Comments on: Did Schumer Cause The AHIP Freak Out? http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/ Politics for liberal newsgeeks Fri, 17 Feb 2012 02:47:29 -0600 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: shekissesfrogs http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/#comment-53758 shekissesfrogs Tue, 13 Oct 2009 04:37:06 +0000 http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/?p=3234#comment-53758 Don't take this report or this guy too seriously, He's being accused of trolling <a href="http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/10/ahip-releases-reportphp.php#comment-3630442" rel="nofollow">here</a>. Another <a href="http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/10/ahip-releases-reportphp.php#comment-3630549" rel="nofollow">opinion on this</a> <blockquote>This is an analysis that relies on another consulting firm (Hay Group) to mess with numbers. If one thinks about this, this is the Private Insurance Companies THREAT to those with Private Insurance...if you think we are going to cut our profits...think again...as we are going to raise rates EVEN HIGHER because a Public Option healthcare plan may take away some of our customers. They are talking like HCR will take effect immediately, which is not the case, so then consider all the rate hikes between 2009 and 2013 that are expected by Private Health Insurance Plans and say huh? It is amusing that this report is really targeting those "Cadillac" policy holders...who to date get their health insurance FREE...oh my, they may actually have to pay for some of their health insurance premiums? Yep, I can hear the GOP legislators now....it is unfair to make those with a substanial income actually have to pay for themselves...all because we now have to cover all those individuals with pre-existing conditions...wahhhhhh!</blockquote> Don’t take this report or this guy too seriously, He’s being accused of trolling here.

Another opinion on this

This is an analysis that relies on another consulting firm (Hay Group) to mess with numbers. If one thinks about this, this is the Private Insurance Companies THREAT to those with Private Insurance…if you think we are going to cut our profits…think again…as we are going to raise rates EVEN HIGHER because a Public Option healthcare plan may take away some of our customers.

They are talking like HCR will take effect immediately, which is not the case, so then consider all the rate hikes between 2009 and 2013 that are expected by Private Health Insurance Plans and say huh?

It is amusing that this report is really targeting those “Cadillac” policy holders…who to date get their health insurance FREE…oh my, they may actually have to pay for some of their health insurance premiums?

Yep, I can hear the GOP legislators now….it is unfair to make those with a substanial income actually have to pay for themselves…all because we now have to cover all those individuals with pre-existing conditions…wahhhhhh!

]]> By: iceman15 http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/#comment-53756 iceman15 Tue, 13 Oct 2009 04:32:23 +0000 http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/?p=3234#comment-53756 Perhaps I might be able to suggest an easier connection between the weakening of the individual mandate and the "freaking out' demonstrated by the AHIP 'report': the simultaneous end of pre-existing underwriting restrictions. As someone who had open-heart surgery in '06 & as a result cannot survive underwriting, I have every incentive to stop paying my $10,000+ annual individual policy, put the money in the bank, pay whatever fine is levied and then get a policy when I needed treatment. My medical condition would typically allow this in that if I have a problem I will either drop dead immediately (literally) or (I hope) have sufficient warning in time to activate a new policy. Either way it changes my position from the current loose/loose (gigantic premium & large deductible/cannot change companies) to win/win (no discrimination on premium due to pre-exisings/guarantee issue choice of lowest cost policy with my existing providers in network). Even allowing for frictional effects, such as phasing in of federal subsidies and ramping up of mandate fines, the profits of my current insurer, and hence my expenses, must shrink substantially. Of course if I simply drop dead it wouldn't cost me anything at all (!!). My wife, who has a minor pre-existing, is charged a 50% penalty on her own individual policy and would likely drop it entirely as it is a typical 'junk' policy simply paying the fine. I can see our out-of-pocket premium expenses dropping by 50+% even without a strong P.O. under these conditions. No wonder the likes of our current insurer - Humana - is howling! Perhaps I might be able to suggest an easier connection between the weakening of the individual mandate and the “freaking out’ demonstrated by the AHIP ‘report’: the simultaneous end of pre-existing underwriting restrictions.

