Good morning Jane!

I don’t understand how you picked your Democrats. My representative, Hines, is not reported. You mention only 77 Democrats. What about the rest? As for being on the same side as the Repubs, politics truly makes strange bedfellows.

‘morning… will call after coffee…

er – the local news here in L.A. is just reporting that the war funding is back on track “after Obama personally assured them that the torture photos would never be released”.

wonder who put out that little press release? I KNOW the little news around here didn’t think that up all by themselves… “personally assured” – what an interesting turn of phrase…

Meek is running for Martinez’ seat in 10. He votes yes and he’ll hear about it.

From the AP wire this morning:

To reassure Democratic moderates who had balked at House demands that Congress not interfere in a lawsuit to force the release of photos of U.S. troops abusing detainees, Obama promised to use every available means to block their release. His powers include issuing an order to classify the photos, thus blocking their release under the Freedom of Information Act.

Off to swim in the great capitalist cesspool.

Be good to yourselves, and all other living things.

Namaste

oh, I see now… good grief!

Himes voted for the supplemental the first time. We concentrated on holding the votes we already had, and those who expressed concern over the IMF funding.

He’s in neither of those camps. May be doing a diary on My Left Nutmeg about it today.

I am in lock step with millions of progressives and liberals as the recent CNN poll shows clearly. The American people do not want those photos released. What we have here is a fringe minority seeking to use all the means they can, namely a technical knowledge of net roots activism, to misrepresent issues and threaten elected representatives to vote the way they want to.

Barack Obama is against you, Hillary Clinton is against you, Eric Holder is against you, Harry Reid is against you and Nancy Pelosi is against you and now the US Appeals Court has ruled against you — more importantly 62% of all Democrats and 6 out of 10 Liberals are against you.

What you are doing, throwing Obama under the bus while he is fighting for health are reform and trying to improve America’s image in the modern world is disgraceful.

Tell them that “cash for clunkers” is a stupid idea unless and until wages recover to permit people with clunkers to buy an energy-efficient car.

Tell them that we don’t like pure ineffective pandering on energy efficiency.

You are right – it is shameful… and shameful and criminal acts were done in my name – I want the perpetrators brought to justice. I don’t really care who is against me.

Do not feed…

I am ashamed of the extreme left some times. I am a different kind of Democrat. Thank God you are such a small minority.

In fact, Obama is simply saying that if Congress passes this provison, he can classify the pix which would end the argument. Why he lets it proceed is beyond me. Classify the pix and don’t endanger the troops

What is the matter SD? You can’t stand being intellectually humiliated any more on the facts?

Oh but they do endanger the troops. Odierno and Petraeus and Obama and Gates and Clinton say so — were you elected? Are you overseas? You know better?

Obama is not “fighting for health care reform” — he has just brought together all of the insurance and big pharma interests and has expressly ruled out single payer, which nearly 60% of the public wants. He’s thrown a meaningless sop (a public “option”) to keep us “socialists” who want single payer quiet. Mr. Bait-and-Switch, Mr. Flip-Flop.

And he is fighting desperately to keep the photos hidden because releasing them would demonstrate even more our complicity in torture and increase calls for investigation and prosecution. He’s not protecting the troops, he’s protecting the Village.

That is just so wrong. I believe Barack Obama personally would choose single payer. But, and this is why he is President, he is a pragmatic leader who understands that it’s better to get what you can than nothing at all. The American people are not served by anything else.

Didn’t know that. Here is the big problem with representative democracy. Himes ran as an anti-war candidate.

No, he clearly has stated why he doesn’t want the photos released. Everyone knows whats in the photos, rape, violence, abuse, etc. This is all about a blood lust and insatiable thirst for revenge among Bush-Cheney haters. I despise that cabal too, but I actually think about whats good for this country and not satiating the emotional needs of a few.

You display hierarchical thinking, an inordinate respect for authorities, the same authorities that have been wrong so many times before. As for pragmatism, it so easily degenerates into immorality. The right wing argument (torture one to save thousands) restates the old argument over the end justifying the means. (I don’t think it ever does)

As for the pictures, they are our reality. Change is not possible until you look your reality square in the face.

amen.

and to help me cope with the added aggravation redfish has so generously provided, i’m going to make an extra five calls today.

