Dugg right here, please join me!

Carly also stated during the campaign that politicians were incapable of doing important and complex things like running corporations. Maybe as a failed CEO she still has enough to help run something as simple as the country.

Thanks, Teddy. How that woman could talk about $40 mill for failure with a straight face is way beyond me.

Remember when HP printers were the friggin’ gold standard? And were damned near bombproof? And cleaned themselves when you pressed a button (the “clean corona wire” function)? The old HP LaserJet II may have been the best B&W laser printer ever made.

Then HP started on its downward spiral.

Self awareness is not the wingnuts’ strong suit.

With the economy going to crap a failed CEO with a 42 million dollar golden parachute is the best the GOP has to run as Senator?
What no GOP movie stars want to be the new Arnold? Is being a GOPer in Hollywood no longer unfashionable, has it moved to unpopular?
Perhaps one step below Box Office Poison?

Lack of self-awareness seems to be her strong suit.

Do you suppose there was laughter in the hall?

Oh, no, there’s a wingnut in the Senate race already, Chuck DeVore, who must frighten the Corporatists mightily, thus this toe-test by Carly. DeVore is currently spearheading an effort to deny GOP coordinated campaign funds from the state party to any of the six GOP legislators who enabled last weeks budget deal.

So you know where he stands.

she’s just asking for a new asshole.

Jindal turns down Stimulus cash whe his people need jobs, Carly wants to run for Senator is the GOP trying to throw the next election our way?

Dugg Teddy!
I hope she throws her hat in the ring. Barbra will make mince meat of Millionaire Golden Parachutist Carly! I can’t wait to see another Repuke bite the dust!

OOPS! Dugg!

Yup, she ruined the product line, destroyed American jobs, and looted the company’s treasury.

Truly an examplar of the modern corporate pirateer!

iCarly? :)

For Carly, greed means more than $40 million. She’s jealous because men’s golden parachutes and bonuses are larger.

Please, God, make her run!

DeVore is currently spearheading an effort to deny GOP coordinated campaign funds from the state party to any of the six GOP legislators who enabled last weeks budget deal.

So you know where he stands.

The true believer in conservative ideas wing of the GOP is bucking the Corporate wing?
Sarah is leading the fundies and racists. Mitt I thought was leading the Corporate wing?
Is another player in the possible GOP civil war emerging?
Where I’m from the True believers in Conservatism Never buck Corporations.

Doesn’t CA always vote for glamour over substance? Isn’t that how Ahnuld and Raygun got to be govs?

OT I wonder the Dollar is devalued but if prices stay the same then taxes should go up. Taxes should be adjusted for inflation. The GOP screams taxes but they devalue the Dollar thus causing tax increases.

Didn’t HP lose half of its value under her misleadership?

Talk about handing your opponent ammunition. I am sure Sen. Boxer will come out with both barrels blasting!

Carly “Simony” Fiorina

Simony is the ecclesiastic crime – paying for a holy office or position in the church leadership. The term comes from Simon Magus [Acts of the Apostles 8:18-2], who offered Peter and John, the disciples of Jesus, payments for the power of the Holy Spirit, so that anyone he would place his hands on would receive miraculous cures and even eternal salvation. It now represents the giving of money for “spiritual things”.

The Corporate wing of the GOP likes movie stars as spokes people/puppets.
Reagan was General Electric’s spokesperson I’m not sure who exactly is backing Arnold.
But I’m sure the Corporate wing was behind him.

Well we did elect Deukmejian ;-)

I’m sure this sits on a piece of digital footage just ripe for a commercial.

And also Pistol Pete Wilson.

Narrow win against a mayor, according to his wiki.

Um, I don’t consider Carly glamourous by any stretch of the imagination.

Many Californians have HD teevee machines now, and high-def is not Carly’s friend.

And the corp wing likes corp types. Fiorina is both a public figure (though not a movie star) and a corp type. Two plusses for her. Though probably not enough to defeat an incumbant.

I thought that Caroline was a shoo-in for NYS senator. But then she opened her mouth. Seems like Carly has the same problem. But unlike Caroline, who quickly removed herself from the public arena, Carly can’t seem to get enough.

See my 29.

Wouldn’t know about the HD thingy. I have a $129 TV (i.e. small) that is about 20 years old.

Somehow my post lost the very helpful Peter Hecht Capitol Alert blog link from the Sacramento Bee.