As someone who had open-heart surgery in ’06 & as a result cannot survive underwriting, I have every incentive to stop paying my $10,000+ annual individual policy, put the money in the bank, pay whatever fine is levied and then get a policy when I needed treatment. My medical condition would typically allow this in that if I have a problem I will either drop dead immediately (literally) or (I hope) have sufficient warning in time to activate a new policy.

Either way it changes my position from the current loose/loose (gigantic premium & large deductible/cannot change companies) to win/win (no discrimination on premium due to pre-exisings/guarantee issue choice of lowest cost policy with my existing providers in network). Even allowing for frictional effects, such as phasing in of federal subsidies and ramping up of mandate fines, the profits of my current insurer, and hence my expenses, must shrink substantially. Of course if I simply drop dead it wouldn’t cost me anything at all (!!).

My wife, who has a minor pre-existing, is charged a 50% penalty on her own individual policy and would likely drop it entirely as it is a typical ‘junk’ policy simply paying the fine. I can see our out-of-pocket premium expenses dropping by 50+% even without a strong P.O. under these conditions. No wonder the likes of our current insurer – Humana – is howling!

]]> By: GDC707 http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/#comment-53735 GDC707 Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:50:52 +0000 http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/?p=3234#comment-53735 It's incredible just how many of this nation's ailments can be traced right back to WALL STREET? I think this is an angle that has not been played up enough in the friendly media regarding the healthcare battle. With the anti-WALL STREET sentiment around the land along with Michael Moore's new movie this could be pretty powerful stuff. Ironic isn't it? Wendell Potter's role in all this as the repentant archangel. What a movie this all is! It’s incredible just how many of this nation’s ailments can be traced right back to WALL STREET? I think this is an angle that has not been played up enough in the friendly media regarding the healthcare battle. With the anti-WALL STREET sentiment around the land along with Michael Moore’s new movie this could be pretty powerful stuff.
Ironic isn’t it? Wendell Potter’s role in all this as the repentant archangel. What a movie this all is!

]]> By: letsgetitdone http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/#comment-53734 letsgetitdone Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:47:48 +0000 http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/?p=3234#comment-53734 I think this is right. Schumer is very political and very, very smart. He just prioritized the Party above the insurance industry. I think this is right. Schumer is very political and very, very smart. He just prioritized the Party above the insurance industry.

]]> By: GDC707 http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/#comment-53726 GDC707 Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:33:12 +0000 http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/?p=3234#comment-53726 Damn straight Norske.“This writhing corporate monster is fighting for it’s life and is capable of injecting venom to the very last.” They tried the land mines (triggers, co-ops, opt-outs.) But we’re coming down to the bone and the tactics are getting fiercer such as this petulant report that AHIP released today. What an arrogant, threatening piece of work. “If you do nothing we will raise your rates by 79%. If you pass this Baucus bill which is not perfectly to our liking we will raise your rates by 111%. You peasants had damn well better fall in line.” Y’all watch. Now begins the SERIOUS scrotum twisting. Skeletons will start walking out of Congressional closets, heartfelt bribery, and wall to wall television advertising by the CARTEL. Its going to be blood and eyeballs all over the floor. I say we “GIVE 'EM THE COLD STEEL, BOYS” (and girls, of course!) Damn straight Norske.“This writhing corporate monster is fighting for it’s life and is capable of injecting venom to the very last.” They tried the land mines (triggers, co-ops, opt-outs.) But we’re coming down to the bone and the tactics are getting fiercer such as this petulant report that AHIP released today. What an arrogant, threatening piece of work. “If you do nothing we will raise your rates by 79%. If you pass this Baucus bill which is not perfectly to our liking we will raise your rates by 111%. You peasants had damn well better fall in line.” Y’all watch. Now begins the SERIOUS scrotum twisting. Skeletons will start walking out of Congressional closets, heartfelt bribery, and wall to wall television advertising by the CARTEL. Its going to be blood and eyeballs all over the floor.
I say we “GIVE ‘EM THE COLD STEEL, BOYS” (and girls, of course!)