I have no inordinate respect for authority. I was arrested climbing the Pentagon walls on bedsheets during the Vietnam war. I am a progressive liberal Democrat who has come to under stand the reality that exists in this country. Namely, this will never be a far-left country. American culture is too deeply rooted in individualism and a myriad of other unique belief systems whose genesis comes from frontier days. We are not Europe and never will be.

It is far better to achieve moderate victories that are tolerable to the masses than to achieve nothing. It is extraordinary that Barack Obama was elected President and this country will be better for it. The environment, education, health care, gay and lesbian rights, who is on the Supreme Court, etc. etc. will all be better.

Pragmatism is reality. What is immoral is a narcissistic club that although they do not represent a majority in this country are trying to force feed a fringe agenda. That is immoral and I along with millions resent greatly that you do so with the possible result of insuring a one term Obama presidency and the election of Gingrich or Palin in 2012.

That! is immoral.

Good for you. And if you think that politicians pay one iota of attention to group orchestrated calls from either fringe you are more naive than I thought. Call away. You have lost this battle and you know it.

You keep mentioning getting arrested at the Pentagon. I guess the experience was the high point of your life with subsequent events proving it was all for nothing. I continue to hope, though I confess its gets more difficult daily. Pragmatism, like it or not, is the death of hope. Countries, like individuals, do themselves psychological harm when they try to sweep their crap under the rug.

I mention it because I choose to defend myself against those intellectually lazy people here that choose to label me a right-winger or a troll — just because I happen to take a different position on this and some other issues than they do. All my life experiences have shaped who I am and what I believe – and I have come to realize that moderation and political pragmatism is not the death of hope. It is the death of a foolish pie-in-the-sky belief that this is or can be a far-left country.

If you get one less vote you lose. And all your self-righteous positioning on morality won’t get a working person in Ohio a better health care option.

So have at me, I assure you I can take it. What bothers you is you know I am right and that I speak with the same voice as millions of other Democrats.

And one more thing — be honest as to why you want something. This new found love of law and order/the rule of law is just laughable. I have lived too long and I know what the left thinks about law and order. And if you are honest with yourself — so do you.

I agree you shouldn’t be labeled a troll just because you disagree. The fact is you do some sloppy thinking. I am not sure you speak with the same voice as millions of Democrats. Our big problem is the ambiguity intrinsic in the process. Progressives such as are present here, think they speak for the majority. I don’t know whether we, or you, do. A while back I asked Jane where my Congressperson Himes (I thought his name was Hines-guess I didn’t pay that much attention) stood. He ran as an anti-war candidate and voted for the supplemental. And so it goes.

As for the US turning left, the designations left and right provide more heat than light. Is single payer health care of the left? Does it mean the death of individuality? I don’t think so. You apparently do not agree. We are both entitled to our opinions.

What’s the status with Paul Hodes of New Hampshire’s second congressional district? He’s a well-known progressive. He’s not on the list.

Christy has a new post up on the front page if anybody is ready: “SCOTUS: Fundamentals Of Justice”

Was this post directed at me? I don’t know that anything I’ve written could be called a new found love of law or anything to do with law. I’ve been a lawyer more than fifty years. One thing I’ve learned is the law is what various individuals say it is.

Ekunin, you are correct, everyone is entitled to an opinion and I thank you for that very reasonable response.

It’s your right to judge my thinking sloppy, I make judgments of what people say here as well. I do believe there are millions of Democrats that see moderation and compromise as the means to a tolerable end. As much as those here love to attack the Blue Dogs and moderates; I think it is important to understand that they truly represent their constituents who are not as far to the left as you may be. And we surely would not have the majority we have in Congress now without them. And . . . they vote very progressively on some important issues. Just not all, and many here want it all.

Single payer health care is a great example. I personally am 1000% for single payer. I also know beyond a shadow of a doubt it will never become law. I think you know that. Barack Obama knows this as well, and is standing firm for a public option. As good as single payer? Of course not. Much better than not having a public option — absolutely! That is my point.

