200 % of poverty? Cantwell’s state has higher wages and a higher cost of living than nearby Idaho will Washington state people get more cash or is she screwing her voters.

Is she selling her plan to the media on the tv shows? Does her idea have support in Congress?

Yeah, no offense to Cantwell, but if this is the best we can do, I’m afraid we’re in for a political massacre in 2010 and even this insufficient foothold will be rolled back immediately after Republicans regain power.

Americans sent Democrats to Washington with large majorities and a MANDATE. If Democrats don’t follow up on that mandate they won’t have the majorities for long.

Is this what Harry Reid meant when he said a public option would pass?

The way this thing has unfolded makes me Ok with even a “foothold”. A toe in the door as it were. With the forces arrayed against ANYTHING for the people, including the WH, it’s gonna take years to get out from under the bootheel of big capitalism.
I suspect we’re in for the long haul; to improve and work for a long time to get this as good as it can be.

Once the American people, who have been made lukewarm to the whole idea by the wingnuts and Obama start to see the devastation this bill brings to their lives, they will be calling for it to be expanded.
Remember, there are still 4 bills other than this one with strong public options. Maybe that will be enough in the end…for now.
Cantwell is smart.

AND the states run by rethugs-like VA-will get a shitty plan because the rethugs don’t give a DAMN about its citizens.

I’m against any plan thought up by the states unless it has Federal oversight.

And most obvious, we could be waiting for 5-10 years for anything to get set up. 50 DIFFERENT plans?

No thank you very much.

Should we call Maria out on a lame bait and switch I am really getting tired of politicians GOP and Dem who keep pulling this stuff.
Calling this the public option won’t save Harry Reid in the polls which fivethirtyeight now has Reid as the GOP’s most likely Senate pick up this year.
Considering that Healthcare is the only issue people have been talking about I think its safe to assume Harry’s poll numbers are linked to his failure to lead on this issue.
My question is has Harry will Harry figure that out? Will the Media figure that out or are they still waiting for Glen Beck’s Tea bagging hordes to overwhelm Dems in the polls.

In theory, if this can be expanded and improved as it is put together with the HELP Committee bill, we could have a decent chance of getting something at least halfway decent once it’s reconciled with whatever passes the House.

But historically, it seems things always come out a little worse, instead of better once they start getting negotiated behind closed doors. That’s why I’m skeptical. I applaud Cantwell’s efforts and in theory her strategy is sound, I’m just not sure that it will work out in practice.

Got that right.

This really has little to offer until it removes all access limits. We need to push the “progressive” dems on the committee to vote no on the final Finance Committee bill. What value is there in reporting this bill out of committee. Kerry, Rockefeller and and Schumer need to hear from constituents and donors: Vote NO!

link to fivethirtyeight Harry Reid poll ranking.

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/

AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND…

Citizen Jon Walker and the Firepup Freedom Fighters:

Cantwell’s exchange idea works to meet both the political and immediate social needs if and only if it were available to everyone. This incremental approach to a fundamental social and economic problem that is at it’s root structural does nothing but maintain a massive reserve of poor and underserved people while bleeding the rest dry and focusing political energies of the middle and working classes on maintaining their own safety net at the expense of the poor.

There is still a window here to build on Cantwell’s idea and amend the bill on the Senate floor to include it in a more muscular form. As I have said before, the White House is NOT gunna whip for ANYthing until the Democrats get their shit together and put a real bill together…if the Dems stand firm and put together a bill with a muscular “public” exchange mechanism ,the White House will be forced to whip it’s Blue Dog minions to vote cloture. The White House muscle can get a real public option passed through cloture but not if the Democrats don’t put a bill together and force the White House to do just that. Remember that Obama looses if there is not a bill and he looses if there is an inadequate bill, the secret is to stand firm and force ‘im to get in the fight.

KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE AMMUNITION, DON’T WAIT FOR SOMEONE ELSE TO DO IT!!

“medicare advantage without medicare?”

sorry, can’t get excited about this. yet another case of calling something a specific term not actually making that thing what they call it. MA is little more than a boondoggle to insurance companies, it’s more expensive and less efficient than medicare. i know, “it’s impossible” to do something like “medicare for all, period.” but there are far to many “i hope” and “in time they’ll improve it” and “it coulds” in the logic required to support something as unnecessarily complicated and inefficient as this is. several experts with long experience working on health care policy have already demonstrated at the level of the states: incremental “change” does not work, and it does not lead to better, cheaper and/or more widespread care. it does lead to increased inefficiency, higher costs, and pissed off voters who punish the parties and politicians who effectively raise their taxes and make things more complicated.

