Comments on: Democratic Poll Slide Over Health Care: Might Not Mean What They Think It Means

By: cinnamonape

cinnamonape — Thu, 03 Sep 2009 05:01:33 +0000

We already censor some political speech. Foreigners cannot make political contributions. Yet a corporation can??Even one that might have foreign investors, CEOs, foreign investments that strongly influence their politics -e.g. if the run oil extraction in Saudi arabia, or own newspapers in Jerusalem) and others that certainly serve “foreign masters”.

Corporations can’t vote, run for office, aren’t born, aren’t “residents”, etc. In some ways your pet dog (which at least is a biological organism within the Mammalia) is more of an entity than a corporation. Yet one certainly can’t contribute to campaigns…but the other, an abstraction, can?

BTW The Supremes have long held that “commercial speech” is less favored than “political speech”- in my view what a corporation does is commercial speech…they are trying to make a buck, get contracts, sway government officials to help a commercial entity. That’s why they often make contributions to both candidates…to gain influence. It’s a sophisticated form of bribery.
What we really need to do is restrict political contributions and influence to citizens…not ephemeral groups of individuals that make up a corporate collective. Then we need to allow even-handed access to the organs of speech (papers, TV, radio) amongst citizens.

By: mercury

mercury — Thu, 03 Sep 2009 04:49:37 +0000

Ha…I just sent OFA an email saying the exact same thing. Not one more cent from me until the bullshit stops.

By: airmaster2

airmaster2 — Thu, 03 Sep 2009 02:49:25 +0000

Agreed, Freedom of speech must be regulated. Corporate Speech, Political Speech must be censored and suppressed by the government. Only individual speech should ever be allowed.

By: jsardo

jsardo — Thu, 03 Sep 2009 00:56:23 +0000

If Obama bails out on the public option, I will not waste another vote on a Democratic candidate. Here that Rahm.

I will write in Ralph Nader even if it is in memorium.

Ralph you were right as always.

By: letsgetitdone

letsgetitdone — Wed, 02 Sep 2009 21:32:46 +0000

Yes, we do need to overturn Supreme Court decisions that have interpreted the constitution to give the rights of individuals to corporation “legal persons.” Once that’s done, we can regulate corporate “speech” all we want, without infringing on individual freedom of speech.

By: miguelmas

miguelmas — Wed, 02 Sep 2009 21:24:00 +0000

At least LBJ got the Civil Rights Act passed… and he sure as hell knew how to grab Congress by the cojones and make ‘em get HIS agenda passed… non of this bi-partisan make nice crap…

You ought to read Doris kearns goodwin’s bio of LBJ… and remember, Bill Moyers was his press secretary..

A flawed giant of American history….

By: letsgetitdone

letsgetitdone — Wed, 02 Sep 2009 21:23:11 +0000

Come on, he’s already had plenty of chances. What is it about an inadequate stimulus package, a bailout of the corrupt financial industry, protection of the torturers, and waffling on cap and trade and health insurance reform that you don’t understand?

By: OldFatGuy

OldFatGuy — Wed, 02 Sep 2009 21:22:06 +0000

Man I wish I could read those.

EDIT: I mean I can, if I go to my laptop, but I’m just never on my laptop much anymore.

By: letsgetitdone

letsgetitdone — Wed, 02 Sep 2009 21:19:29 +0000

I agree with OFG. See here, here, here, here, here, and here.

By: Rayne

Rayne — Wed, 02 Sep 2009 21:02:17 +0000

Look, I personally find you to be trollish. Here’s the answer you are choosing not to find on your own.

The problem isn’t that unions can’t “provide” any benefits to their members.

It’s that legislation and the Supreme Court have whittled away at the rights and powers both individuals AND unincorporated groups of individuals have had. (Bankruptcy trumps the Wagner Act, for example; instead of assuring that benefits which workers have invested in are held in a locked box, they are seen as an asset of the corporation and eaten by liabilities.)

After years of attack, the only entities which consistently have rights and power are corporations.

Unions and individuals alike cannot count on either precedent or law at this point in time, until a change has been effected across both Congress and the judiciary, a sea change in people who will uphold the rights of individuals and groups of individuals.