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Ed Henry on CNN:
My colleague Dana Bash and I have learned from a source, each one of us, that this White House right now is very quietly in serious conversations with Republican Senator Olympia Snowe, a key moderate.
She is basically the last Republican out of those gang of six senators who have been negotiating, really the last Republican that has an open line to this White House right now.
What we’re hearing that she’s talking about with White House staff is sort of a scaled-back bill that would focus on insurance reforms that both sides could agree to, but would not have a full public option, instead, would have a so-called trigger. What that means in layman’s terms is basically that the insurance companies would have a couple of years to make some dramatic changes.
If they do not make those changes, then a public option would be triggered. So, it would be used down the road. They would hope that this would appease liberals by saying it’s not completely off the table. And the big hope is that this could bring along another moderate Republican, like maybe Susan Collins of Maine, some conservative Democrats, like Ben Nelson and Mary Landrieu in the Senate, who don’t want a public option, but would sort of potentially be open to a trigger like this.
That is just great. In 2008, we put a Democrat in the White House, delivered a filibuster-proof 60 votes in the Senate and a 79 seat majority in the House, just so. . . a Republican could write the health care bill.
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the insurance companies would have a couple of years to make some dramatic changes.
not to worry – I’m sure that there will be stringent oversight the entire way. A blue-ribbon panel of insurance company executives, maybe, who will report to Congress once a year…
This is too crazy. I’d like to see the trigger language. One person denied for a preexisting condition, or would it take 100?
and just who is gonna be responsible for making up these new dramatic changes and requirements? No way that that’s going to cause a fight, right?
Welcome back to Square One.
In which the WH deludes itself, and tries to convince others, that sharks will somehow learn to fly if only they are able to borrow some butterfly wings.
In a few years, they promise, their butterfly wings will be fully formed and operational.
They’ll keep their sharp, vicious teeth, and continue to be a marine species. But every shark knows that if sweet lies and false promises to grow butterfly wings enable them to continue their predatory ways, that isn’t too high a price to pay.
In a few years, they’ll be “Too Big To Fail” and so they won’t have to honor those promises about butterfly wings anymore.
And Obama will just be one more Pharma/K Street castoff in the annals of Corporate Profiteering.
Lunacy.
The trigger is very dangerous. It can (and might likely) be written to create a perverse incentive that makes health care more expensive.
Obama’s betting he can convince liberals in the house to vote for this. I’m betting he’s right.
This is a quote for a 44 year old single person, no dependents under Romneycare, what I am to assume will be forced upon everyone with no PO.
https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/ehi/Quote.fs;jsessionid=88C6E0AA1E4C809B3519E341E4146F0B.tc10a
“Trigger” is just the same horse of a different color.
The Kerry Trigger migrating north from Mass. to Maine. Don’t know how JH stays sane these days.
Man what a disappointment. I would suggest this if there is going to be any trigger (hell the damn thing doesn’t start now until 2013) then it is ’single payer’ and the insurance companies have to have a non-profit basic plan that is equal to the current average congress-critter and can’t be 10% higher than the Netherlands minimum plan. I mean shit let’s all just throw crazy against the wall and see what sticks.
No rate increases for the next 10 years or lets let them increase it 1% per year. Flat rates based on age but the difference between young and old is only 2x. The most a person should be required to pay is 8.5% of their total income inclusive of all co-pays, prescriptions, out of pocket, etc. Subsidies go all the way to 750% of poverty. All kiddos are covered by the government until they complete college (all levels … 26 yo or so) or secure full-time career employment. Private insurance companies that are allowed in the exchange must pay 98.5% of all claims and no one can be dropped from coverage – if the insurance company drops an individual and automatic coverage plan kicks in by the government and a fine of 10x cost of coverage is applied to the offending insurance company and the money is transferred into the past clients account. The insurance company if caught 3x are removed from the exchange and all their customers are moved into a government plan for safe harbor until the individual can make their own decision.
It’s a win because it’s a *moderate* Republican!
The Senate is broken.
Jane —
You don’t need a government option to do real health care reform.
Sincerely,
Mitt Romney
Oh, thank you! I thought I recognized the place…
Absolutely disgraceful!
What the hell does that mean?
Let me see. A trigger that gives insurance companies a couple of years to make some dramatic changes. 2010, 2011. Oh yes, the Republican majority takes over in 2011 because the Democrats so screwed up the healthcare bill that folks are paying gigantic increases in premiums. That two years.
I wish the Beltway gossips would dish who exactly in the White House is on which side of the argument. For one, I would be very curious as to where Valerie Jarrett stands on this, not her talking points but which side of the internal debate she is on.
And guess what youngsters? When healthcare is done, there is a bad climate change bill, financial industry reform, and…
Jane, you better keep this vote-whipping infrastructure in place, I have a feeling we’re going to need it on other issues.
Grrrr—
Profanity profanity profanity profanity.
I suppose they’ll get to litigate the trigger for a few years in any case.
Profanity profanity profanity profanity.
Stupid.
I think what needs to be made clear to the progressive caucus is to stand away from the President and any Dem leadership on this vote, particularly if the purchase mandate is still in it.
Because WHO CARES if the President won’t back you in your home district when all the people will be PISSED OFF at the President? Progressive Dems can run on the “anti-corporate give away/bailout” message and do just fine thank you very much.
Rahm can take his threats regarding support and shove ‘em. Because they’re as empty as this “trial balloon” and the attendant bill are.
Sure, what’s another 30,000 or so deaths so long as the insurance company stays fat and happy?
all he has to say is that there are only two options, and so they have to go for the one that is the Least Worst, and everyone’s conditioning will kick in and they can rationalize it to themselves and others.
and, plenty of the Congressional Pledge-takers can claim that there was a public option in the bill, albeit hidden behind triggers, and so what are you gonna do about it, then, ‘progressives’ vote for someone who doesn’t have a (D) after their name??! not bloody likely, so tough turkey.