Good news in the house
http://www.dailykos.com/storyo…..ers…

Watching Dylan Ratigan with Cantwell this morning. Ratigan a fierce advocate of choosing your own healthcare: why is Congress so willing to protect big business and big unions instead of the people?

status quo = serfdom says I

I believe that the strategy for folks like Schumer and Cantwell in the Senate is to get the least garbage out of Baucus’s grip and get a Senate Finance bill into the mix. Then we will have to see who is most stubborn — Harkin or Baucus. Once a bill is on the floor of either the House or the Senate, people start having their names on it. Names that voter, not just lobbyists, will remember.

We’ve been so focused on the markups because of the fine “inside baseball” work that the FDL team has been doing. The public isn’t quite there yet, although the public debate is over and the public option won. It is now totally a matter of persuading Congress and a matter of the public knowing that they need to make their voices heard and not just the professional voices of lobbyists and astroturfed call-centers.

It’s time for us to solidify the House Progressives (once again!) and have them put pressure on Nancy Pelosi to get this legislative train moving the moment the Senate Finance Committee reports out its POS.

As I get more information about Cantwell’s “basic health plan” amendment the more I like it.

It’s called ‘droid rot — the condition that leads one to this conclusion.

It’s time for us to solidify the House Progressives (once again!) and have them put pressure on Nancy Pelosi to get this legislative train moving the moment the Senate Finance Committee reports out its POS.

Check the link at 14

In an article linked to in this morning’s Swim, it says that the system Cantwell has proposed didn’t turn out so great in her home state.

I mean only to imply that the fully modified amendment was improved over the original amendment. It added a minimum medical loss ratio of 85% for example.

I still called the amendment (if it is instead of real reform) at best a strategic retreat.

The main problem is that in Washington state it is funded by the state and states must balance their budgets. There is a greater need than there is money. Under Cantwell amendment it will be funded from a special trust of money given to the state by the federal government. This should hopefully at least address problem.

Remember, there are still 4 bills other than this one with strong public options.

none of the bills have a “strong” public option like what hacker originally proposed. in fact, i don’t think any of them even have a viable public option as currently designed. as i understand scarecrow’s position, the hope is for future improvement. while i respect his pov, it is not one i share. my position is much closer to chicago dyke’s above.

but my main point is that the current bills’ pos are not strong. more on that here, here and here.

Citizen TarheelDem:

EEEEdoggies, yeah THAT’s what I’m talkin’ about!!!! Foothillsmike has a link to the CPC whip count and it looks REALLY good, the progressives are puttin Pelosi’s ass in the line of fire and Harkin is tryin’ ta work to get a bill reported out of the Finance committee so that a real public option shows up in the reconciled bill. All of this is happenin’ WITHOUT the White House drawin’ fire…if the Democrats get their shit together and get a real public health bill together then Obama will be forced to whip a few Blue Dog Senators and, are you ready for this, HE WILL USE RAHM TA DO IT!!! God, ya gotta love it!!

IIRC even the horrible Baucus bill covers people up to at least 300% of FPL and other bills offer subsidies up to 400% of FPL. Does Cantwell’s proposal reduce the income level for subsidies to only 200% of FPL?

Also, why can’t the entire exchange be structured along the lines of what Cantwell is proposing. No good reason to limit it to only people making 200% of FPL. People eligible for the exchange could benefit from state negotiated premiums even if they received no subsidy. Substantially increasing the pool size to all who would qualify for the exchange would give the states more negotiating power.

New post up top…

Consider this option please…

“Though I believe that this may be an unpopular view, I view Dr’s the same way that I view govt. employees, and teachers: they are to serve the public good. They went to college, studied hard, got their degrees, found jobs, and made money. If I am understanding what you wrote, these individuals are just working at their jobs, or they are small business owners. They are not serving the public good, they are just in it to make a buck. I just cannot have sympathy for those whose only real complaint appears to be that they need to make more money.

What would the Dr’s have to complain about if the Health Care reform bill was to include the option for new Dr’s to have all of their College loans forgiven + malpractice insurance paid for by our Government if they agree to accept Medicare & Medicaid as payment in full for services rendered for the first 10 years after they graduate? The graduates could choose to be involved with this program or not. I believe that an approach such as this would work…2 birds – 1 stone.”

Yes, the health care for the poor of WA State is horrible. Those of us who rely on these services know that Gov. Gregoire is responsible for the SCHIP/Medicaid funds which are supposed to be used to cover the poor, not keep her donors happy. The idea which is stated above could work, if given the chance.