Thats why I think she will lose big.

OMFG.

That’s such an egregiously bad argument that I have to wonder if Carly was set up. (”Here, we know you’re in a hurry for you hair and nail appointments, just follow these prepared talking points…”)

Really, how could she be that stupid? I think even children would know better than to throw rocks from inside a glass house.

Yep, you’re probably right. Days of stupid talking points winning votes is over for now.

I only wish Boxer hadn’t been such a big Lieberman supporter.

Let’s not forget Sneed’s contribution to McCain’s efforts last year, and her big mouth:

Carly Fiorina is reportedly in the McCain campaign doghouse for blabbing to an interviewer that neither John McCain nor Sarah Palin was qualified to run a major corporation. Barack Obama and Joe Biden are similarly unqualified, she added.

Talking about McCain’s tax package last year, she called tax hikes on wealthy Americans “palatable:”

In an interview, Carly Fiorina, a top adviser, explains that any tax increases on “middle- and working-class” Americans are off limits. She says if a bipartisan coalition is “creative enough” to fashion tax increases on wealthier Americans, that may prove palatable.

But she knows how to sell the product — Carly!

After her tumultuous tenure, she left the company as damaged goods, but one thing was always clear: She was superb at marketing—especially at marketing herself. She put herself in a company TV ad and appeared on numerous magazine covers, garnering many flattering profiles while her company was flailing. (During her five and a half years at H.P., she was on the cover of Forbes, Fortune, or BusinessWeek at least 10 times.)

Obama reports that Great Thoughts came out of fiscal responsibility conference.

Really, she’s throwing grenades, not rocks.

Stunningly un-self-aware. I mean, how can she even mention a forty million dollar payout without thinking, gosh, how much did I get, anyway?

Oh, and Obama had someone taking notes on those Great Thoughts, and he’s gonna give the notes back to the participants to get back to him to write a report.

I’m so glad there’s homework and report due out.

Mission Accomplished.

how much you want to bet that press release was written before the conference even started?

You can’t sucker me into that bet! It’s all scripted.

OT the Dow is lower again cutting Social Security and Medicare will cost Obama but make the GOP happy.
However the GOP won’t stop attacking Obama ending the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq would cut money and make the 70%ers happy.
If we frame it as a choice between saving Social Security and Medicare or fighting wars that Bush couldn’t win for years.
Plus it would be unexpected the Stockmarket will soar.

John McCain is gonna attack cost overruns in the military.

Obama sez cost overruns in military are top priority, and is already on to the helicopters costing as much as AF-1.

BTW, this is live on cnbc.

True but if Carly runs we can Primary her without worrying about giving the GOP a win. Now we just need a candidate.

Hoyer reports that ss panel was very productive, and lists participants.

Well, now he can say he’s had a Grand Bargain Summit and he’s waiting for the participants to report back to him on their views. So, yeah, I’d say Mission Accomplished – put the fiscal scolds back in their box for another coupla years, hopefully.

And: LEAVE SOCIAL SECURITY ALOOOOOOONE !

Thats the Bush helicopter deal right the deal Bush gave to Italy in a no bid contract in return for the Niger forgeries?
McCain is blaming Obama for a Bush no bid contract??
What a Dick!

Hoyer reports consensus on the ss objective and way to get there but doesn’t say what it was. He does tell us that it will give both seniors and young people confidence in ss.

Oh this whole thing turns my stomach. Think I’ll look for L&O rerun.

Obama sez health care summit next week, but he doesn’t have summititis.

With Hoyer saying it and your description I can safely wager this:

We’re f*ck’d.

Obama sez he’s gonna educate the public on these tough issues.

I sez I can’t wait for the brainwashing to begin.

Maria Bartoromo sez Wall St is very angry at what’s happening to the banks, as if the banks had nothing to do with it.

Carly Fifi stinks …

Obama’s workshop is also live on CNN!

I’m not getting a sense that this is scripted. I am a trained facilitator and the process that Obama described is NOT controllable which is why many organizational leaders will not allow this sort of thing in their shop because once it gets rolling the energy of the process will not be ignored: you must what real honest answers and have the courage to face them or you better not be using this kind of process.

Made me think of that stupid ”all past SoS’s” photo op that Bush had.