Not a republican, the insurance companies are writing the bill.
This whole thing makes me sick. Obama wants his legacy to be changing the way politics is done, the so-called “bipartisanship”. Process seems more important to him than results. What a joke. He’s going to work himself into the kind of failed presidency Carter is tagged with.
I’m not opposed to discussions with Snowe. But why the Public Option needs to be dropped is beyond me. Has she said unequivocally, as Grassley and Enzi have, that a Public Option is a deal breaker for her?
Have the illegal immigrants yet been told they aren’t allowed to catch Swine Flu?
And, in case they do by mistake, they aren’t allowed to spread it to the rest of us?
“just so…a Republican could write the health care bill.”
Insurance and private health care corporate lobbyists are writing the bill. It seems to matter not which party is in the majority.
What Obama’s about to do to house liberals is the political equivalent of spousal abuse. He knows they’re not going to leave him, so he can go ahead and beat the crap out of them…once again.
I got yer “trigger” right here.
F*&k their trigger & their co-ops.
PO or bust.
If POTUS signs a bill without the PO, I won’t vote for him in 2012.
And I love the guy.
I had a low bar for Obama on the health care issue to begin with, since based on FISA and transparency and other issues going back months and months, his behavior indicated there would be a less than wonderful bill.
What I did not expect in my wildest dream was forced purchases of junk product which amounts to a regressive tax in my opinion.
My “astonishment at perfidy” level continues to educate me.
I don’t agree with TarheelDem. I don’t see that vote-whipping has done much good, but I might relent if the progressives (GOD, how I hate that term) actually stop this load of sh*t that’s headed our way.
The Democrats are aiming to enrich the insurance companies at the expense of Medicare and other programs that actually do some good. They will reap the whirlwind. At this point, I’m throwing in with the right-wing crazies, because stopping this entire process seems to be the only hope for not making things worse.
We are in such deep doo-doo. The Wall Street bailout didn’t fix a thing, and they’ll be coming back for more. Commercial real estate is collapsing. There won’t be any health care reform that matters. Neither corporate party is capable of governing for the public good, therefore our only “hope” is for a complete collapse that thoroughly discredits everyone in power.
Find a little place in the country, learn to grow beans and potatoes, get familiar with medicinal herbs, and pray. That’s about it. Stick a fork in us, we’re done.
I never thought that would be possible, but he’s heading straight for the rocks with a strong wind at his back.
*** A trigger that gives insurance companies a couple of years to make some dramatic changes.***
How many deaths will occur in that time? How many medical driven bankruptcies?
Just how many AIG’s can happen two years time? just how many trillions can disappear offshore in two years?
Turn up the looting!
My initial impression of Obama’s leadership derived from his first public appearance as a member of the senate judiciary committee in a hearing where there was clearly a right side and a wrong side, truth and lies, yet rather than supporting right and truth he attempted to play both sides. Somehow, I never really expected anything different from him as President, yet it’s still heartbreaking.
Whew. Ed Henry and Dana Bash…it must true then.
No matter, any chance to fly into hysterics about Obama is welcomed, just as it has been since, oh I don’t know, about 2007.
What a bunch of dicks. No more goey to the polls for me to vote for Dems.
Link isn’t working. How much?
A characteristic of a empire going downhill is the inability to change dysfunctional systems. Unfortunately, that phase of empire can last hundreds of years.
If only people could loot insulin, or chemotherapy, or lifesaving surgeries!
That would prove to me that healthcare was an economic rather than a moral issue. But that’s not the case now, is it?
Feh.
As Bill Moyers said recently. There is no difference between a Republican and a Democrat once they get to Washington. Both parties pay their allegiance to their money masters. We need to get smarter. As Jefferson once said.
“When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty”.
Obama just lost my vote in 2012. I may sit 2012 out. I am disgusted. I am depressed. I am…just BLEH.
Meet the new boss, the same as the old boss…
The Democratic party is blowing up. I think it’s dieing in front of our eyes. I’ve been a party member and worker and I’ve never had much time for Nader-ites or anyone else who claimed that there is no material difference between the republicrats and the demicans. But the Democrats, in Congress and the Administration, seem determined to establish that they are cynical, manipulative corporate shills. And that the rest of us are fucked.
Watching the Democrats has been like watching a horror movie, where the ordinary looking guy pulls off his rubbery ordinary guy mask and is revealed as a total fucking monster.
I really do not know where to go, politically, from here.
If we start today can we have a viable third party candidate by 2012?
Thanks for the calming influence, but you gotta admit it’s getting a little scary waiting for all this 12 dimensional chess to play out, don’t you?
I won’t leave the Democratic Party because it belongs to us and millions like us. I am outraged at what is going on but I will fight them down to the last bloody inch if necessary. These cowardly Dems in DC make me ill and why should they be allowed to trash our country. Nope, I’m staying.
Apparently we have become a nation of blatant minority rule.
Isn’t it a violation of election law that in the presidential contest of 2008 voters were forced to choose between two Republican candidates?
My feeling of late has been that in 2012 I will likely hold my nose (like I usually do) and vote for the Democratic nominee for president but I am so disgusted with Obama if he is on the ticket I may simply sit that one out.
so let me get this straight. The WH is allegedly negotiating with the Republicans through the person of Olympia Snowe, with whom most Republicans don’t speak. In other words, we’re not negotiating with the rethugs, but rather we’re resculpting a whole bill in order to get a single extra vote, since Snowe will be unable to deliver anyone else. I hope it’s worth it. Or perhaps Senator Snowe is negotiating on behalf of Senator Lieberman, CFL.
Yep, rule by the 23% if the AARP poll is to be believed.
In my district, we are back to 2004 levels on bankruptcy, despite the best efforts of the banksters to make it impossible to file.
