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	<title>Comments on: Unity &#8217;09 Tells Veal Pen To Clap For Baucus Bill</title>
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	<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/</link>
	<description>Politics for liberal newsgeeks</description>
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		<title>By: pokums</title>
		<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50446</link>
		<dc:creator>pokums</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 17:46:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50446</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Great question OutWest, but I’m afraid it’s epu’d into irrelevance. (I’m always about a day and 30 FDL posts into the past myself, nearly impossible to catch up, pointless to comment.)  Please re-ask in a more current relevant thread.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great question OutWest, but I’m afraid it’s epu’d into irrelevance. (I’m always about a day and 30 FDL posts into the past myself, nearly impossible to catch up, pointless to comment.)  Please re-ask in a more current relevant thread.</p>
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		<title>By: OutWest</title>
		<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50423</link>
		<dc:creator>OutWest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 09:25:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50423</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;This is making my head hurt. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I’m new to the progressive blogosphere, brought here by the health care debate. I have been making fairly regular contributions over the past 2 to 3 months to progressive groups in support of strong health care reform. I’d prefer single payer but have been supporting causes related to the public option because that’s all there is. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I’m on mailing lists for FDL, DFA, HCAN, and MoveOn, among others. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;In very recent emails, HCAN and MoveOn have both appeared to be in support of the pubic option. If they’re caving or have caved, why am I not seeing it? Are there lines I should be reading between? &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Help! Someone tell me what group/s I can trust to pursue a strong public option. I’m not interested in supporting any group that is waffling on the issue, or is likely to waffle. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Thanks for any advice/explanation anyone can give me. I’m trying to do the right thing.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is making my head hurt. </p>
<p>I’m new to the progressive blogosphere, brought here by the health care debate. I have been making fairly regular contributions over the past 2 to 3 months to progressive groups in support of strong health care reform. I’d prefer single payer but have been supporting causes related to the public option because that’s all there is. </p>
<p>I’m on mailing lists for FDL, DFA, HCAN, and MoveOn, among others. </p>
<p>In very recent emails, HCAN and MoveOn have both appeared to be in support of the pubic option. If they’re caving or have caved, why am I not seeing it? Are there lines I should be reading between? </p>
<p>Help! Someone tell me what group/s I can trust to pursue a strong public option. I’m not interested in supporting any group that is waffling on the issue, or is likely to waffle. </p>
<p>Thanks for any advice/explanation anyone can give me. I’m trying to do the right thing.</p>
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		<title>By: robspierre</title>
		<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50421</link>
		<dc:creator>robspierre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 06:08:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50421</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;“we progressives are going to have to start winning a media war and making “Joe Sixpack” realize that the stuff we want is, with few exceptions, exactly the same as the stuff he wants.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I think that the media war and Joe Sixpack’s realizations are different things. We’ve won the latter, without the media. You do not have 75% support of something without winning over the man in the street. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The problem is not public perception. The problem is that the elected officials and liberal organizations that supposedly represent us, that won with the support of the man in the street, do not feel that they have to pay any attention to what we want. They do not fear us. My own so-called Representative, Betsy Markey, beat a solidly entrenched opponent in 2008 because voters repudiated her predecessor, Marilyn Musgrave. Markey is now essentially Musgrave Lite–all the corporatist policies without the residual honesty her troglodyte of a predecessor. I honestly preferred Musgrave.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I have accordingly defunded the Democratic Party, MoveOn, and the ACLU by ending my modest contributions. In 2010, I will actively campaign against any Blue Doggish pseudo-Democrat regardless of who the opponent is. Either I get a real, Liberal Democratic candidate, or I boycott the race.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“we progressives are going to have to start winning a media war and making “Joe Sixpack” realize that the stuff we want is, with few exceptions, exactly the same as the stuff he wants.”</p>
<p>I think that the media war and Joe Sixpack’s realizations are different things. We’ve won the latter, without the media. You do not have 75% support of something without winning over the man in the street. </p>
<p>The problem is not public perception. The problem is that the elected officials and liberal organizations that supposedly represent us, that won with the support of the man in the street, do not feel that they have to pay any attention to what we want. They do not fear us. My own so-called Representative, Betsy Markey, beat a solidly entrenched opponent in 2008 because voters repudiated her predecessor, Marilyn Musgrave. Markey is now essentially Musgrave Lite–all the corporatist policies without the residual honesty her troglodyte of a predecessor. I honestly preferred Musgrave.</p>
<p>I have accordingly defunded the Democratic Party, MoveOn, and the ACLU by ending my modest contributions. In 2010, I will actively campaign against any Blue Doggish pseudo-Democrat regardless of who the opponent is. Either I get a real, Liberal Democratic candidate, or I boycott the race.</p>
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		<title>By: letsgetitdone</title>
		<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50417</link>
		<dc:creator>letsgetitdone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 04:48:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50417</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The proper sound bite narrative wasn’t a PO. It was Medicare for All. Everybody in, Nobody Out. That’s what we should sell. And we should not rest until we have it.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The proper sound bite narrative wasn’t a PO. It was Medicare for All. Everybody in, Nobody Out. That’s what we should sell. And we should not rest until we have it.</p>
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		<title>By: tejanarusa</title>
		<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50415</link>
		<dc:creator>tejanarusa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 04:37:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50415</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Late, but I followed the link and explained to MoveOn why I stopped being a member of my local council (I’ve been disappointed for awhile, plus other personal issues).  They claim to read everything.  Hope they are getting a lot of these.&lt;br /&gt;