Obama is speaking off the cuff, clearly. And stimulating the others to do so as well. McCain looked like an adult.

LOL! and probably focus group tested too.

if obama wants to do something about the military budgeting and procurement process – he could put chuck spinney in charge. (link is to a podcast that is now over two years old, but still probably my fav of all the podcasts i’ve listened to)

cnbc guy sez Obama statements are incoherent.

Here is the link McCain is blaming Obama for a Bush scandal by lying and placing the blame on the Dems in the media first.
Someone in the GOP is worried they got McCain to make this claim on a high profile Obama press conference.
Way to get in front of a story what was Obama’s press people thinking. That question was a plant Obama picked McCain first and had an answer ready a good answer.
But still McCain got his lying version of the truth out there. Now we will have to play defense:(

http://news.newamericamedia.or…..5a217b3a40

p.s. re spinney. it will also make you laugh, which is not a bad thing… especially these days.

Your assumption about the process not being fixed assumes that the participants were randomly selected. Not true in this case. Even if these carefully selected participants were not given actual scipts, they all knew exactly what they’re supposed to say without the boss telling them. Anyone who graduated from kindergarten would know what to say in these circumstances.

He’s not blaming Obama. He’s saying that it’s resolution is on the agenda.

Please Digg it!~

that’s not what I’m hearing with my own ears. Obama is only incoherent if you brain is scripted. my assumptions are based on doing this kind of work and observing people doing it. because this is live on tv I can speak from my own observational skills. we’re not turning devils into angels here, but it’s radical. you can’t do this and keep all the same messages intact. attitudes are shifting: I hear it. it may not make a difference in the long run, but it’s a fantastic thing to try and do.

God Obama is creeping me out. Uses the same old lame joking demeanor that W used at press confs.

oh, and, people are never randomly chosen for this work: by definition. and it’s still radical. that’s the point. the same people, with a totally different approach. they have to participate to maintain their status. the old messages just cannot persist.

He implied it no mention of Bush.

My comment was incoherent. Sorry. What Wall St. finds incoherent about Obama is his economics: saying he’s gonna cut the deficit & switch to paygo at the same time as he signs the stim. Wall St. is right on this one. Either the economy is so bad that deficits don’t matter, or deficits do matter and the stim was a bad idea. Can’t have both.

well, i’m not creeped out: Bush was acting, Obama is not.

if I were in the room I would know that this client was having a HUGEly successful event.

Obama took a huge risk: that people would speak up in this setting and take a risk too and he won’t be able to shut them up.

He is uncomfortable selling this or unprepared? I’m not sure this could be his worse press conference ever.
Time to change gears go Left stop trying to sell stuff that the people do not want and won’t work.
No more half measures.

Of, forgot to mention, Baucus sez we’re gonna come up with a uniquely American health care sys.

I thought we already had that.

You’re the professional, but to this amateur it looks like kabuki, just like all the hearings that I watch.

oh, eCAHN, ok on the incoherence thing. there’s so much more happening here, I’m not going to worry about that for now. the guys at cnbc will have to take care of themselves. *g*

I cannot believe this is on my teevee. it takes balls to do this, really. this is the antithesis of controlling the message unless your message is that you want to hear everyone’s voices!

The only way Pay as You Go might work is if we end all our wars. Or Obama could really cut SS and Medicare big during a Depression which will make him a one term President.
I’m hoping he is hyping the Crisis and will use the political urgency to end the wars.
I want the GOP arguing to cut SS and Medicare just to keep more wars going with victory no where in sight during a Depression when people need the cash.

at the risk of getting jumped on… i’ve been saying for awhile that in some ways obama’s speaking style reminds me of bush when he first was governor of tx. at that time bush could actually speak in whole sentences and stuff (nothing like ann richards though). that’s why, i think, i never got all the excitement about obama’s ability to speak semi-well.

ok…. i’m leaving for a bit. so if anyone wants to give me a smackdown i’ll have to come back later to read it.

But there’s nothing different about the messages. That’s why it looks scripted to me. There’s no diversity of voices.

it’s not kabuki: or I wouldn’t speak up like this. AND he’s getting them to show it on teevee. these comments are smart and so far beyond the GOP talking points the pundits are going to be totally lost. this is good: we likey!

this is not like the hearings ~ the hearings ARE scripted like a play. that’s true.

LOL.