It is actually quite interesting to see the Obama Presidency self-destruct in less than a year. Obama isn’t leading. He’s alienating everybody but a few corporate lobbyists who will ditch him the instant they see he’s a one-termer. He is pursuing the Republicans’ agenda and getting no support from them for doing so. At the same time, he is backstabbing all the independent and Democratic constituencies that came together to get him elected. And of course, it isn’t just him. It’s the vast majority of Democrats in both Houses as well. I have been repeating this a lot today, but we need to break with Obama and the Democrats. They stand for nothing that we do. They will stand for nothing we want. Let’s just accept this and move on. Obama is just a Republican wannabe. If he isn’t going to go the way 76% of the country wants him to go on healthcare, he certainly isn’t going to be pressured or influenced by us. Time to say screw him and the whores he rode into town on.
It’s not just Ed Henry and Dana Bash. The whole VILLAGE has been put to the airwaves to say essentially the same thing everywhere.
Mara Liasson on NPR, Politico, hell even frikkin AXELROD has been dropping these turds all over.
This is the way the Village communicates, peasant, and you will take it.
Unless something really, really extraordinary happens, and very soon, you will see that Jane is quite correct.
Sorry – forgot to use ‘Reply.’ For whatever reason, the link in 8 to a Romneycare quote for a 44-year-old isn’t working. So I wonder how much that is. Thank God I’m on Medicare in Mass.
Shorter Rahm: you will pry the last moderate Republican from my cold dead hands.
You know, normally I would give that kind of remark about these journo’s a great deal of consideration, but, just like many suggestions in the politico article.. it all fits the President Emmanuel Obama pattern to well to dismiss.
As someone mentioned earlier today.. Team O is quite able to quickly dispute of these types of articles.. if they want to be.
***crickets***
Yep, the corps and the rich. Did you just discover that?
As a result of technology or increased population (or other factors) the life cycle of empires has been greatly accelerated. In a historic context, I suspect the rise and fall of the U.S. will be comparatively quick.
Unless you forgot the snark tag, that comment is unfair as massacio has been featured on the front pages here about economic inequality.
And we will know the truth of it very shortly. It’s not like this is something that’s eternally unknowable that can be argued about forever.
We shall see. I tend to agree with you, and lord knows that being an empire ain’t done any good for the U.S., but there is no other nation or combination of them that comes anywhere near to challenging the U.S. role. So it could be a long long downhill slide.
And what would stop them from putting the changes in place, avoiding the trigger, and then just undoing all the changes and going back to the way things are now, except charging more than ever to cover the cost of switching rules and then lapsing back? In the meantime having seen to it that the Republicans are reinstalled in a few more Senate seats just in case (though why they would worry I cannot imagine).
These are people who hire people to scream about death panels in order to terrify millions of hapless peole. They will do anything up to and including murder to protect their power and wealth. You cannot ‘make a deal’ with such people.
I know, which is why I was so surprised at his comment.
Is there any doubt who has the balls in the Obama family?
The trigger will be just like the “we will revisit nafta if it doesn’t work” Remember that one?
Wasn’t Michelle Obama a health care industry ceo?
Wow. I admire your spirit. I will type out your comment out and tape it up and read it when I need to. Which will probably be often.
Talk about batshit crazy!
The GOP had Dems holding meetings in broom closets (literally) for cripes sake, and we’re rolling out red carpets and fine china to somebody who represents about 89 people.
Again, f*%k ‘em. Pass the bill and let’s get on with our lives with decent health care for a change.
F*%k the lobbyists and the insurance companies that pay ‘em.
If the bill sucks, then let’s defeat it and punish everyone that sold out in 2010 and 2012.
I’d rather continue on with the bull crap that exists now versus watching the insurance companies reap the windfall that would come with no public option.
What I was trying to say is this: after the 2005 amendments to the Code, the filing rate dropped dramatically. It is now back to 2004 levels, and heading to 2005 levels, which were extremely high. This is so despite the changes, which made it very difficult to prepare for a bankruptcy, and barred most people above the median income level from filing Chapter 7.
This is just great.
Obama, you dont know what HELL is yet. But you will.
When I heard Snowe talking about this weeks ago on NPR, she said if the reforms didn’t happen in FIVE or TEN years – then the trigger would be pulled. I remember the 5 or 10 years distinctly because it sounded so absurd.
I hate to think what the reaction will be. I’d rather have punitive regulations & taxes on insurance companies and nothing else. Delay was the best the Republicans could hope for and I can’t believe they may get it.
Look at the crap that Blackwater has pulled, and they just go their contract renewed. Why would anybody have any faith in this ball less
wonder, Barack Obama?
So many great things have happened already, and President Barack Hussein Obama is saying he’s just getting warmed up after first stabilizing things, which has happened. Now we can start on the structural changes, just exactly as he always said he wanted to do.
So I’m feeling pretty excited about changes in healthcare, since we’re so close to the biggest change in the system ever seen in my lifetime. Funny thing is, I’d bet I’m one of the most radical Liberals that hangs around here, and because of my radical views, I’m used to being ignored, mocked, and having to be extremely patient to get my chance, likely never seeing various goals achieved in my life, just as many great leaders on so many issues haven’t throughout history. Things have been changing rapidly since Obama’s been on office.
If Obama caves and doesn’t force a real public option, then I’ll be pissed along with you, but so far so good in my opinion. The only people I’ve been surprised and disappointed with so far is so many of my fellow “Liberals” who have been nothing but extremely negative toward Obama since long before he was even in office. They have been slowly sowing seeds of distrust and demoralizing, which is eroding our ability to get big changes done. I still think we’re going to overcome this, but it is making our jobs harder.
Jeezus…I’ve been having this exact same arugment for about two years now…what a waste of time…
Fortunately, overstatements of the blatantly obvious are merely venial sins. Good news for folks like me who do it so very often.
if we can believe ezra klein, which is a 50/50 thing, we, the democratic majority, and Obama are doomed – to a shitty bill, and probably big turnover next year
http://voices.washingtonpost.c…..e_hou.html
It probably will be needed often but we need to keep demanding that “change” thing.