]]> By: readerOfTeaLeaves http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/#comment-53719 readerOfTeaLeaves Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:23:13 +0000 http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/?p=3234#comment-53719 Yup. Stock prices, quarterly earnings, yadda, yadda. So explain to me once again why we're even allowing health care to be captured by a corporate, profit-making structure in the first place...? As for Schumer, I agree with Jon W; as a political creature (and former chair of the Senate Dem reelection campaign), if he had failed to see the blowback coming from the healthCo version, he'd be an idiot. Schumer is far from perfect, but he's also not an idiot. Yup. Stock prices, quarterly earnings, yadda, yadda.
So explain to me once again why we’re even allowing health care to be captured by a corporate, profit-making structure in the first place…?

As for Schumer, I agree with Jon W; as a political creature (and former chair of the Senate Dem reelection campaign), if he had failed to see the blowback coming from the healthCo version, he’d be an idiot. Schumer is far from perfect, but he’s also not an idiot.

]]> By: Teddy Partridge http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/#comment-53703 Teddy Partridge Tue, 13 Oct 2009 02:05:17 +0000 http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/?p=3234#comment-53703 Excellent point. I always forget that the CEOs live in a world entirely different from our own, with different motivators. It's very true that stock price is what drives them, certainly not the country's well-being or patient's coverage. Excellent point.

I always forget that the CEOs live in a world entirely different from our own, with different motivators. It’s very true that stock price is what drives them, certainly not the country’s well-being or patient’s coverage.

]]> By: PaulaT http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/#comment-53676 PaulaT Tue, 13 Oct 2009 01:13:42 +0000 http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/?p=3234#comment-53676 Wendell Potter was on Countdown tonight and the way he talks, Wall Street freaked out the CEO's who then demanded the report be released. It sounds like the fact that health insurer stock prices went up when the Baucus bill was released might have hurt them in the end. All those investors now will see their stock go down if the end product is not as favorable as it appeared from the original bill and CEO's are supposed to get stock prices up, not let them fall before their bonuses come in. With the weakened penalties, the stock is going to fall because there won't be that same number of new customers. Wendell Potter was on Countdown tonight and the way he talks, Wall Street freaked out the CEO’s who then demanded the report be released. It sounds like the fact that health insurer stock prices went up when the Baucus bill was released might have hurt them in the end. All those investors now will see their stock go down if the end product is not as favorable as it appeared from the original bill and CEO’s are supposed to get stock prices up, not let them fall before their bonuses come in. With the weakened penalties, the stock is going to fall because there won’t be that same number of new customers.

]]> By: selise http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/#comment-53674 selise Tue, 13 Oct 2009 01:12:05 +0000 http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/?p=3234#comment-53674 thank you for the info! very interesting. and probably very important (ianal though). thank you for the info! very interesting. and probably very important (ianal though).

]]> By: OldFatGuy http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/12/did-schumer-cause-the-ahip-freak-out/#comment-53671 OldFatGuy Tue, 13 Oct 2009 00:53:15 +0000 http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/?p=3234#comment-53671 OK, just <a href="http://commonhealth.wbur.org/wbur-posts-and-stories/2009/03/state-wins-first-legal-challenge-to-individual-mandate/" rel="nofollow">found one.</a> It was dismissed in Mass. Superior Court, but is being appealed. The real interesting part is going to be when it gets to Federal court. This isn't settle yet. And if the Federal government passes one, you can rest assured there lawyers in all 50 states ready to file challenges. And it wouldn't surprise me if at least one of them found a judge to issue an injuction delaying the implementation until the cases can be heard. It would take years, working its way up, consolidating, and finally reaching the SCOTUS. I just can't understand the logic of how it's constitutional. OK, just found one. It was dismissed in Mass. Superior Court, but is being appealed. The real interesting part is going to be when it gets to Federal court.

This isn’t settle yet. And if the Federal government passes one, you can rest assured there lawyers in all 50 states ready to file challenges. And it wouldn’t surprise me if at least one of them found a judge to issue an injuction delaying the implementation until the cases can be heard. It would take years, working its way up, consolidating, and finally reaching the SCOTUS.

I just can’t understand the logic of how it’s constitutional.

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