HELP!

Why does Obama want us to stop pressuring Blue dogs?

I also ask, because like anyone here, I have trouble believing anything Ceci Connelly writes on health care. I wouldn’t believe her if she said that blood is red.

Obama is no longer leading this fight — he sees himself as the mediator, and he may very well have said these things to congressional sources, who may very well have passed them along to Ceci.

But what Ceci writes her sources tell her Obama wants shouldn’t influence what we do, should it? I mean, our activism stands on its own without his guidance, right? We have representatives, they should represent us, and we shouldn’t compromise our own constitutional right to redress of grievances just because Obama is quoted saying “Slow down.”

He’s the one who told us, after all, that “Yes We Can.” So, “Yes We Will.”

I ask, cuz I wonder if the WH is simply resigned to using the budget reconciliation route, and bypass breaking the filibuster.

This may be approaching the point where we will force Obama to do what we want.

You are absolutely right that Obama views himself as the mediator, I recognize all the signs because I was(am?) the mediator in my natal family. I gather that’s an unusual role for the eldest, but it’s the role I had.

I think you may be right, Jenny.

But it won’t be the first time budget reconciliation has been used to pass important health care legislation. EMTALA was passed via the budget reconciliation route; so was SCHIP.

If we have to go that route, we will go that route. I can’t say that I’m a fan of doing it, because I believe that legislation should be as clean as possible. Budget reconciliation is a very dirty process.

Jane,

Dr. Linda Farley, one of the founders of Physicians for a National Health Care Program said “The uninsured die because they don’t have insurance.” She also said “The doctors who have been on the front lines can tell you there’s only one real ‘public option.’ It’s single payer.”

I believe the Whip drive is noble and needed but can you convince me that the criteria of nationwide on day one and answerable only to Congress and the people will plug all the holes if a lesser than single payer public option is created? Will the criteria give any interim program enough legs to withstand the certain onslaught from private insurers with their pants full of Congress Critters?

I don’t want to settle for a public option with canines unless they’re set in the jaws of a Pit Bull. Once they bite, they don’t let go. If we settle for less with the hope for more, I want some insurance we’re going to prevail in the end.

Thanks for all you do.

Jane, you are so right. Obama is disappointing in many ways, but he’s still susceptible (otherwise he wouldn’t be complaining about progressive pressure). Thanks so much for your efforts.

Re strategy (as in maggiesboy # 6), having followed your posts for a long time I trust your judgement on what is most likely to be useful. The legislative sausage grinder is a complicated machine, and you have to be in the know to tell which levers are likely to give results. Jane knows!!

Linda Farley is correct: the right public option is single-payer in some variant.

Unfortunately, our Congresscritters (especially in the Senate, but in the House too) are showing that denial isn’t just a big African river. As my barber is fond of saying, “Money talks and b*llsh*t walks.” The health insurers have money in mind-boggling amounts, and they funnel it to their Friend$ in Congre$$.

It’s impossible to convince someone of facts when her job depends on not getting it. The Republicans in Congress (and way too many Democrats) believe that their jobs depend on not getting it. The Republicans worship the God of the Free Market, I’m not sure which idol the Blue Dogs worship. The net result is that it appears to be impossible to get a single-payer bill out of Congress.

I can’t guarantee that this strategem will work. I can guarantee that this is just Round 1 of the fight.

I’ve been drilling on this for weeks on my little internet radio show. I don’t believe we’re hitting all the right buttons. There’s no use talking about the influence of money, that’s not going to make it go away, but there are more “pressure points” we need to touch.

For example, do you know the CBO has never run the numbers for a real single payer system? They haven’t done it because their bosses in Congress:

- Finance (H-Barney Frank, D. Massachusetts; S-Max Baucus, D. Montana)


- Health, Education, and Labor (S-Ted Kennedy, D. Massachusetts)


- Budget (H-John Spratt, D. South Carolina; S-Kent Conrad, D. North
Dakota)


- Appropriations (H-David Obey, D. Wisconsin; S- Daniel Inouye, D.
Hawaii)


- Ways and Means (H-Charles Rangel, D. New York)


- Energy and Commerce (H-Waxman, D. Los Angeles)


..haven’t asked them to. Now, why oh why, wouldn’t they want to know that most likely they’d find single payer would be cheaper to pay for than the current most costly system ever known to mankind that still leaves nearly 50 million with out coverage, twice as many under covered and ranks 37th in the world?