1 million
Olympia Snowe for President. How could we lose?
The sick need not apply.
From her wiki:
Is there any doubt who has the balls in the Obama family?
I’m sure that in some universe that question makes sense.
A universe I hope to never visit.
Well said. We should get someone to run against every one of those darned Blue Dogs and let them know we’re here to take them on.
No link. No context. What gives?
is is along quote? the link isnt working
Not a CEO, but in administration.
FDR was our last successful President and he died in office nearly 55 years ago. Vietnam with Johnson and Nixon, Reagan and Bush I with Reaganomics, Clinton with the Third Way, Bush II and Reaganomics revisited, and now the developing disaster of Obama. We have been on the slide for a long time. Our economic status has been plundered and wasted. Our values have been trashed. And our military is being ground down in senseless, endless conflicts. In the end it doesn’t need a major storm to take down a once mighty oak that has rotted to its core a gentle breeze will do.
I often wondered in the eighties and on what would happen when most of the jobs had finally been shipped overseas and the boomers were heading towards gummer time. What is happening now is what I feared. They are coming for grandma and she is me.
Me, I’m more the mortal sinner type.
Yep, looks like FDR might have been the peak of the U.S. empire. We could still have another century or two of sliding, though.
i plan to remain a registered democrat also, why not influence the primaries where we have some power, but DONT expect the “democratic” party to be the vehicle for any real change. I hope we all remain very active and committed in progressive politics. there are other parties, and other progressive organizations that are fighting the struggle. we shouls ALL be hooked up with those. the fight is escalating and this is just a sign of things to come. plan to see more and more laws written by corporate lobbyists and passed by the same dogs that come beggin us for money every two years.
Yeah, I suspect my being agnostic would probably render the other factors moot.
Good post mortem by Gene Lyons in Salon.
Read it and weep.
let’s call the trigger the “put the bonus back into the bottle” provision. The bonus being all those windfall insuranceco profits and the CEO pay packets to go with….
Why do we need anyone to replace the American empire?
I was raised R.C. Certain concepts are unforgettable, even a half decade after my conversion to atheism.
At most they can screw up my life for another 40 or 50 years at most (probably less).
In my 4th grade science class we watched a film that suggested our planet might only last another 4 billion years (apparently the theory at the time). I can recall that the news filled me with a sense of panic…
Try to see the positive in this. The empire is collapsing and it can’t survive much longer.
When the class warfare if over and the capitalists have won, when the people and labor have been turned to slaves who live a life of struggle and suffering, when their dreams of betterment are no longer possible, when even credit to fake the appearance of upward mobility is gone, when nothing is left, the millions can go gently into the night or fight and destroy the tyranny parading as democracy.
When the fact that they have nothing left to lose and no options, they will rise up and the overlords with been driven from the land. That can’t come soon enough.
My sentiments exactly. So what is your suggestion for the current U.S. empire? Dismantle it? How? (BTW, empire was a strong goal of the founders, towit Louisiana Purchase, Monroe Doctrine, so the concept of U.S. empire is as old as the nation.)
Heh.
I have another 15 or 20 years to go. Don’t know if I can tolerate it for that long.
I think we should have something ready for after Obama’s address to the joint session next Wednesday.
Probably 3 somethings; 1) for if he actually gets unequivocal about the public option, pro or 2) con, and 3) if it’s vague, as I expect it might be, considering he/Rham want the fingerprints of “others” on this crime scene.
The responses, imo, should be in the cases:
1) Yay! (and I’m really doubtful of this case)
2) Screw you Mr. Prez
3) Put your political capitol where yer mouth is
that seems overly pessimistic, i would say 25 – 30 years
if she won
Not at all.
I’m primarily in your camp, and share in your disappointment that Obama gets taken for granted on the many issues he’s handled well so far.
I did appreciate your words @36; I just wish he’d get out front on the public option and lead.
Unlikely, we humans have already exceeded the planet’s carrying capacity. Even with depression on the near term horizon, oil, water, and other commodities will be sorely stressed. We are looking at a world population of something like 9 billion by 2050 with a likely collapse in succeeding decades. We could have as little as 10-20 years left as a diminished and diminishing hegemon. It is interesting to note that Jefferson thought it would take 500 years for the continent to be settled from coast to coast. The transcontinental railroad was completed about 65 years later and the frontier was declared closed within one century. The 21st century will be the most tumultuous not just this country but our species has faced since the last Ice Age.
What nation or group of nations could supplant the U.S. in 15 or 20 years?
hopefully everyone will hold onto their determined sentiments in the coming election years, when the keening about what terrible ogres the Republicans have running becomes deafening.
hold on to your pride and only vote (D) if they have a proven champion of your values in your district.
otherwise, fuhgeddaboutit.
Lyons is good, but I wish he had found some governing rhetoric instead of campaign rhetoric as his examples of invoking emotions. But FDR and Truman successfully governed making striking changes-the New Deal and the construction of the Cold War national military architecture. Yeah, Truman suceeded well enough that we have to figure out how to change it again to meet challenges smaller than a Cold War; that’s called rightsizing the military-industrial complex; you would think all the deficit hawks would be all for it–billions of savings, trillions over 10 years.
I dont think the insurance industry takeover of the govt is anything to feel positive about.
Perhaps some or all of the narco states we’ve created?
1/2 /s
I don’t think america will look anything like it does today in less than 3 or 4 years.
We’re running on fumes. I am certain there will be military clamp down met with lots of street violence. If the military goes with the fascists it will be a slaughter. Sound weird? It will happen. If they go with the old constitution all the corporations will be dismantled. Then things will be different.
oh we’ll get replaced by somebody or, more likely, somebodies. Incipient globalization, global syndicracy, and corresponding de-stateization failed, or, more correctly, were optical illusions concealing incipient but potentially tectonic shifts in old fashioned geopolitical power and the decline and corporate takeover of one single government – ours. Now we’re left with may very well prove to be the wreckage of a great nation, a bankrupt economy and treasury, and a hopelessly corrupted government.