No directed at you personally – general comment.

I seem to be getting the runaround from my congressman. I have to call back at noon today because he’s en route to the district. When can we expect a vote on this?

As for the US turning left, the designations left and right provide more heat than light. Is single payer health care of the left? Does it mean the death of individuality? I don’t think so. You apparently do not agree. We are both entitled to our opinions.

If you ask me (which nobody has), the problem with many folks here is an inability to distinguish verifiable fact with opinion. Much of what is said as fact is, in fact, opinion.

If you are for single payer, you should not give up on it. So many of our expectations are self fulfilling. If you fight for something, you may not succeed. If you don’t fight for it, you will certainly fail.

arrested climbing the Pentagon walls on bedsheets

Can you prove that because I think it’s bullshit.

It’s hard to disagree with what you said emotionally. I just watch listen and think too much about politics to believe that single payer will happen. There is too much opposition – and not just from the GOP either. I think if Obama lays all his cards and chips on single payer – he will lose and we will be left with nothing. And a badly weakened President.

Not going to work SD. Have a good day.

Jane, I just got off the phone with Tammy Baldwin’s office to thank them for their principled stand. I told them Congresswoman Baldwin was “holding the Democratic party together” for a lot of liberals/progressives.

Am shocked at some of the names in the “yes” column – Barney Frank and George Miller! Who could have imagined?

“What I hear is that the Pentagon could well run out of money for [the war in] Afghanistan and I am not willing to do that,” said Senate Interior-Environment Appropriations Subcommittee Chairwoman Dianne Feinstein, D-Calif., who supports blocking the release of the photos.

Well, the good folks with VVAW will know of any incident involving bedsheets at the Pentagon. Seein’s how I’m a member I think I’ll check with them.

Plus I’m curious how one gets close enough to attach bedsheets to a 5-story building with outstanding security.

“We will probably have a bill that we will put forward next week along with the Senate, and my understanding … is that quite a bit of progress was made,” House Democratic Caucus Vice Chairman Xavier Becerra of California said Tuesday upon leaving a meeting with House Democratic leaders.

Rep. George Miller, D-Calif., Democratic Steering Committee co-chairman, said he was confident Democrats can get the 218 votes needed to pass the supplemental.

There were dozens of protesters who approached the Pentagon with bedsheets tied together (what some of us did on the bus trip to Washington). The intent was to symbolically attempt to climb the walls. My father and I and many others were arrested and detained and released that evening.

The Pentagon march was the culmination of five days of nationwide anti-draft protests organized by the National Mobilization Committee to End the War in Vietnam — “the Mobe.” But a singular spark was provided by the Youth International Party (Yippies), a fringe group whose leaders, Abbie Hoffman and Jerry Rubin, had announced that they planned an “exorcism” of the Pentagon. They would encircle the building, chant incantations, “levitate” the structure and drive out the evil war spirits.

“The crowd drawn to Washington for the March on the Pentagon and a rally at the Lincoln Memorial numbered more than 100,000. Mailer and Hoffman were among the 681 arrested, most for disorderly conduct and breaking police lines. More than 2,500 Army troops protected the Pentagon

“The Pentagon’s steps were spattered with blood. Tear gas was unleashed on the crowds. “People became frightened,” recalled Raskin, one of the speakers that day. “They began running every which way. At that moment, it turned into something else. A sense of chaos takes over.”

arrested climbing the Pentagon walls on bedsheets

Would it have been too hard to add the word “symbolically” to your statement?

I spent 3 years in the Mekong Delta with the Mobile Riverine Force and have nothing but the utmost respect for those who protested the war and/or left the country to avoid it. You don’t have to puff it up.

I don’t have to justify my writing style to you. But I’m curious why you went to kill innocent people on the other end of the world who never attacked us.

There is a new post up on the front page by Cynthia Kouril: “Update on the Albany Senate Putsch”

Jane,

The efforts on this Action Alert have been absolutely well coordinated. I have been humbled by the swift information turn-around. “That” element of this Action Alert has been quite effective in directing citizen action.

Thank you so much!!!