Admittedly I’m not savvy to the beltway bullshit and I have full confidence in what Jane’s doing but I keep having questions.

I gave up trying to understand the lack of empathy in any elected official who can hold the position that health care is privilege and not a right, I’m trying to understand their lack of humanity.

We’ve got a lot of work to do!

…health care is privilege and not a right, I’m trying to understand their lack of humanity.

of course it’s a right – you just gotta pay for it.

(don’t try to puzzle through the logic of that one at home – unless you happen to live in D.C.)

If this country doesn’t get publicly financed elections, we’re all gonna spend the rest of our lives tilting at heavily fortified windmills.

To: President Obama,

You told us you wanted to be pushed. So we’re pushing. What’s with the pushing back?

You hold the White House. Democrats are in the majority in both houses. What the hell is the holdup here?

Was the change you campaigned on the real kind or the chump kinda change? Enough flowery rhetoric, now’s the time for real action.

If this country doesn’t get publicly financed elections, we’re all gonna spend the rest of our lives tilting at heavily fortified windmills.

Bottom line.
Final answer.
Move to the head of the class.

They’re important people and we aren’t. [/s] They don’t want to remember who’s actually paying the bills for their perks, either.

I’d suggest catapulting incendiaries into the windmills, instead of tilting at them. Much more effective, and easier on the folks outside.

…the “right kind of activism” works.

That’s true. I was watching “After Stonewall” last night and I think we can all take pointers (and heart) from the gay rights movement’s struggles over the years. From a condition of closeted silence, they have achieved so much.

If we adopt in our own progressive struggles some of that same spirit of continuous and proud and joyous gay rebellion, we will succeed in gaining greater recognition for progressive ideas in government.

But I think people care about this one and are ready to engage in a protracted battle. This is important to a lot of people

uh yep -
Watch these Iowans ruin Grassley’s lil meet n greet. Usually a warm and fuzzy wherein he talks about farm subsidies and pork – 09, not so much :D

But I think people care about this one and are ready to engage in a protracted battle.

i am ready to fight for single payer comprehensive and universal healthCARE or for any policy that makes economic and political sense. but i will NOT fight for a policy which i think is more than likely to be an insurance industry bailout at the expense of ordinary americans (see public option, see mandate).

and i will most certainly NOT join a fight that continues to exclude and marginalize the very people who both understand the policy issues best and have been in the trenches fighting this fight for years already just because they happen to think that single payer is the policy option that makes sense.

I ask, cuz I wonder if the WH is simply resigned to using the budget reconciliation route, and bypass breaking the filibuster

Well Step One might be getting Obama [and Rahm] off this “I’d rather have a crap bill that passes with 61 votes than a good one that sneaks through with 51. But mostly what I want is one than garners 70 votes”

Worshipping at the altar of “bi-partisanship” is so build in to their way of thinking that they can’t see the big picture. I don’t know if it’s Obama [and Rahm] looking ahead to 2012 and figuring out what will look good on his resume or what. It can’t be what’s best for the country.

Mauimom,

this dfh is starting to think it isn’t so much bi-partisanshit as it is the vaunted ‘Independent’ vote – I am no Nate Silver but sadly it keeps matching up with polling on every issue to date

If this country doesn’t get publicly financed elections, we’re all gonna spend the rest of our lives tilting at heavily fortified windmills.

Brilliant. Can you say this in a way that will fit on a bumpersticker?

Can you say this in a way that will fit on a bumpersticker?

If you haven’t already become involved with Change Congress, you may want to do so today. Publicly financed campaigns is what they are all about. Lawrence Lessig’s current video Change v2 is full of “bumper stickers”, and they are just so damn interesting to watch.

It’s why Maxine Waters should get high marks & support from the “Librul” following.Just think back to the 2000 election & her pleading on the floor for one member, Dem Senator to sign an affidavit to suspend & investigate Bush becoming Prez.Not one Senator had the gumption including BBoxer.But moreover,Waters can be counted on to always support the progressive platform with her all.Her enthusiasm for ordinary Americans can translate to caustic on occasion but she will go to bat for progressive agenda with hesitation.Kudos to Maxine Waters.Hey! folks remember who went to Connecticut to campaign for Ned Lamont,Maxine Waters.Remember to went to campaign for Joe Lieberman,Barbara Boxer.Well.Well,well.

cbl2, can you explain more?