50 years from now, some interesting lessons will be taught in schools of governance and public policy – in Delhi, Beijing, Brussels and Brasilia. Those lessons will not talk about democracy, liberty, pluralism or “American value.” Rather, they will speak of the consequences of hubris, imperial overreach, unbridled systemic corruption and institutional failure, as seen through a long series of failed superpowers, from Rome, to Ming China, to Hapsburg Spain, to Soviet Russia, to our own country.
OK. I’m sitting out 2012. Not voting. I see no point.
Heh. C+ for Creative thinking.
let it die.”global” capitalism cant survive. there will be no markets left to “grow” into. no one with money to buy their products. no resources left to exploit. how can a system that requires infinite growth survive? that dosent exist anywhere in nature as far as i know
I admit to be a complete imbecile on the subject of economics (among other things) but I can imagine a cascade of states declaring bankruptcy.
This debate is interesting because it effects almost every American. What will they do when they get kicked in the face by the admin and the congress?
Will they do nothing?
Will they vote the bums out?
You could have regional aggregates, like Europe, North Asia, and India which could challenge American power through the backdoor, monetarily and economically. Also we need to take into account how fast we can fall due to the stupefying self-destructive efforts of our elites.
Let it die is not a plan. How would that happen when so many are fighting for its to live? It’s a wish expressed as a plan.
They’ll do nothing. The real crunch on medical care is still ahead. Josh Marshall had a note a couple of days ago about hearing that a lot of corps are dropping or significantly scaling back their medical benefits soon. That could bring the crunch nearer, but it won’t be until a supermajority of the population faces unpayable medical bills.
So much of this is a series of feedback loops. We are now on a self feeding death spiral. It’s the economy which will be the undoing. Capitalism consumed itself. It did what it wanted – got all the wealth from workers and destroyed labor and the meddling middle class.
We’re only waiting for someone to turn off the lights.
We need two things.
Public financing of elections and tons of birth control.
Well said, Kelly.
That’s what actual legislators with a conscience – rather than Party order-takers and sycophants masquerading as members of an independent branch of government honorably representing their constituents – would do.
The semi-anonymous leaks yesterday and today about the White House dropping support for any public option at all appear to be the set-up for the big Obama sell of a trigger next week. [Surprise! Don’t those earlier downer leaks make a trigger sound GOOD in comparison, as intended? In their dreams.]
Another way to describe what CNN is reporting here is that the United States Senate has ceded all of its legislative authority and our Constitutional self-governing prerogatives on a vital piece of new legislative policy to one Senator and the Executive Branch, operating in secret, without the slightest public objection from anyone in Congress to that complete subversion and bastardization of our federal legislature – aside from public criticism about the likely outcome of that subversion (rather than about the subversion itself or about those in Congress who have silently facilitated it). And next Wednesday, on the evening of their first full day back in session, Obama apparently plans to stand in front of the Senate and House and show them who’s really boss, out loud and in public – doubtless to thunderous applause from His Party’s openly-taunted, obediently-whipped subjects.
Maybe, do nothing,same as always.What happened to the last Dem Prez(Clinton) who out-sourced Manufacturing Jobs like crazy & told us ,it would be “good for us”,we & our families even though no comparable jobs were created.
Well he is still being greeted like a Rock Star on occasion even though,most of our futures & our families have been hurt beyond belief by Clinton’s out-sourcing.
Since public financing of elections would require Congress to act against their own self interest I doubt we’ll ever seem more than kabuki on that front.
The cost of medical care is now staggering. An MRI is $2,000 a dr check up is $500. No normal family can pay this. Insurance is backing out of paying. Serious illness = financial ruin.
We are living in an insane world.
Um, excuse, Bill Clinton passed the unpopular, totally partisan Omnibus budget reconciliation policy, which was without a doubt the most progressive policy to pass since LBJ. He used all his political capital on it, and Gore had to come in to cast the deciding vote. I’d like to see Obama show a sliver of the courage that took.
Serious illness = financial ruin and/or death from lack of care.
I am disgusted by the Republican policies of Obama and the Democrats, but my primary criticism is that they are not going to work: Afghanistan is not going to get fixed by us, at some point Geithner, Summers, and Bernanke will run out of money to prop up the Ponzi-economics financial system, and the economy will collapse shortly thereafter, and whatever healthcare plan they go with will be a sellout that won’t control costs and that system will hit the wall as well. None of this had to fall out this way. There were and are reasonable, workable solutions to our problems, but if Republicans and Democrats screw things up long enough, this may stop being true. As it is delay will only increase the costs for the failure of our elites to fix these problems or step aside so that others can.
All or nothing. We’ll take nothing and start the second american revolution. We have a system which does not represent the needs of the people. It has failed. It really has by any objective measure.
The only way to make a difference is to hit them in the only place that matters, their pocketbooks. I can afford private health insurance, barely; that is, with a $5000 deductible & an hsa that is always on $0 & to never incur needed medial care unless for serious or life threatening illness. In other words, I pay the premiums, but get nothing in return – the way they want it. If a public option fails, I plan to cancel my health insurance [although it is a serious ethical dilemma to cancel my spouse’s coverage]. I call on everyone to cancel their health insurance if they pay for it. I know it is unlikely that a serious boycott could be mustered, but at least I will have done my part to end this madness. In this way, the rich will be a little less rich & the burden of increased cost to maintain the profit margin will be borne by them not me.
What a bitter irony that Republicans raised the specter of “death panels.” Republicans (and many conserva-Dems) have no problem with “death panels” so long as they are comprised of executives from private insurance companies.