I’ll try the unsubscribing from OFA method, too.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;This doesn’t mean I’ll put up with ridiculous assaults against the Pres., (I nearly went over and ripped off an especially offensive bumper sticker from an old man’s car this morning…restrained myself), but I am massively disappointed. Again.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Late, but I followed the link and explained to MoveOn why I stopped being a member of my local council (I’ve been disappointed for awhile, plus other personal issues).  They claim to read everything.  Hope they are getting a lot of these.<br />
I’ll try the unsubscribing from OFA method, too.  </p>
<p>This doesn’t mean I’ll put up with ridiculous assaults against the Pres., (I nearly went over and ripped off an especially offensive bumper sticker from an old man’s car this morning…restrained myself), but I am massively disappointed. Again.</p>
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		<title>By: Jane Hamsher</title>
		<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50412</link>
		<dc:creator>Jane Hamsher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 02:40:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50412</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Has HCAN endorsed the progressive block strategy?  I’m pretty sure they haven’t.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Has HCAN endorsed the progressive block strategy?  I’m pretty sure they haven’t.</p>
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		<title>By: PaulaT</title>
		<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50411</link>
		<dc:creator>PaulaT</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 02:37:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50411</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I unsubscribed from OFA over the public option shenanigans. When you unsubscribe, they ask you why and you get a blank screen, not just check box categories, to give them a piece of your mind. Pointing out that organizing for America only means organizing for Obama when he gets back on the side of Americans feels really good.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I unsubscribed from OFA over the public option shenanigans. When you unsubscribe, they ask you why and you get a blank screen, not just check box categories, to give them a piece of your mind. Pointing out that organizing for America only means organizing for Obama when he gets back on the side of Americans feels really good.</p>
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		<title>By: rainshadow</title>
		<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50408</link>
		<dc:creator>rainshadow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 01:08:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50408</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Given MoveOn and HCAN stance on public option, it may be that Kellie Dupree is a runaway doggie escaped from the veal pen. I emailed both groups to let them know that this woman is costing them money.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Given MoveOn and HCAN stance on public option, it may be that Kellie Dupree is a runaway doggie escaped from the veal pen. I emailed both groups to let them know that this woman is costing them money.</p>
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		<title>By: Mauimom</title>
		<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50406</link>
		<dc:creator>Mauimom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Oct 2009 00:25:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50406</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Great letter, Carolyn&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Today I received [snail mail] solicitation from the ACLU.  I’ll use your response as a pattern.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Yesterday I received an e-mail from the DCCC bragging about their recent $1.3 mill. fund-raising, and soliciting more.  Those fools make it nearly impossible to hit “reply” to successfully get something back to them, so I went on the DCCC blog &amp; posted the following:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;I’m sorry, Chris [VanHollen, chair of the DCCC], but I have ceased donating to the DCCC.  This is the FIRST communication I’ve seen from it supporting the public option.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Obama has been HORRIBLE on this issue, and the DCCC I assume continues to support those “democrats” [the ones Rahm was so eager to fund in 2006] who oppose the public option but are eager for “mandates” that will enrich insurance companies without any oversight or improvement in services.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Obama and the Democrats have been totally ineffective on this important issue, and now we may get the worst of all worlds:  mandates, no cost controls, no oversight of insurance company outrages and no public option. Boy, are middle class workers going to love being REQUIRED to send $$$$ to the insurance companies, and penalized through the IRS if they don’t.  This will be an anvil around Democrats’ necks for decades.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I’m only donating to PROGRESSIVE candidates through ActBlue.  I don’t want a dime of my hard-earned $$$ going to Health Schuler, Mike Ross or the other “Blue Dogs,” and I wish I could get a refund for the huge amounts I donated to Obama and Democrats in 2008.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I’ll let you know when they come crawling to my door&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great letter, Carolyn</p>
<p>Today I received [snail mail] solicitation from the ACLU.  I’ll use your response as a pattern.</p>
<p>Yesterday I received an e-mail from the DCCC bragging about their recent $1.3 mill. fund-raising, and soliciting more.  Those fools make it nearly impossible to hit “reply” to successfully get something back to them, so I went on the DCCC blog &amp; posted the following:</p>
<blockquote><p>I’m sorry, Chris [VanHollen, chair of the DCCC], but I have ceased donating to the DCCC.  This is the FIRST communication I’ve seen from it supporting the public option.</p>
<p>Obama has been HORRIBLE on this issue, and the DCCC I assume continues to support those “democrats” [the ones Rahm was so eager to fund in 2006] who oppose the public option but are eager for “mandates” that will enrich insurance companies without any oversight or improvement in services.</p>
<p>Obama and the Democrats have been totally ineffective on this important issue, and now we may get the worst of all worlds:  mandates, no cost controls, no oversight of insurance company outrages and no public option. Boy, are middle class workers going to love being REQUIRED to send $$$$ to the insurance companies, and penalized through the IRS if they don’t.  This will be an anvil around Democrats’ necks for decades.</p>
<p>I’m only donating to PROGRESSIVE candidates through ActBlue.  I don’t want a dime of my hard-earned $$$ going to Health Schuler, Mike Ross or the other “Blue Dogs,” and I wish I could get a refund for the huge amounts I donated to Obama and Democrats in 2008.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I’ll let you know when they come crawling to my door</p>
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		<title>By: SomeGuy</title>
		<link>http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50403</link>
		<dc:creator>SomeGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Oct 2009 23:38:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://campaignsilo.firedoglake.com/2009/10/02/unity-09-tells-veal-pen-to-clap-for-baucus-bill/#comment-50403</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;By blocking any plan that does not include a public option, you do not mean a Democrat would vote against cloture, right? That would be too much.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By blocking any plan that does not include a public option, you do not mean a Democrat would vote against cloture, right? That would be too much.</p>
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