Thanks.

10,000 yards of piano wire, a few thousand bankers and insurance company executives, a lotta lamp-posts, and we’ll have ”change we can believe in.” Until then, bleat about the plutocrat written Constitution and wish things were better.

By the way, Marcy Winograd, who’s challenging Jane Harman’s seat again, is flogging Harman with ads highlighting the incumbent’s refusal to co-sponsor John Conyers’s HR 676 single-payer bill. Also, Winograd is pushing the point that, whatever gets passed this year, states must have the option to supplant Obamacare with their own single-payer systems.

Mo better doesn’t get mo better than Marcy.

No maggiesboy, thanks for all you do. You are obviously far wiser than me. We quit. It’s all up to you single payer folks now.

What is your plan? Let us know what we should do to support you.

Thanks for this, maggiesboy. Will that do it? Is that enough to make single payer a reality? Or is there something else you’d like us to be doing?

Do Rahm and Obama think that their contempt for opinion on the left is helping to move the Blue Dogs in a progressive direction on health care (or on any issue)?

I agree. Pressure should be put on those bosses in Congress responsible for getting CBO to run the numbers on single payer (H.R. 676). Single payer is not just the right solution it is the best and cheapest. The numbers need to be put out in public, which, in effect, already supports it. Then it would have to be discussed.

I think selise is right and that the danger is that progressives will be corralled into fighting for a “public option” that is a figleaf for entrenching the insurance system for good. Obama couldn’t have more clearly set out his stall as a shill for the insurance industry and the “free market”.

Yet Grassley will be reelected by a wide margin, so what’s the problem here?

The problem is that the single-payer people aren’t calling their congresscritters, so guess what? We won’t get either unless they feel the heat from us.

If everyone here who said “why aren’t we pushing for single-payer?” spent five to ten minutes talking on the phone with their congresscritters’ office staff, we might not get single-payer, but we’d be closer to the public option — which is infinitely better than what we have now.

The problem is that the single-payer people aren’t calling their congresscritters

you have any evidence to back this up?

i think you are completely wrong…. for example, i’ve been calling my congress critters for months (especially on the call in days), and in the past i’ve been told by the person answering the phone that they are getting lots of calls.

They are calling them (Friend of mine works for Sen. Menendez), but they’re wildly outnumbered.

A lot more people than we think are concerned with the survival of the insurance companies, the survival of their own plans, and skeptical of government insurance…they want change and are willing to pay for public insurance assuming they’re not forced to use it (which single payer would do).

But my friend tells me single payer advocates are calling, but are outnumbered by those who are concerned about taxes, spending, deficit and immigrants.

the public option — which is infinitely better than what we have now.

p.s. what public option?!!? it’s not clear to me at all that any old public option would be “infinitely better.” i’m calling for the whip operation here because i’d rather see progressives in congress vote against a crappy bill that makes things worse and turns the public off the dems and healthcare reform in general.

thanks for the info. do you have any info on calls in support (or against) public option?

No maggiesboy, thanks for all you do. You are obviously far wiser than me. We quit. It’s all up to you single payer folks now.

What is your plan? Let us know what we should do to support you.

If I’m so wise I’d be the one with the world famous blog, giving speeches in Sweden and be a regular in the national media. I’m sorry my post was misconstrued, I was just trying to point out what the physicians at PNHP were saying that the only real public option is single payer.

I was only looking for some assurance or insight as to how the 3 criteria were derived. To me they are perfect but I was only trying to find out how those 3 came about and if there wasn’t something else that might be needed?

I guess you didn’t see my earlier comment that a public plan should have canines [like you mentioned a few days back] but I want them set in the jaws of a Pit Bull. When a Pit Bull bites they never let go. I feel that strongly about it. I fear that any public option short of Medicare for all will be buried by the insurance industry.

I believe nationwide, on day one, and answerable only to Congress and the voters are the best criteria and when I think about it they pretty much fit the definition of Medicare for all. Was that the aim in the first place? That’s what Bernie Sanders says is our best hope at this point and I have to agree.

My plan is to support you, which I have been doing….even if I did get scolded I will continue to do so. [g]