Too bad Obama and Axelrod didn’t predicate a successful first term on an issue on which they could have more easily prevailed, like victory in Afghanistan…
in 15 or 20, only China can, but that will not be a stable end state, even in the plans of their strategic planners. The eventual balance, in, say 30 to 40 years, will, to my mind, more likely be a fragile but ultimately lasting multipolar dynamic, with poles in Russia, Europe, Brazil, possibly Indonesia and hopefully India (although not without some serious and quite possibly bloody structural reforms). The US, weakened, may be among this group but only if it hasn’t fractured into constituent republics by then – an outcome that cannot in good faith be ruled out). There is a strong likelihood that this multipolar order will consist of fundamentally undemocratic states – loosely authoritarian but not totalitarian. There is no guarantee that what we now know as “democracy” will survive much beyond our current generation… ‘cept in Taiwan and Switzerland ;-)
There is always the “I demand” to be treated and do not move. Literally turn medical care into a right.
What would Doctors do?
You can find positives for almost any President. Johnson had the Civil Rights Act and the Voting Rights Act but he also had Vietnam. Clinton’s legacy is looking more negative all the time in terms of its trade and financial policies that have done so much to bring us to where we are now.
So sad that I can’t even put up a counterpoint to your observation, because that’s exactly what happened last year.
Same thing they do to Medicare recipients now, give really half-assed treatment that only inadvertently results in an occasional successful outcome.
“so many people” are fighting for lots of things, including “to live” so join the fight. .. it is a wish that the american empire will fall, its also an inevitability. you need a plan…is what your doing now working for you? if not do something else.
..and California. Purely out of nostalgia and wishful thinking, I will posit the dream that in 40 years a free Cali will be the last bastion of democracy… diverse, plural and fair in a world of authoritarian states;-)
Here’s a cost nightmare:
on Aug 9, my partner CJ admitted to me he had this pain in the gut that he really thought someone should see. I said “Should we go to the ER now, or are you ok with Urgent Care in the A.M., what? What should we do?”
He said go in the morning. We called his primary doc at 8:00, who miraculously had an opening at 11:00. Wasn’t 20 minutes in the office and they were walking us across the parking lot complex to the ER at St. Luke’s Presbyterian. We hit the ER.
They rule out ultra-life threatening stuff right away, and order a CAT scan.
Long story short, it was diverticulitis, and he’s ok. But the costs were amazing. Out of pocket that day was only $200 between the co-pays for everything, including the $100 ER admit. But the EOB’s are arriving and they’re amazing.
The total cost of the day’s care, from 11:00 in the morning at the primary docs, to the total ER bill , where we left at 4:30 in the afternoon is $8,211.00
The CAT scan is billed in 2 parts: $2,964 for the scan, $1,776 to interpret.
CJ just didn’t want to go to the doc for a “stomach ache” that lasted 2 weeks, until it got to be real harsh on him. And he’s still freaked that it was $8200 bucks.
Because CIGNA is demanding PROOF we do not have other or additional insurance, this claim is not paid.
The state of the insured…OY!
The title of this article sounds like an Onion headline, but it isn’t.
79 seat majority in the House, and 60 votes in the Senate. In other words, an overwhelming mandate from the American people for Democrats. So naturally they capitulate and let a Republican write the bill.
Obama is, essentially, throwing over tons of progressives votes for one measly Republican vote. What an ass.
Thank god I don’t have that many more years and I have no children. I will never set foot in a hospital.
Appeasement much? Give em an inch and they want 10 miles. The only thing that works is a public option with good numbers to support it (we all pay premiums, stupid) and good reform of the insurance corpse to require their cooperation. Otherwise, it’s a windfall for them and doesn’t do anything about costs, never mind saving lives. This president better wake up–there are no Republicans who will not sell our children into an early death for the money they can make off of their suffering. And that especially includes the Blue Dog Devils who reap huge donations from the same companies trying to protect the status quo.
Because CIGNA is demanding PROOF we do not have other or additional insurance, this claim is not paid
As if that should be any of their business. If you had multiple carriers..and chose to claim one, that’s your business.
which is precisely why insurance reform – including single payer – will ultimately fail without underlying cost-growth containment. As long as the unit cost of services continues to have double-digit cost growth, eventually system nationalization will have to happen… or both the system and the wider economy will eventually fail. A properly run hybrid system with a strong PO might have a shot at compelling substantial cost and productivity improvements but that will probably be too little too late. Costs need to not only stop growing but probably be rolled back 10 to 20 years, in order to bring us to the same productivity and efficiency levels of most of our OECD competitors.
That CT would take about 30 seconds to interpret and about ten minutes sipping coffee to dictate.
At least Rahm won’t see a second term in the WH. Now to keep the little bastard out of congress. It would be nice if Isreal refused to hire his lobbying services as well.
WTF Obama, we believed.
Private health insurance companies have seen this coming since the Clinton years, if not before. Giving them two more years or saying BS like keep them honest… well it’s just infuriating.
Apparently Dems have not yet figured out that the voters prefer real Republicans to GOP lite.
Good-bye Dems, if you don’t get it together.
Possible yet prior to 2013, look for a huge tax increase as well as downgrading medicare benefits just to apply the reform.
Is this why it is mostly middle class 40+ ers at these town hall meetings?
Peace
Agreed, Supreme court should ban all capitalist from a profit. Doctors now. Farmers later, way to many hungry folks on the planet to tolerate greedy farmers. Government must control all.
ah. I see that our friends the paulista trolls have arrived. Isn’t it past your bedtime?
I’ve watched Obama bail on FISA, do nothing about DADT, appoint Goldman Sachs shill Tim Geithner as Treasury Secretary, Rahm Emmanuel as Chief of Staff, and get us deeper into Afghanistan.
Call me shrill and immature, but I have a pretty good body of evidence that this Presidency is going to be a loser.
My daughter knocked herself out on her bike and spent four hours in the e.r. at Marin General. The bill was….wait for it….$25,000.00. She didn’t have to pay any because it happened during a triathalon for gym class at the local college. And that was two years ago.