As someone who has done many of these, sometimes with High school kids acting smart and also many adults who have diametrically opposite views to mine on yoga/meditation, I think this is extremely courageous of Obama.

I also think he is doing well overall, though I don’t know enough about all the issues as the many great minds on this blog.

to me it’s a helluva lot more diverse than the msm gives us. i’m looking for any sign of daylight, i guess.

All right reader & Petrocelli. The process is different.

What about the results?

Selise ! We’re better for having you here.

Bush never sounded as smart as Obama.

Hopefully, Obama will never become as greedy and self- centered as Bush.

Where are the Lefts voices? Jane would have some questions I like. Pick the questioners control the agenda the press seems to want what corporate America wants.
Our ideas are not getting a hearing Paul Krugman being asked a few questions would change the dynamic.
Reaching out to the GOP seems to be the Meme. Either we stand for our ideas or we might as well go home.
Time is running out for Obama he has to swat the GOP soon or the 70% approval will fade.

it’s way ballsy, Petro. some of the people I work with freak out once this kind of process gets going … Obama is getting just what he wants and that is to find ways to break this whole damn mess wide open. I didn’t know he knew process-talk, either, until today! he knows exactly what he’s doing. it’s stunning!

Wolf Blitzer: ”extraordinary moment.”

cue the pundits. this should be fun.

That and the nitty gritty of what they are saying are better left to you, Hugh, Ian, etc. to opine about.

I think it’s great that he has these Repugs and BlueDogs on TeeVee airing their views. Cantor for one looked intimidated.

There were a couple of clips of W when he was gov of TX. I might see if I can find one. He was quite a bit more articulate than after he became prez.

Here’s the classic.

Things: I know what you mean and I am frustrated too … I think this is part of a bigger process that could make more room for more voices. There’s no quick fix. Getting the GOP to speak and act like adults would really help, though and this forces/encourages them to do so.

Reader @ 83 (my reply button seems not to work)
I hope you are right and I’m wrong

Yes, this process can never be tightly regulated … it takes on a life of its own, like another Organism and no two are ever the same.

It’ll be great to see more like this.

I am not surprised that Obama knows process-talk … the dude never looks unprepared. Even his stutter is intentional.

Can I puleeze watch that after I’ve had a few tipples, later this evening ?

Yep. That’s why it was so unsatisfying and so much like everything we keep hearing. No lefty voices. Outcome is determined by input, and lefties have no spot at the table.

I remember their nearly-drop-proof calculators, which started their path in consumer electronics (as opposed to the industrial lab-type equipment they’d been building for years).

Agreed we need more Left voices even one question from Paul or Jane could change things.
70% support our ideas and we can’t get one of ours to ask a question.

Make sure you watch it at some point. It’s an amazing comparison.

It’s a waste of time to get the Rs to act like adults. They aren’t. Ignore them, threaten the magic 3 in the senate, and do what’s right for the country.

I will, though I know his bumbling, fumbling act was contrived, so once the mess gets revealed, he’d have enough people claiming he was too dumb to craft such an elaborate scheme.

CNN’s Candy Crowley obviously thinks this is kabuki for the cameras.

Donna Brazile: ”talking to each other” to solve the problems, ”not at each other.”

And Castellanos doesn’t disappoint: all politics, all the time, ”wonderful bipartisan politics” in the room, not policy. yikes. The man has no clue. That’s scripted.

Post presser on cnn doesn’t sound like forward progress. Same old same old. Process may be different but results are the same.

Re: Wall St & Rs not being adults, here’s Santelli claiming that Obama is threatening him.

sCAHn @ 98 thats the best news that can help Obama I’ve heard all day.

Did anyone raise the fact that Crowley is a Lawyer, therefore her ‘opinion’ is that of an expert ?

Sorry eCHAN @98

well, we need a workshop for the pundits! seriously, a workshop at the wh is not going to change the pundits, or what they say/see: that’s the problem with the media. they are supporting their own view because it’s safe for them. Crowley doesn’t even see anything happening. Castellano is being sarcastic.

Blitzer says the ”wh turned into a think tank.”

Okay, I went ahead and watched it … do you agree with the prognosis, that Bush is suffering pre- senile dementia ?

what Obama is doing will only affect the people in the room!!!!!!! Not Santelli or anyone on tv. McCain may not look like an adult once he leaves the room. These are the rules of change and transformation: it’s slow and it’s not a straight line from here to there. And it doesn’t always work. It’s different, though.

