mention his legislative leader in the august senate. Anyone whose read Jacob Hacker’s initial agenda for shared prosperity must know, just based on how things went down in the house and all we learned about what was legislatively possible in the preceding months, that none of the proposed public options absent many of the other parts of the agenda would have done much of anything. As we now know and as many long predicted, any public option that’s included in any final bill will be more expensive than the same plan offered by the private sector. This is not evidence of government’s incompetence or some perverse result of craven corporatism; argue with an actuary if you can’t stand this fact.
The insurance companies – who, by all accounts, are about as fun to deal with as, well, actuaries – are in a line of work that does require the use of some pretty cruel tricks. But even after taking their pounds of flesh, their profit margins are 3-5%. As Anthony Weiner likes to point out, they’re unnecessary middlemen and few of their employees would require that much prodding to admit as much.
Go protest outside of some hospitals, at any and all AMA meetings, and justify why we pay doctors the way we do (and I think those pay scales are the byproduct of medicare payment rates i.e. blame the feds), and deal with this as Hacker’s original plan at least made an attempt to grapple with. And since the world free rides off much of the public and private research and innovation we do in this country – which goes a long way in explaining why we pay so much for procedures and devices compared to some other countries run almost entirely by white people – well, it could get ugly were we to just public plan a lot of that money away without doing a little more thinking beforehand.
Look at the reactions to the mammography recommendations this past week, recommendations which have essentially been justified by dispassionate evidence since the early ’70s. There are lots of reasons why comprehensive reform will not be off the government’s to-do list for quite some time (as the heartless, corporatist Obama and his evil health care nerds clearly know well) but the biggest reason is the culture in this country, which is not rational and will not flinch in reaction to a motion to cut off debate.
The congress is feckless and horrible and everyone seems to agree about this; I believe that was one of the critical insights that guided the writing of our most hallowed and venerable documents. It may be worth noting that the president, miserly and disingenuous as he has proven to be so many times these last 11 months, paid off his student loans in the early part of this decade. He had every opportunity to make a whole lot of money – maybe not Alan Grayson money but money – but he turned that down to do some really tough work for the benefit of some really poor people. But I guess, after 47 years, he finally sold his soul so he could have some real power for himself instead of trying to get power for a bunch of powerless people.
We live in a country where at least 30% of the voting public thinks Sarah Palin should be the president and the congress should be peopled with real Americans who think like she does. And we have some of the most anti-democratic legislative procedures in West Africa, let alone the Western World – hardly to the lament of many of the folks here a little over four years ago. Can you imagine if Nancy Pelosi needed to corral 261 votes to move a bill on her turf? I can’t, but that’s basically what the feckless and pathetic Harry Reid has to do.
I have no summary conclusion other than to ask someone for a better suggestion and don’t say reconciliation because, as well all know, a bill that would proceed on that track would have to be drafted by the budget committee, which is a road we could try going down so long as we’re willing to live with Kent Conrad’s preferred solution that’s sufficiently popular to command 51 votes (my instinct is that his ideal bill would get 45-46 votes). This community has worked tirelessly to pull together an overwhelming democratic majority in both houses – even after the tumult from the blowback against the work of Messrs. Emanuel, Schumer, and Dean for their instrumental roles in winning back-to-back landslide election victories that ushered in many of today’s conservative democrats (maybe I’m mistaken about the blowback but I can’t imagine that folks here even cracked a smile in celebration of this orchestrated hijacking.) Lyndon Johnson had 67 senate heads to crack when Medicare passed but with the way this party building project has turned out there can’t be an appetite for pushing too hard for a pyrrhic victory like that.
Seriously, in the real world, as in this world, the one where all the powers and maneuvers we’ve seen these morons bring to bear so far and all the ones we’ve yet to see but which many here seem to know with confidence a) exist and b) will, by their use in defense of a Good Bill, garner 218 and 60 in each house, can someone sketch out the counterfactual that shows how to get this done next time (since this has been considerably worse than doing nothing.)?
Reid abandoning the public option is a tin-hat conspiracy theory (without it you’d get like 15 votes in the Senate.)
Stick with this line of reasoning, much better:
“It is possible I’m just being paranoid and reading too much into these changes. They may have nothing to do with Snowe. It could also be that Reid has made these changes in the hope of convincing her to at least not filibuster a bill with a public option. He might think that by giving her 90% of what she wants, she will be willing to accept the opt-out public option.”
The only thing that can be done differently next time is to have (1) a set of players in the Congress who are committed to getting it done, not to a show of giving it the old college try; (2) a means of getting reliable information out to the general public; (3) a public more aware, informed, and vigilant about who is maneuvering what.
That in itself is an immense undertaking, which has been too daunting to thousands, maybe millions of progressives for the past forty years. Consequently most have looked to one person or issue or campaign or piece of legislation to get the process change done and then get it maintained.
Nobody else is going to make the process changes that are the prerequisite for getting the policy changes.
Given that, it will be much easier to refine a “public option” already in place than to force through another major change. But if the bill fails completely it will be as difficult to build the momentum for, say, a single payer bill from scratch. And if you have to build a third party from scratch in order to accomplish either of these, you are talking about a 10-15 year project even if events tilt your way.
You can’t outflank a multi-billion-dollar industry willing to spend hundreds of millions of dollars lobbying a single bill without a critical mass of active and energetic people. And the reason is that the influence of personal networks has to overcome the power of mass media propaganda. That is the process lesson of how the Obama campaign used the OFA organization to counterbalance an unceasing and still continuing propaganda barrage, and even then without the collapse of Wall Street we would likely be talking about President McCain and Vice President Palin.
I challenge that this process has been considerably worse than doing nothing. We have clarified in some detail for a whole lot of people beyond the group of progressives that sought a Dean candidacy where exactly in Congress the corporations have a stranglehold and who we can trust on what issues. More people have seen the sausage-making in which the proposal that goes in one end of the process ends up 180-degrees from where it began. We know where geographically we are weak on what issues. For example, members of Congress from New York and Connecticut are not likely to be overwhelmingly helpful on FIRE industry reform; members of Congress from Texas, Louisiana, West Virginia, Kentucky, North Dakota, and Montana are not likely to be helpful on bills to deal with climate change; members from the states that (a) need it the most or (b) have a monopoly health insurance market are not likely to be helpful on healthcare reform.
And then there are the monolithic Republicans.
Right. What can we do? I have written to Bernie Sanders asking him to either (1) kill the bill altogether, along with Lieberman, the Republicans, and any Conservadems willing to kill it; or (2) work with Democrats exclusively to strip it of the health care reform aspects of the legislation (the faux-PO and the mandates), and keep the health insurance reform items (end to rescission, guaranteed issue) and, separately, to repeal McCarren-Ferguson. I’ve also written to my State Senators (Kirk and Kerry) and Barney Frank. So…what else? Any equivalent to the Kucinich Amendment in the Senate?
If this health care reform does little to nothing to help someone with a chronic illness, such as diabetes, I’m probably going to be forced to stay where I am (abroad) with only the option of moving to other countries aside from the US, which won’t be easy and I’ll be far from family, but I have to look out for myself first. Having poor, unaffordable health care, as I had before when I lived in the US, is no way to live a life. America is rapidly becoming a great country for the rich and perfectly healthy, a third world country (in a 20th century, first world setting) for everyone else.
FWIW:
http://www.pnhp.org/news/2009/november/healthcare-now-statement-on-hr-3962
Interesting idea. Let’s hope not! I know that Reid has been a champion of the public option and I think he will continue to do so, especially in light of it’s success! http://cli.gs/23yYaM/