I am tired of these White House political neophytes thinking this sort of “compromise” is the same thing as a principled stand. It most certainly is not. It is flagrant political cowardice by just deferring the heavy lifting of difficult decisions down the road two years.
I realize that political gains are frequently made incrementally, but not in the context of this issue. The Obama Administration is cowering before entrenched corporate interests and empowering morally bankrupt Republicans. What the hell does the GOP need an opposition party for when the leader of the current one is more than willing to give these mendaceous frauds credibility even when they brazenly come out in public to proclaim they will never support a public option? Give the GOP some credit, at least they have the balls to tell you where they stand!
This foolish compromise is a sellout that simply delays the inevitable. It is a telling tale in how broken our political system really is.
Progressives should have nothing to do with this act of cowardice and must act in solidarity for the benefit of this nation.
That is just great. In 2008, we put a Democrat in the White House,
From the evidence I’ve seen to date, Obama is no Democrat. If he allows any fucking repuke to write this bill and water down or do away with a public option that will be the last straw. When I think of how much money I gave and time I worked because I thought Obama would rise above all this crap, I was stupid to believe he would keep his word. There is no democrat, or republic, there is only the corporation and lobby. We are so fucking screwed.
If Obama does this he has shamed America, Ted Kennedy and the memory of his own mother. My heart is broken for what America has become.
The contents of the taped telephone conversation between President Lyndon Johnson and the chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee, Wilbur Mills concerning the politics of passing the original Medicare legislation in 1964 is instructive.
Money graphs:
Yup, past bedtime, got to go to work for one of those blanking capitalist in the morning.
Jane – my personal and heartfelt thanks to you for all you tried to do. You are a true hero and great American patriot.
“blue dog devils” i like it
Let it be said That Senator Snowe is the only Republican on that committee who is not pandering to death panels. Credit where due, her thoughts are as bipartesan as it gets.
Bernie Sanders for President!
Obama seems as determined to have a one-term presidency as Rahm Emanuel and Harry Reidless are to deliver it to him.
We don’t need no stinkin’ bipartisan bill. We won’t get it without giving away the guts of reform by heavily subsidizing privates while failing to affect even minor improvements in the garbage they sell as “health insurance contracts”.
The GOP will torch it and use its failings – which they will have insisted on having – to claim that neither Obama nor the Democrats can run a government or reform anything more substantial than what’s in their lunchbox. If Obama insists on this tortuous, self-inflicted, sure-to-lose scenario, they will be right.
“…insurance companies would have a couple of years to make some dramatic changes.”
Yes, two years to rake in more record profits, not change a thing unless it ups their profits, and two years to lay the ground work for an even more conservative government with the populace pissed off with hapless Democrats, two years to get the rules changed so there is no trigger. Two years for more people to die due to lack of health care!
Better the netroots get clear on the corporate bottom line of this admin–really, the pattern is already clear, but now it’s crystal clear too that there’s no ‘keeping the powder dry’ or 11th level chess-mastery going on.
PUMA’s can take heart…turns out there’s not a dime’s worth of difference btw Hillary and our Hawaiian chief exec.
With the sorts of problems we’re facing right now…we’re in a world of trouble. As Cenk Uygur puts it very well, we knew Obama was a politician all along…but now it’s clear the mantle of ‘leader’ many hoped went with the politicking…that part was campaign rhetoric.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8xHD2yAWWc
GREAT COMPROMISE OBAMA!
Democrats really are like battered housewives. The Police come to the door, then the Dems hide their black eyes and say:
Dems: “Shhhh, he’s sleeping now. Don’t disturb him. Everything’s alright. I promise to have a word with him in the morning. I’ll try not to make any noise to disturb the neighbours.”
Police: “But there are people here with some serious concerns.”
Dem: “But I’ll deal with it my own way.”
Police: “But we’ve been here before and you said the same thing and it never works.”
Dem: “It will this time.”
Remember the election promises last year?
This quote is taken from here:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/…..-Big-Table
What happened to that?
As we’ve all been told, framing the argument means winning the argument. No one is better at the frame game than David Brooks. In his recent column, David characterized the public reaction to President Obama as follows: “…if the president is proposing it, it must involve big spending, big government and a fundamental departure from the traditional American approach.” And “If Obama agrees to use reconciliation, he will permanently affix himself to the liberal wing of his party and permanently alienate independents.”
Let’s look in David Brooks’ frame? The rough numbers are 25% Conservatives, 35% Liberal and 40% ‘Independents’. So, Brooks says to President Obama, give up your 35% and battle the Repubs over the 40%. Probable outcome, here’s the math: Obama gets 20% (half the ‘independents’ – probably not, but for the sake of argument) and the Repubs get 20% plus the Conservatives, another 25%. Final tally: Obama 20, Repubs 45. Judging from the White House ‘leaks’, Obama and team are going to jump right in the frame, take the sucker punch – and, I predict – go out like a light. So, Brooks has framed the game, and he wins!
Obama’s lack of leadership (now, we have to say ‘tardy leadership’) and) Obama’s bad political decisions (sacrificing his base, among many others) should just about finish off what’s left of his presidency and the Democrats majorities. What remains will be slowly eroded away, as we hear about the bonuses to financial companies (approved by Obama’s White House Czar), doubling down on the pointless and wasteful war in Afghanistan (Obama’s ‘new strategy to win in Afghanistan’), and the continued dithering on the real economy, with workers continuing to lose their jobs and not finding new ones, under-employment, diminished work hours, declining incomes, loss of homes, lose of health insurance, etc. This is the reality; some Obama’s ‘fault’ and some not.
But, Obama should not look to his ‘base’ for help. On health care, Obama has chosen, apparently, to follow David Brooks’ and the Republican directions and turn his back on his base. (Good luck winning those ‘independents’.) Well, David Brooks framed it & Obama claimed it. Obama loses.
Republicans outsource writing legislation to corporate lobbyists and Democrats outsource it to Republicans WHAT!?