Candy is dumb as a stone.

They’re going to hate this type of event because they’re not able to talk off the top of their heads, except to show how shallow they are.

I know nothing about the conclusion. Way out of my area of expertise. Just find the difference astounding.

I bet after a couple of these, most of these people won’t be peddling such strong opinions as they used to.

Rs get points for shallow among their voters.

I watched some of those Gov. debates, then lots of Dubya from 1999 onwards.

Unless Kirk Murphy or another expert says differently, I believe Bush’s bumbling persona was an act, like his Cowboy swagger and Ranchin’ …

Great point !

Cramer on Tweety is making sense a business guy is more Left than Obama?
I might not like his investment advice but he is the best TV business talking head.

they have spent the whole day actually TALKING to each other. imagine. kabuki is only sustainable if you line up to spout at a microphone/meet the press/congressional hearing. we at FDL talk to each other a lot which is why all this drives us nuts. these people don’t talk to each other at all. we see how stilted the debate becomes. i really am stunned to think of them spending the day like that. it really is a positive thing.

Reader @ 114 true getting them to talk is a good first step.

Oh well, if we have to start with teaching them how to talk to each other, then we’re really doomed.

See my 109, this is what I’m saying. If they are in a group of 6 – 10 and half those people have different views, they are forced to listen to other viewpoints rather than if they huddle with 6- 10 people who think exactly like them.

LOL … next even might feature Eckhart Tolle … *g*

Edit: Event, not even.

yup, Petro: you got it. When Obama was describing the event, that’s what I heard, that they were all mixed up with people they might have wished they weren’t with. AND leaders were designated, so McCain (e.g. as I heard) was in a group led by Nepolitano. The structure of this event was very, very serious group dynamics stuff. wow.

In groups like that, where everyone is getting a chance to speak and (again as I heard) notes are being taken by scribes for circulation later, you can state your talking points to start with sure, but you end up having to listen respectfully (again respect is part of the process and training of the leaders) and you can’t just keep saying the same talking points over and over. Maintaining your status depends on being respectful, collaborative, and creative! Or the group just leaves you behind.

It appears deceptively simple but it’s very powerful and not accidental at all. At the same time the product is very honest and authentic. AND people enjoy being and interacting this way, it’s deeply satisfying and that’s where the transformative energy comes from.

“Maintaining your status depends on being respectful, collaborative, and creative! Or the group just leaves you behind.” – reader

Excellent summation ! This is the best thing about the democratic process, to remain relevant, you must give relevance and reverence to others.

Maria Bartoromo sez Wall St is very angry at what’s happening to the banks, as if the banks had nothing to do with it.

Would she (and they) prefer Washington stay out of it and let the banks and the nation’s economy collapse?

Strange days.

What Wall St. finds incoherent about Obama is his economics: saying he’s gonna cut the deficit & switch to paygo at the same time as he signs the stim. Wall St. is right on this one. Either the economy is so bad that deficits don’t matter, or deficits do matter and the stim was a bad idea. Can’t have both.

The stimulus goes into effect and has the bulk of it’s spending in ‘09. The budget takes us into next year. I was rather hoping he would hold off on the budget for a few months, so we could see how the economy is going to respond to the stimulus. In any event Congress can adjust as we go.

Looking at SS and Medicare/Medicaid is to reassure people they’re hitting all the weaker spots of our economy to fix as many things as need it. The specifics of change get reviewed a bit more gradually than headlines.

The reason (IMO) he can assert we’ll get back to paygo is they had to commit to this to get 3 Repub votes for the stimulus and because our economy isn’t tanking because of the usual woes. It’s the stupid credit markets and toxic assets. Once those are sufficiently fixed the economy should rebound pretty quickly — hopefully before any negative effects of paygo might effect it negatively.

In short, he’s hitting all the right buttons, but maybe getting a bit ahead of himself with certain budgetary commitments. Cutting Defense spending is another one of those.

Sometimes timing is everything.

Have you ever heard of the ancient Chinese priestess of comedy: Ty Ming?

Time is running out for Obama he has to swat the GOP soon or the 70% approval will fade.

I suppose it’s hard to know which strategy will be most effective: crush them like bugs or just stand back and let them talk themselves into oblivion.