The time is now, and the dream shall never die. Medicare for all :)

It is funded by WA State using Federal funds. I’ve been here in WA for over 40 years. Medicare & Medicaid are Federally funded programs. If WA does contribute any finances, it is as little as is legally allowed.

p.s. As all of this boils and gurgles in the Congress, we are seein’ the difference between Clinton-Rahm on NAFTA and Obama-Rahm on healthcare. First of all Clinton triangulated democrats with the majority of Repulithugs while Obama is forcin’ the Democrats to get their shit together so that in the end the White House only hasta leverage a few weak-kneed Democrats. And that is the key difference between Clinton on healthcare reform in 1994 and Obama on it today…instead of putting a bill together outside of Congress and without the involvement of elected party leadership, Obama has tossed the problem to where it needs to be in the first place: right in the lap of the Democratic majority in both houses!! Whatever the Democrats put together, they and the White House will own it…remember FDR: “I agree with you now go out and make me do it.”

Well I’m a HR676 guy myself, but if that whip count in the House holds and we end up with Medicare +5 in the final bill, I will consider that acceptable for now.

thanks! good to see those numbers

But Clyburn (w/Pelosi’s assent) is pushing regional and pilot program crap that could peel some away from their committment to a real PO

Slinkerwink has an Action Diary on how we keep those numbers strong -

I agree -

Has anybody read T.R Reid’s book, watched him speak or see his PBS programs? If anybody knows how it works elsewhere its him. I agree this is much like the systems in Switzerland, Netherlands and Belgium systems of HEAVY regulation, though we haven’t gotten to the “Heavy” part yet (banning of pre-existing condition, forcing QUICK payment, etc) and I admit to not fully reading Cantwell’s add-on.

I would be in favor of a Swiss-style system of HEAVY regulation which would restrict profits of the health care industries, we could go further and make them all non-profits, like Switzerland, but no Republicans would vote for that and I’m sure anybody with insurance hq in their state would vote that down too.

We shouldn’t loose sight that this is not the final law as it will be written and the fight is not over.

Why limit it to 200% of FPL? Let anyone opt in, and we will see both cost containment and real reform.

Also, if it is such a good idea, why delegate to the states and repeat the whole AHIP/PHRMA vote-buying spree piecemeal in 50 legislatures? Do it Federally.

The article tells us that in Washington State, there are 30,000 people waiting to get in, another 40,000 bumped out, because they don’t have the money. That’s not the sign of an unpopular program. State budgets are hurting all over.

What Cantwell does is take 85% of the subsidies the Feds (under Baucus) would otherwise provide to everyone in the 133% to 200% of FPL tranche and use it to fund the state plan, and the state plan administrator negotiates directly with providers to provide the basic health plan services set by the state (in this case, by the bill).

By providing this funding source, that means all of the people waiting to get in (because there’s no money) would get in. Keep an eye of this one.

No. Cantwell doesn’t reduce the subsidy levels of people who are not in the 133% to 200% of FPL range. Those all stay the same. Her proposal only relates to that one tranche between 133 and 200% of FPL.

The feds would give each participating state 85% of the subsidies it would otherwise get for the entire class of people in that 133-200% tranche, and the state would take that pot of money to help cover (subsidize the premiums for) everyone in that tranche with the health care benefits defined by the “Basic Plan.” (Enrollees might be able to choose between Basic Plan A and Basic Plan B)

So here’s what the uninsured would have:

1. Up to 133% of FLP => Medicaid

2a Between 133% and 200% => State basic plan, if state has one; 85% of allowable subsidies go to fund the plan (Cantwell state plan)

2b Between 133% and 200% => if no state basic plan, then uninsured etc. choose from the exchange, with fed subsidies

3. All others => choose from the exchange, with fed subsidies

200 percent of the federal poverty level? That is way too low. It would mean that the working poor would have to choose between getting married and having affordable health care. With the new minimum wage two married people making both making minimum wage would be too rich for this program, even if they had two children.

http://aspe.hhs.gov/poverty/09poverty.shtml

Making it dependent on poverty also builds cherry picking in favor of the healthcare insurance companies into the program.

Majority means you don’t get a toe in the door. Majority, particularly in both Houses, means you get to come inside, sit down and have a sandwich and a beverage.

Unless, like the Democrats you do not actually have a majority. You have a fund-raising con designed to get rank and file party members to subvert their own agenda in the name of party unity and pay for the privilege.