Can we ask David Swanson to post a guest post on how budget reconciliation could be used to pass this with 51 votes?
I have long believed “change is good”. Ever since that McDonald’s ad campaign propaganda brainwashed me into believing it. But then, I also believe the big “M” out front is in honor of my name. Heh.
When a Republican anti-reformer said he couldn’t trust government Barney Frank said nobody expected him to.
When you say we shouldn’t ‘expect the dem party to be the vehicle for any real change’ I certainly expect you meant to say the Democratic Party and I say I agree. We shouldn’t ‘expect’, we should demand and we should push for what we want. That’s the political process in America.
Hope is good, but hope alone isn’t enough. And in the moment of need there is an overwhelming need for leadership and good followership. The urgency of NOW requires action.
“supplant us” as what, world leader, resource hog, diversity, productivity, or…?
i told all of you so
the demos are weak very weak
they somehow someway were born without a spine
register independent
the demos no longer represent the middle class
this is all just a cover to get reelected
too much money in health care for the politicans
if we cant make mega profits off the sick and needy what good is capitalism
i have a lawyer friend making tons of money off bankruptcy cases most due to medical costs
stick it to the middle class they love their capitalism then whine like babies when it screws them
all those people whining about health care where were they when clinton was pres
now they whine told you so even hillary told you what would happen no one believed her
and i am no hillary fan but she nailed this one
Are you all waking up to the meaning behind Obama’s Chicago School background yet?
You will.
Well…yes! It if was a conservative Republican it would look entirely different.
Clear proof of who’s running the show: insurance companies.
Maybe it’s time to stop pressuring Congress and start pressuring the companies who tell them what to do. I’m not sure how to put the squeeze on insurance companies, but if we figure that one out, we’ve got a chance.
Congress = Death Panel
[bangs head on table]
not change I believe in or support.
I don’t understand. I love this blog I read it everyday. And everyday I read a headline similar to the one above. Why don’t the progressives and libs have their own strategists working on a coherent, coersive plan. Politics is like a chess board. WHO IS IT THAT is coordinating our efforts and voices, our money and the execution of our plan for some greater consolidated good? Instead all we get are whining and headlines like the one above. The progressive blogoshpere needs to have a meeting of the minds. People like D. Kos, Howard Dean, Racheal Maddow, (hell I don’t know) need to sit at a big round table and coordinate. All we have is this patchwork of voices that don’t really get the job done. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: Progressives need to draw their line in the sand, move their troops to the front line, make viable threats, raise BIG TIME donations to follow through on those threats, and then FOLLOW THROUGH!! Those threats need to go directly to the Obama Administration. Collectively, 65 congressional democrats have drawn their line along with the AFL-CIO. We need to get with those people and COORDINATE! Then if the PO fails we ALL COLLECTIVELY start dissing this administration and throw our weight behind our 2012 Candidate!
JANE HAMSHER I LOVE YOUR BLOG BUT ITS TIME TO STOP THE WHINING AND BAITING AND GET THE JOB DONE. NO MORE HEADLINES LIKE THE ONE ABOVE, INSTEAD ONE LIKE THIS: “AFL-CIO, PROGRESSIVE DEMS AND LEFT BLOGOSHPERE GIVE OBAMA ULTIMATUM” I know I’m gonna catch heat for this post but dammit wheres the backbone?
There is an option, always off-the-table, that would achieve all the expressed goals. The rest is simply manipulation to bring profits back to big health insurers – remember Harry Reid who is for a public option as long as it’s not operated by the government?
Spreading democracy, we have government hired and government paid for sadistic mercenaries in Afghanistan. Reforming health care we will have government hired and government paid for profit-driven health insurance mercenaries.
So, that’s what a majority of Democrats ‘buy you’.
When the Dems say ‘they had no choice’, remember, the choice was rejected. There is a single payer option that will achieve savings, universal coverage and put more health care dollars directly into health care. Put it on the table.
There is no way I’m accepting any triggers! These rats at the insurance companies have had more than enough time to do this, even over the last 16 years when Clinton tried to get it done. If Obama doesn’t demand a public option after traveling around the country for 2 years telling us that he would, he and the Democrats are finished! While I seriously discount anything these “journalists” have to say with their “source inside the Whitehouse” garbage that are nothing more than blind items that belong in a gossip column, I’m still willing to wait and see what the President has to say. But, if they allow the minority party to dictate their healthcare legislation they will be dead. I’m not willing to support a party that would be so spineless! The Democrats need to lose their serious case of Stockholm syndrome and lead! Snowe and the rest of her tiny party can go to hell!
That nationwide call for everyone to drop their health insurance to break the insurance companies and stop feeding the beast doesn’t sound so crazy now. Why continue to pay premiums to the companies that are using your own money against you? It isn’t too late to boycott health insurance companies and suddenly cut off thier funds. If everyone who wanted TRUE health care reform is really about 70% of Americans – and they all suddenly called their insurance company today and said we’re dropping our coverage – that would be significant.
What changes are you referring to?
If everyone just sticks with pressing for the Public Option, no one should fall prey to the Snowe job that is coming along.
The idea is to be firm without writing the administraton off.
I am convinced that part of the Republicans strategy is to jam things up so much that the core Democrats do write it off.
Why hasn’t anyone been comparing Romneycare to what is going on in San Francisco? There is a big difference in approval ratings and effects on costs and it’s not in the direction the WH seems to be going. So much for believing in evidence-based decision making.
“Give the GOP some credit, at least they have the balls to tell you where they stand!”
This is why I don’t buy the “vote for the dem no matter what” thinking. I actually feel better about people who tell me in advance they are going to screw me over for corporate interests to those who lie to me in addition to screwing me over. And as long as they know we won’t be leaving them, they’ll continue to take us for granted.
I just keep thinking that a program with mandates and no public option being celebrated as health care reform is like legalizing slavery and then celebrating corresponding drops in unemployment. They have to pay a price for this if it goes down that way.